Did RR tell ST Forcier was getting the job?
On Monday afternoon Brian stated on WTKA that Steve Threet left because RR told him that (paraphrasing) he wasn't going to play next year, and that Forcier was going to get all the snaps during spring practice. Since I was the one who initially posted this on MGoBlog, I figured I should also post Sam Webb's view of this issue. I asked Sam directly this morning on air about this, and he disagrees this is what happened. He said that, by contrast, Threet's decision came as a surprise to the coaching staff, that RR left a meeting when he heard of it, and spent some amount of time trying to convince Threet to stay. Webb left it as a case of his sources telling him different things than Brian's. Brian, if I've misstated or misremembered what you said on the air, my apologies and by all means set me straight.
February 25th, 2009 at 9:09 AM ^
to believe sam webb's story as that's the third place i've heard it.
February 25th, 2009 at 9:11 AM ^
I just have a hard time believing that RR would be so eager to play one of two kids he hasn't spent a second of his life coaching that he'd run off a viable (in my mind) Quarterback with a year of work in the system in order to hand it over to one of those mystery candidates.
February 25th, 2009 at 9:14 AM ^
posted this morning on Scout saying much of the same things Sam was saying. I don't know if thats because they talk to each other or if they both heard the same thing from different sources.
February 25th, 2009 at 9:29 AM ^
You can say what you want about Rich Rodriguez, but he's no fool.
Only a fool would just let Threet go in this situation-- there's nothing at all to gain and plenty to lose by letting the kid walk. If he wasn't concerned about position depth, think of all the other kids on the program that would have been let go as well...
February 25th, 2009 at 9:54 AM ^
said, so I can't really comment on it. But I did hear what Sam Webb said this morning, and Sam said that RR tried to convince Threet to stay.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:10 AM ^
guys seem to agree with Brian, FWIW. Maybe they both have the same source? Who knows, but I guess we'll never know what happened.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:20 AM ^
GBMW think RR bad for NOT CONVINCING threet to STAY. Unless he DID. IN WHICH case OK. JUST epinion. no SUGARCOAT.
In all seriousness, GBMW consistently makes vague assertions cloaked with the promise of "inside information" - if they are EVER pressed on what, exactly, the information is, ie, the specific story, they always hide behind trying to "protect the subjects of the story".
February 25th, 2009 at 10:22 AM ^
every time. I hate that site.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:30 AM ^
but in this case, they are essentially saying what Brian is saying about RR not wanting Threet around.
By the way, I do like their analysis of players and their Spring Practice reviews, but don't follow them on Scout.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:33 AM ^
I'm just more offended by the syntax and grammatical holocaust that occurs every time they touch a keyboard, followed closely by their need to qualify every opinion they give and then claim to be "straight-shooters". But my largest beef with them involves their peddling of "insider sources".
I'm not trying to discredit Brian, at all, but in my mind, saying that GBMW agrees with his version of things doesn't really bolster his case (it doesn't harm it either - I just don't give them any credence).
February 25th, 2009 at 10:37 AM ^
how do you feel about GSimms?
I mean it is kind of the same thing right? Thaat dood kaan't spehll ither.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:44 AM ^
gsimms makes up for it by being informative.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:56 AM ^
but I also think you have to admit there are SOME informative pieces on GBMW. Right?
February 25th, 2009 at 12:48 PM ^
Is that GBMW called Mike Williams a safety/linebacker tweener. Dude is like 180 lbs. They have no idea what the fuck they're talking about.
February 27th, 2009 at 7:46 AM ^
But what about PROGRAM?
February 25th, 2009 at 10:48 AM ^
Are you really going to compare someone's improper grammar to one of the greatest tragedies in world history? Just because someone can't type doesn't mean you have to offend the millions of people harmed by that atrocious event. Grow up dick.
3...2...1...
February 25th, 2009 at 12:49 PM ^
Nahtzee!
February 25th, 2009 at 1:01 PM ^
No one took the bait on that. I'm sad, but proud at the same time.
February 25th, 2009 at 11:15 AM ^
Congratulations to Chitown who has just added a new phrase to the unofficial MgoBlog glossary:
Grammatical Holocaust
I will likely use that phrase in real life before the week is out. Thank you.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:36 PM ^
http://www.mgoblog.com/diaries/michigans-3-star-commits-have-potential
Dex's post (#21 I think).
February 25th, 2009 at 11:47 PM ^
I absolutely ripped it off of Dex, but I think I ripped it off him much earlier than that.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:04 AM ^
Threet must think he's a whole lot better than he really is, if indeed he was not run out of town.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:11 AM ^
quite the opposite. He didn't think he could beat out Forcier in this offense, so he wanted to find a better fit in a different offense.
February 25th, 2009 at 2:44 PM ^
I'm just saying I can't imagine st as a guarunteed starter ANYWHERE.
