Do you want to see the Team 136 thing continue next year?
From what I understand that was a Brady Hoke thing he got during his playing days at Ball State, and was something that he carried with him when he was head coach at Ball St, took it to SDSU, and of course brought it here, to the point where teams past were retroactively called Team 65, Team 125, etc.
For the record, I thought it was kind of lame, especially the retroactive labelling. I especially didn't care for the number being prominently displayed on the student section shirts.
December 31st, 2014 at 3:00 AM ^
the better.
December 31st, 2014 at 5:36 AM ^
THis is small thinking. A good idea is a good idea. This small jesture brought an incredibly powerful label to future recruits and current players. What is the downside of having players associate with the history of the program?
December 31st, 2014 at 6:18 AM ^
I don't like calling Ohio State "Ohio," but I thought the numbering of the teams was great. It works especially well when you are one of the oldest programs in college football. Michigan was one of eight college football teams when they started in 1879. In Division 1, Michigan is the second-oldest team to Rutgers.
Hoke didn't get the results we wanted, but it doesn't mean he didn't have a few cool ideas. This was one of them.
Then again, Rule #1 at the Univeristy of Michigan, beginning December 30th, 2014, is to say, "WWHD." Jim Harbaugh will be the sole arbiter of all traditions and rituals, old and new, from now until he hangs it up. I like it that way.
December 31st, 2014 at 6:43 AM ^
Agree wholeheartedly with everything stated here....#1 WWHD and #2 I hope "Ohio" becomes Ohio State
December 31st, 2014 at 7:52 AM ^
The "Team 136" approach is a great reminder of the history of the program, and also underscores that each class leaves its own indelible mark on the program. As you say, just because Hoke introduced an innovation doesn't make it bad. RichRod gave us the BBQ at the Big House, Hoke gave us the Team 13#, and their relative lack of success does not make either idea a bad one.
I don't know that it needs to be as prominent as Hoke made it, but it's cool that each class knows its chronological place in Michigan football history. Coming back, it will be cool to have (e.g.,) Team 136 know that they restored the overall winning percentage and whatever other achievements they muster under Coach Harbaugh and his staff.
As far as WWHD, I'd mostly defer to Coach Harbaugh on matters of traditions. Certainly those traditions internal to the team are his call. But he's not infallible, and if he insists on (e.g.,) billboards on the field, I reserve the right to differ with him.* I've nowhere near the involvement that he has, but alumni and fans should always have a voice that goes into the consideration.
*Of course, that would be more of an AD move, but you get the point.
December 31st, 2014 at 8:08 AM ^
I think it has a great effect on recruiting and solidifying the guys who have pledged to Michigan. They aren't just a commit, they're part of Team 136. I think that's got to have some effect
December 31st, 2014 at 7:28 AM ^
The MAC coach learned it from Bo. You know, Bo Schembechler.
The same guy who coached, trained, raised our current head football coach.
But go ahead and slam Hoke, its the cool thing to do.
December 31st, 2014 at 8:26 AM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 8:27 AM ^
But go ahead and slam Hoke, its the cool thing to do.
So we're done with RichRod then?
December 31st, 2014 at 8:48 AM ^
Who is slamming Rich Rod now? He's a proven winner and Pac 12 COY.
I haven't seen anyone slam Rich Rod in a looong time. At least not without a huge negbang and 10 replies telling the poster to STFU.
The problem is, some Rich Rod supporters are too fucking sensitive, and whenever says something true...like "Rich Rod was awful when he was at Michigan," the supporters take that as a slam - no, it's just a fact.
So there's a little bit of a difference with Rich Rod, because for some people, if you're not kissing his ass, you're putting him down. For some people when they suggested we should've brought back Rich Rod ater Hoke and people said "HELL NO!" ...that was slamming him.
December 31st, 2014 at 8:58 AM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 9:42 AM ^
But not true.
Hoke supporters know that the team sucked. And there is no one on here defending Hoke for W/L's...NO ONE.