He thinks he will be, apparantly.
I'm thinking threet doesn't feel he's getting a fair shot.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:28 AM ^
that Threet's transfer came as a surprise to anyone but us.
Here goes the net-cred I never had in the first place.
1) Adrian High schools version of the spread is nothing like Michigan's. In fact, as someone who watches several of their games every season, I'd say it's more of an 'option' offense than a spread one. Threet is a pro-style quarter-back, that was painfully obvious to anyone who watched last season.
2) Threet doesn't need a scholorship to attend college. Financially, he could go anywhere he wanted.
3) Steve and his dad Jewell requested the meeting with RR after it was apparent that Threet was more than likely the #3 guy.
4) I wasn't in the meeting, so I have no idea of what was all said, but basically it went down that Threet would probably not see much playing time (i.e - he was going to be the #3 guy)
5) From what I have heard, that wasn't even the biggest concern, the biggest concern was, according to the Threet's, the lack of any sort of praise or acknowledgement from RR about last season and what Threet did on the football field. I got the impression that they felt 'slighted'.
6) I've read things on here that if this is what really happened than why arn't we hearing about it, how come Threet isn't making it public. That's because Steve and family are good people who love Michigan, and whether or not they liked what went down, they would never disgrace the place or the coach.
7) While I didn't hear Brian's interview, from what bits i've gathered reading in threads on here, it sounds like Brian is the one who hit the nail on the head.
8) How do I know any of this you're probably wondering? Maybe some of you live in a small town or have lived in a small town like Adrian, where I live, where the Threet's live. And hopefully, if you've lived in a small town - you can figure out exactly how I know what I just posted.
Rack Me
February 25th, 2009 at 11:21 AM ^
If I believe your story Threet's dad needs to let his kid grow up. He needs more praise in the media?? This isn't high school. If you want to be QB1 at Michigan you need to be a lot tougher.
As I stated in my earlier thread on this topic, I contend that the assumption that RR would tell any player on his team he is going to be at a so and so spot on the depth chart in January is absurd. His whole philosophy from RR to Barwis is daily no make that hourly competition. No ones job is safe and if Threet busted his ass and earned the #1 job then he would have gotten it. In a private meeting and ST asked him to be honest would RR lay out a scenario that would have him on the bench to be straight with his player to let him make the best decision?? Sure, but it didn't come out like people are saying that he isn't going to get reps or is seated 3rd on the depth chart. Here is how the convo most likely went.
ST: Coach I've been hearing a lot of rumors about the Qb's and I've been getting bashed in the media and on the internet. What do you see of my future here for the next 3 years.
RR: Well Steven we got 2 guys coming in this year that our highly rated that probably fit the system a little better than you do and I want to bring in 2 more guys next year, so you are going to have a hell of a competition on your hands so you need to keep working with coach Barwis to get your speed and strength up and keep working on your mechanics so you can hold off these young guys, we need to improve as a team and the competition is going to be fierce this spring and fall so you need to be ready.
February 25th, 2009 at 11:47 AM ^
about praise in the media or what is said on the interwebs. It was how Steve and his dad felt with what they perceived as a slight or total lack of praise from RR.
I think that Threet would have stayed and competed even with knowing that it was highly possible that he would be #3 on the depth chart. He wasn't expecting to be handed the starting job, in fact, I don't think he really ever envisioned that he would ever start at Michigan. I personally think that this is just about that meeting and what took place there and how the Threets came out of it feeling.
February 25th, 2009 at 12:13 PM ^
Threet said publicly when he transferred that he was coming back to Michigan to beat out Mallett for the starting job.
I disagree this is about the meeting. If you watched the games last year (I assume you did), I don't recall a coach ever being more frustrated with his QBs than RR at Threet and Sheridan. This is because they didn't get and couldn't run the offense. They couldn't pass the ball - they couldn't run the ball. We all love to write about how much they fought and how hard they worked. We're forgetting that outside of 4 halves of football (Penn State, one half against Minnesota, and parts of Purdue and Notre Dame), the quarterbacking was possibly some of the worst played at Michigan in decades. Other than buffer and "mentoring," there's no reason why RR would want to have Threet back on the field in the future. If he did, he wouldn't be bringing in 4 new QBs whose styles are directly inapposite to Threet's.
February 25th, 2009 at 1:01 PM ^
Unless both Tate and Robinson pan out well enough to play as freshmen and neither gets injured, we desperately needed Threet.
And again, I think Threet could become a decent to good QB in RR's system.
February 25th, 2009 at 1:34 PM ^
The word "media" was never stated or implied in his piece. You added that on your own. He's saying Threet was upset that he didn't get any positive feedback from Rodriguez.