They defend him because he was a nice guy who recruited well and it seemed like a decent formula for success so they wanted more time to see it through.
Rich Rod on the other hand, his records got better. And you have the majority of his supporters (and non-supporters) who feel he was shafted and never given what he needed to succeed.
In the end, both coaches were terrible at Michigan.
Neither is a slam, both are facts.
December 31st, 2014 at 9:46 AM ^
...to Harbaugh's at Stanford. Here's what I found.
RR's record at U-M: 3-9; 5-7; 7-6
Hoke inherited that team and went 11-2 the next year.
JH's record at Stanford: 4-8; 5-7; 8-5; 12-1
I wondered whether Harbaugh was "awful" at Stanford. Two games is a mighty thin line between "awful" and Harbaugh's first three years at Stanford.
Then I realized how lucky we are that Dave Brandon or someone of his ilk wasn't at Stanford. No 4th year in Palo Alto means no 49ers job, etc. - then who knows whether JH even shows up on anyone's radar today.
December 31st, 2014 at 10:36 AM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 9:36 AM ^
Hoke learned what from Bo? The "Team 136" thing? Why would you say that?
December 31st, 2014 at 10:42 AM ^
Yeah, that Bo ... the MAC coach.
So many posters have absolutely no sense of Michigan sports history...
As for Hoke, he has a lot of good qualities, seems like a great guy, and was loved by his players. It's unfortunate that things didn't work out better on the field.
Hoke has probably forgotten more football than anyone on this site - contributor or poster - even knows, yet he's labeled as a numbskull by many. It's a free country and one can hide anonymously on an internet message board. He just MAY have had a good idea or two along the way, but acknowledging that is just ... not currently in vogue.
At least JH, our new savior, I mean coach, had the class and dignity to thank the Hokes for their contributions during his introductory press conference.
December 31st, 2014 at 2:51 AM ^
would love to see that continue
December 31st, 2014 at 2:54 AM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 3:31 AM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 4:09 AM ^
That's what I thought, that it's like what class # of BUD/S a SEAL went through.
December 31st, 2014 at 1:25 PM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 3:00 AM ^
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December 31st, 2014 at 3:03 AM ^
the "team #***" thing put to rest. It was cute at first, but quickly acquired a 'gimicky' feel to it. If the first 18 Head Coaches at Michigan didn't feel a need for it, I'm hoping Coach Harbaugh doesn't, either.
December 31st, 2014 at 6:38 AM ^
According to that argument the program should have done away with the winged helmet after Crisler since the previous 11 coaches before him didn't have a need for it.
we don't have to go the ex-boyfriend/girlfriend route and burn everything that had to do with the previous coach.
December 31st, 2014 at 8:30 AM ^
we don't have to go the ex-boyfriend/girlfriend route and burn everything that had to do with the previous coach.
Especially since our new boyfriend/girlfriend is a supermodel who is way out of our league but we were in the right place at the right time. We came out OK, we can be gracious.
December 31st, 2014 at 9:03 AM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 9:29 AM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 3:05 AM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 3:11 AM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 3:11 AM ^
No. And I'd also like to see the University lose the title for our head coach as the J Ira and Nicki Harris Head Coach, etc.
I mean, I get that they blew ten mil on the school to fund the coach via their prodigious foundation, but honestly, do these folks really, really need this ego boost?
Don't they have enough jewelry and cars and houses and other stuff to show off with that they don't need their egos stroked with this monstrosity of a name for a football coach?
I mean, did J. Ira play for Michigan to deserve this honor? Couldn't they just move to England or something and get a knighthood?
A football coach?
Give me a freaking break. Give the money, accept the thanks you got from Dave Brandon, who no doubt thought this up, accept the years of recognition you already have gotten, and call the school and say you're happy with your life now, and can let go of this name-the-coach-after-yourselves-thing.
Incidentally, I'd have no problem at all with the J. Ira and Nicki Harris Schembechler Hall Parking Lot, or some building.