February 25th, 2009 at 11:26 AM ^
that changes everything:
"3) Steve and his dad Jewell requested the meeting with RR after it was apparent that Threet was more than likely the #3 guy."
There's a difference between:
a. being told you're likely No. 3 because the guys I got coming just fit the offense better than you and
b. being told you will not be allowed to take snaps in the spring or compete for a job.
From what I gather, Brian is saying (b) is what happened, which I am just not buying.
February 25th, 2009 at 12:48 PM ^
1) I know nothing about Adrian's offense, but RR's system is a spread option. How does Threet's high-school team running the option make him a pro-style QB? And I think RR has shown the inclination to change up his plays based on his player's skill set. While he clearly did ask Sheridan and Threet to run the option portion of the playbook from time to time, he also clearly changed up his run/pass mix from the Pat White/Steve Slaton era.
2) Many people don't need a scholarship, but that doesn't mean they will throw one away over trifles
3) I can't really comment on this, but I find it unlikely
4) Same as (3), only even more unlikely to me.
5) Praise? Really? Something like "Congrats on helping us go 3-9, kid. And that one ND game where you looked like you were taking a step forward with a decent performance." Come on, I know the kid played hurt, which is admirable, and I think Threet could become a decent QB, but there wasn't a whole lot of praise to go around this season. Did he expect RR to get on his knees for him in particular?
6) If all this really is true, I can only hope you're right. That would be a classy move on the part of Threet and his family. On the other hand, the situation as it stands isn't doing wonders for the team's perception. Either way, I think the team might (and certainly would, if RR tried to get him to stay) benefit from Threet clearing the air and telling everyone exactly what happened.
7) I also didn't listen to Brian on the radio, but this whole theory doesn't sound right to me. No offense to Brian, but it wouldn't be the first time he was wrong (nor would it be the first time he was right, but I'm having a hard time swallowing his version)
8) Ok, so you live in Adrian. People talk, I get it, I've been in much smaller places than Adrian(20,000 people is very large in comparison). Maybe you even know the Threets. However, unless you heard it from a source close to the situation, your hearsay probably isn't much better then a lot of the other rumors that float around message boards and blogs. If you are close to (or one of!) the Threets, then the question become one of our perception of your reliability and objectivity. Unless you want to clarify, I going to assume you happened to hear about it third or fourth hand. Not impressed.
In any case, I wish Steve good luck but hope we won't really miss him.
February 25th, 2009 at 1:10 PM ^
anyone to take what I said as the gospil - we all know how internet message boards are. So and so says he knows so and so and this is what happened, blah, blah, fucking blah.
I hesitated to chime in, but in this case, Brian is correct on how things played out. It really doesn't matter to me one way or the other who believes it, I'm not here to try and convince you.
1) Running the option is not the spread offense. And Adrian used the option rarely at that. Their offense was like most high school offenses around here. Option once in a while, dives, a pass here and there - trust me, it is nothing compared to RR's playbook.
2) I'm sure Threet will take the scholorship if he gets offered it. I simply stated financially, he doesn't need it.
3) Find it how you like
4) Same as #3, I told you how it happened. Whether you want to believe it or not is up to you. I don't blame you for having doubts (see my first paragraph on how these message boards work).
I'll skip to #8
8) I did not hear it third or fourth hand, and I did not hear it from Steve. (oh, and I wasn't trying to impress you)
February 25th, 2009 at 1:24 PM ^
and clarify a few things.
Threet ran a pro-style offense in high school - you know, the shotgun once in awhile, a lot of wishbone formations, and the option every once in awhile. He was a good quaterback - but he wasn't the type of quarterback who could play in RR's system. I have yet to figure out why I still read comments about him playing the spread offense in high school - he didn't.
He went to Georgia Tech, at the time, a pro-style offense. Then the coach leaves, Threet transfers to Michigan, which at the time, was coached by Carr using the - you guessed it, Pro style offense. Then Carr retired and by time Rich got here, and Mallet left, Threet was one of three QB's who would compete for the job, and at that time it was a little late in the game to transfer again.
So Threet played for Michigan last season. It didn't work out, it's not the type of offense he plays, we all know he can't fun for shit, and in this offense, you've got to be able to run.
The way things played out was mutal, that's why I said no one was surprised about his decision to transfer except us. In that meeting, RR told the Threets how it was, he wasn't a dick to them, they have nothing bad to say about him, I think more than anything they were a little surprised with his bluntness. Threet only won 2 games last year, and even then his performance wasn't that great, even his father will acknowledge that.
February 25th, 2009 at 2:01 PM ^
They tend to protect their own. That's a good thing, don't get me wrong, but any buzz coming out of Adrian is clearly slanted and should be discounted.