But for some reason I find the Some Guy Who's A Big Shot And His Wife Head Football Coach of the University of Michigan thing truly abominable every time I hear it. It's awful.
Thanks for the money, we love you, now take the damned name back!
December 31st, 2014 at 3:50 AM ^
It seems like the naming rights of the football coach would be best limited to print, for example a plaque on his office door or listed in the saturday programs. I think it's a little condescending and over the top when they have to announce the full name every time the coach is introduced.
December 31st, 2014 at 4:05 AM ^
I was disappointed when they used this chair name in introducing Harbaugh. But I noticed they dropped it again. It truly is abominable. If we're going to have this family name attached to our head coach, we might as well sell advertisements to wear on the jerseys. This was the epitome of the marketing first mentality of Dave Brandon. I have a serious antipathy for Jay and Nicky, or whoever they are, for buying their name onto our head coach.
December 31st, 2014 at 4:15 AM ^
that antipathy is helping to pay for Jim Harbaugh.
and speaking of Jim Harbaugh, the idea of endowing coaching positions started out at Stanford. So I'm not sure where you get the idea that it was some sort of "marketing first" idea.
December 31st, 2014 at 8:01 AM ^
It might have started somewhere else, but it was the first time I heard about it. And using it at press conferences and stuff is just laughable. I agree if you are putting it on a plaque on the HC door. But leave it at that.
December 31st, 2014 at 8:33 AM ^
Good win over an SEC team. ND looked stronger and faster.
Except for that Fournette guy. Freak.
December 31st, 2014 at 9:35 AM ^
The sad part about it all is that 3 plays kept LSU in the game. The KO return for a TD, the 1st play long pass and then the 1st play run. Nice to end this craptastic year on this note.
December 31st, 2014 at 10:44 AM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 5:38 AM ^
A small added on title that has accompanied a significant donation to pay for the head coaches salary is far from an abominable decision.
December 31st, 2014 at 10:44 AM ^
Endowed positions are not a Michigan thing. They are an elite university thing. Universities with wealthy donors endow everything. Stanford, Northwestern, Duke, Dartmouth, Michigan all have endowed positions in their athletic departments. NW and Stanford have endowed football head coach positions and Duke is actively seeking an endowment. It's about relationships with donors, not advertizing.
December 31st, 2014 at 12:38 PM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 7:56 AM ^
December 31st, 2014 at 8:01 AM ^
I like the title, since (a) "The University of Michigan J. Ira and Nicki Harris Family Head Football Coach" rolls naturally off the tongue, and (b) the name instantly reminds me that J. Ira and Nicki Harris are probably people I wouldn't like much. Not that I'm too likely to run into them, but it's a good reminder.
BlueHills asks "but honestly, do these folks really, really need this ego boost?". Well, probably not need. But they sure as Hell want it. I'm always much more impressed with philanthropists who make large donations quietly.
December 31st, 2014 at 8:01 AM ^
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December 31st, 2014 at 8:11 AM ^
Endowed Chairs and Professorships have been around forever, but are relatively low profile endowments (even if there is substantial money behind it) from people who feel they owe a special debt to that department or field of study. It's a noble thing, and the naming of the endowment after the donor is a traditional thing. It bothers me not a whit (especially since I benefitted from a "named" scholarship myself while at Michigan).
But this is an attempt by rich folks to associate themselves with the Michigan football brand. There is no similar tradition, and it seems the primary goal of the J. Ira and Nicki Harris Family Head Football Coach title is shameless self promotion. Worse yet, it does so in an awkward way that makes our school look a bit goofy when the title is trotted out. If you didn't roll your eyes a touch when Hackett introducted Harbaugh as the "University of Michigan's J. Ira and Nicki Harris Family Head Football Coach" you're in a small minority.
December 31st, 2014 at 8:11 AM ^
I'm not criticizing your post, but you have to be part of an academic institution to really understand how important this is internally.