February 25th, 2009 at 4:20 PM ^
I think we were both a little unclear about your first point; I don't disagree that Threet's better suited for a more traditional offense. I didn't know what kind of offensive system Adrian used, so I was confused when you were talking about them running the option. I'm fully aware of Threet's story after he left high school.
Anyway, his best play of the year was arguably (or maybe not) that option run against Wisconsin. I don't harbor any illusions that a few good runs means he's made for the spread option or that he'll ever be half the runner that Pat White was. Given more time to mature in the system, however, I think he could be a decent to good QB for RR. Now, maybe neither party agrees with me there, but I still don't believe RR tried to get rid of him.
My point about the scholarship was based on the (apparently incorrect) idea that he could not go to another DI school on athletic scholarship since he had already transferred once. I read the NCAA bylaws and I don't think that's the case.
February 25th, 2009 at 3:36 PM ^
I'm surprised he transferred for the simple fact that he's already transferred once, and that at the time, there were these odd stories going around about him being content to be a backup and not really interested in the starting job. Plus he was at his home-state school.
February 25th, 2009 at 7:39 PM ^
Well, if these stories are correct (big "if", I understand), Threet didn't really leave because he wasn't content to be a backup - he left because:
a) he didn't feel like he was even going to get a chance to start
and
b) he had personal issues with Rodriguez (Rodriguez never gave him positive feedback, etc...)
Unlike Boren, Threet is keeping his mouth shut - to his credit - so I imagine we won't ever get the definitive truth. It's absolutely possible that Threet just didn't like Rodriguez (or vice versa) without either "being at fault" - sometimes people just don't get along.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:46 AM ^
it seems to make no sense that RR would have Threet take all of the snaps in spring practice. All of them? Now, with that said, It isn't a big stretch to believe that RR considered Threet as the number 3 receiver Because up until, what, the third game of last season RR was unable to distinquish if Sheridan or Threet was the starter.
February 25th, 2009 at 12:20 PM ^
...Sheridan was deemed better than Threet at week 1.
Sheridan had the best QB performance of the season against Minnesota.
Too many people here criticize Sheridan without realizing that this was the guy deemed better than Threet for Rich's first game as Michigan coach. Why prolong the agony? He's making the right move to Tate.
February 25th, 2009 at 10:58 AM ^
Threet is gone and I really think that the only thing that will be missed is his ability to teach the new guys the system. Nothing against ST by any means. Last year he was the best that we had and there is no doubt that he gave 110% every game. I just think that he probably would have had to ride the bench for the next 3 years and that is all I mean by the won't be missed comment. I really think if he goes to a pro set offense school he will do well and with the right coach he may play on sundays. I am sure that is why he came back here in the first place was so that he could try. Every football player in the world dreams of playing in the NFL and I am sure that ST is thinking of nothing other than that. I can't blame the kid one ioda. Just so long as he doesn't go and join Boren I wish him all the best.
February 25th, 2009 at 1:09 PM ^
Ioda-dine?
February 25th, 2009 at 1:53 PM ^
I have a hard time believing that Threet will start at QB at any major college. His delivery is straight out of an old Daryl Lamonica film. Worse yet, he compounds his flawed mechanics by not being able to hit open recievers. That doesn't work nowadays, at least not at the highest levels.
Threet needs to go home to Adrain College, who graduated their QB this year, and hope he can at least play there, where he may be the hometown hero once again.
Either way, everyone in town will lament the fact that it didn't work out for him at UM, and they will talk about how classy he is for not blaming them for "misusing" his "talent."
And he will have a great life there.
February 25th, 2009 at 1:57 PM ^
I don't think there are a lot of people in this town who thinks Threet has any talent.
February 25th, 2009 at 2:03 PM ^
I think most people here think you two are retarded.
February 25th, 2009 at 2:12 PM ^
I don't. I find Tater's constant suggestions that Threet attend Adrian College refreshing and clever. Maybe, Brodie, you don't get the joke, since you're in England. Adrian College is a small college, and it's in Threet's hometown, too, so it'd be a homecoming of sorts for him. And, see, they're in Division III, which makes it doubly hilarious, because, see, the implication here is that Threet isn't good enough to play for a major college. So if he went to Adrian and played in his hometown and for a school that doesn't have a top football program, it'd be perfect for him. Because he's not a good football player. So he should play for Adrian College. Which is in Adrian. Where he was born.
Get it now?
February 25th, 2009 at 2:19 PM ^
Is THAT super-dry unicorn humor?
February 25th, 2009 at 2:21 PM ^
Super-dry.
February 25th, 2009 at 2:55 PM ^
I started a dynasty with Michigan and made no adjustments...(no not online, I'm just not that good)..anyways...I have won 3 back to back Natioinal Titles with Threet as the QB...The bad part about it is...he is CRAWLING in the game when he tries to run. He did improve with awareness and accuracy over the seasons that I have played.