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December 31st, 2014 at 8:28 AM ^
But I think you're missing my core point. Comparing the head coach naming rights to an academic endowment is a bit of an apples-to-chainsaws comparison. And putting your full name and your wife's full name (he's the source of the money here) in front of the head football coach's name is not marketing? I doubt anyone really believes that - the visibility of the title is what drove the price tag up so high.
I've been around academia enough to appreciate the difference between this sort of activity and a named departmental chair or professorship. J. Ira and Nicki are attention-whoring here, and it has the appearance that this is their primary goal in making the donation. And, 'cause ... Murica!, I get to mock them for it.
Finally, I get the importance of truly academic contributions more than most. As someone who worked for two degrees from Michigan with no family financial support, I am often reminded that the generosity of a donor helped put me where I am. (Student loans and work paid for the balance.) And I'm sincerely grateful. But I'm not required to introduce myself as the "H. J. Muckity Muck [Job Title]" each time I'm out in public.
December 31st, 2014 at 8:52 AM ^
The cost has nothing to do with the visibility. At an institution like Michigan, the cost is roughly 4 million to provide 300k annual in perpetual salary or support to a professorship.If you assume that we would want to offset 1 million or so in salary, you can do the math of what it would require for a coach. I would venture that the coach would take some level of pride in having an endowed title parallel to the other University leaders. I personally apply mine to every signature as a display of pride and gratitude. INTERNALLY, this really means something. I went to Michigan as well on scholly for both undergrad and grad school and am just as proud as you rightfully are of you hard work that made it possible. If I am ever fortunate enough to have the ability to support Michigan at such a level, I would do it.
I respect your opinion, but we all have been in academia by virtue of our educations. I only submit to you that if you actually spent your whole career in it, you would understand it better.
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December 31st, 2014 at 9:28 AM ^
I understand that you spending your life in academia colors your view. But you make a bunch of faulty assumptions here.
First, you state that "The cost has nothing to do with the visibility". Based on that, you must believe that getting naming rights to John Beilein's job would be the same ticket as getting naming rights to Kevin Sullivan's job. That strikes me as flat wrong.
Next, you continue to view J. Ira and Nicki's contribution as a faculty endowment. It's not that at all. Endowed professorships are typically set up to be perpetual. Thus, the corpus of the underlying trust needs to be sufficient to generate enough income to support the post, while the corpus stays the same or slowly grows. So for an academic position, say at LS&A, the price tag you posit sounds about right. That's apples.
What J. Ira and Nicki actually did is much different. They made a $10M donation to the Athletic Department writ large to support the football program. That's a general donation to the AD's fund. In exchange for that, Brandon sold them the right to name the head football coaching position. It was all part of a $355M athletic department fundraising push started in 2013, and the Harris family chose the title as their parting gift in return for the donation. There's no position that is exclusively funded by their donation. There's no perpetual trust. It is a "one off" gift, albeit a huge one. That's chainsaws.
To look at it another way, you correctly note that endowing a professorship takes a large donation. Understood, for the reasons above. But it's untenable that a $10M donation is funding Harbaugh's $5M+/year job. There's no way (outside of Argentinian inflation) that the numbers work.
While I'm not still in academia, this stuff is public knowledge. You can check it out HERE.
December 31st, 2014 at 10:15 AM ^
Quite frankly, if I were to give it a name myself, I would insist that it be structured like any other endowed faculty position and name it after Schembechler.
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December 31st, 2014 at 10:34 AM ^
Cumong now, calling someone an "attention whore" is not the same as calling them a "whore". You've spent too much time in academia if you don't get that.
And w/r/t the naming of the football coach position, it seems pretty obvious that J. Ira and Nicki Harris picked that title as their parting gift because it was very visible. That makes them attention whores. In my opinion - colored in part by the press release I linked previously.
Don't smoke around the rest of your argument re: Mott, etc. The straw is likely to catch fire.