It seems a little silly for Richardson and Jenkins-Stone to be pissed that they haven't been offered, despite the fact that official offers can't be extended for another 385 days or so.
TVH Weekly: Offensive Line Visits On Tap
This is a big week for visits but other than that it's pretty slow since coaches are on vacation. Here's a look at who's visiting with some updates elsewhere.
Visiting July 13th:
- Jake Fisher - Instate lineman is coming down from Traverse City to visit both MSU, and Michigan. I spoke with him about the visits and his timeline: he's visiting MSU first, then Michigan. Take from that what you will, other than that MSU happens to come first geographically on his trip. He is on commit watch.
Fisher: "I'd like to make my decision shortly after these visits. I might have a leader right now (laughing), but I don't want to say who."
- Cyrus Hobbi - As mentioned in last week's update, Hobbi is coming up to Michigan on his way to a family trip in New York. That is a huge break for Michigan. Without it, it's safe to say that Cyrus wouldn't have been able to get up to Michigan for an unofficial visit before the season. If Cyrus likes what he sees, it should give Michigan a serious shot at landing the big lineman. West coast schools are the main competition.
- Jordan Walsh - As it was noted in my interview with Jordan this past week, he is also making a trip to Ann Arbor on Tuesday. If you didn't read the article, here's how his mom feels about Michigan.
"She loved the junior day visit, too. When Coach Rodriguez offered me, she started crying."
All of these visits could be big for Michigan. I would be very happy with pulling two out of the three from this list.
5'8, 190 lbs.
Everyone's favorite recruit to discuss and one of the most important in this class. Hart was recently at the Nike 7 on 7 tournament in Oregon. ESPN gives you a synopsis of how he did and how he keeps the media guessing.
I spoke to Hart's teammate, Roderick Ryles, the other day. Ryles told me that he and LaQuentin Smith are going up to Arkansas, while Demetrius Hart and (2012 QB) Nick Patti are coming up to Michigan this week. I also spoke with Hart, and he wasn't 100% sure the visit is going to happen:
I'm not sure we're coming up yet. I still have to figure it out. I think we are, but it's not final.
Hart came up earlier this year and planned a second trip for the Spring Game but could not make it. Even if he can't scrape together the cash and time to get up to Michigan for a second unofficial, his interest in making one is genuine and he will visit officially in the fall.
5'8, 156 lbs.
Sicklerville, New Jersey
Byrd is a (very) speedy slot guy who already has offers from Florida, West Virginia, Iowa, Pitt, South Carolina, and Nebraska, amongst others. Michigan doesn't have much of a need for tiny slots in this class, but I had an interesting conversation with Byrd the other day. He recently narrowed down his list to 7 top schools. I asked him if Michigan were to offer, would they be able to get back in it.
Yeah, I would consider them again. I really liked it when I went up there, so they would still have a chance.
This doesn't really matter right now because he doesn't have an offer from the Wolverines. If they miss out on a few wide receiver targets down the road they might look to Byrd.
- [Ed.: LA CB Darren Kitchen has gotten an offer from recruiter Fred Jackson. This is not an official written offer and can't be committed to until Rodriguez gets back from vacation and issues it. If and when that does occur, Kitchen has said straight out he will commit.]
Recruits can be offered verbally rather than officially this early. Obviously the coaches have offered Ross, so why not do the same for the other two? Every evaluation seems to be glowing on these players. To land all three would be huge. I personally don't get why they haven't been offered myself. It's definitely a head-scratcher.
Maybe the coaches don't like them as much.
Michigan has offered about 153 players so far for the 2011 class. Not all of those kids were deserving of offers prior to their junior season, which is the age of Richardson and Jenkins-Stone.
When can they recieve unofficial offers? It seems that James Ross already has an offer from Michigan. I'm not sure if it is of the official variety.
Yeah, it's a little early to get worked up about that. There are in-state guys a year older than them that are still working on getting an offer, and even they are probably a little early to get upset about it.
That said, I do agree with Shoe that it might be a good idea to talk to their coach or have a guy like BWC, Teric, Flash or, even better, Hollowell relay some calming thoughts to these guys. Contact rules aside, Cass Tech is last high school where recruits should be out of the loop.
And that said, why don't we just offer them? They sound like solid players, and getting those three right off the bat would be a great start.
And that said, why don't we just offer them? They sound like solid players, and getting those three right off the bat would be a great start.
Maybe the coaches don't like them as much. From what I've gathered, Ross is a superior prospect to both. A little humility and patience from the Technicians wouldn't hurt.
All these kids are used to all these schools abusing contact rules and all that. When they see Michigan having to strictly play by the rules with all that stuff now, they see it as Michigan not showing enough love.
And I am petrified because Alabama is still in the mix for D Hart. I know he has hinted that UofM and Auburn might be in the lead, but I don't fear Auburn at all. I am scared shitless that Saban is gonna hypnotize this guy at the last minute and drag him off to Tuscaloosa.
Don't sleep on them. They would sell their mom if it would help them get a recruit. I'm worried they could sway Frost and Hart.
Couldn't agree more. I think there's a better chance they go to Auburn than Hart going to Alabama. Alabama has so much talent(young) at RB he wouldn't get to play for a couple years. For what it's worth bama fans don't think he's coming, but believe that Auburns in the running.
I'm sure that they love any chance to break out this "recruitment tool"
has no interest in Dee Hart other than as a KR/PR. Not sure if Hart is aware of it, but Auburn is our biggest competition IMO.
To be honest I've really tempered my expecations in regards to Hart.
In fact at this point I don't expect him to come Michigan.
No insider info, just a hunch.
The shitstorm of the past year just seemed to make him less enthused and that allowed Southern schools like Auburn and Alabama to get their foot in the door. Now that his recruitment is open, the geographical advatage they have becomes, IMO very significant since he now has the willingness to visit other places, and since those places are closer, he can visit them more frequently, become more familiar/comfortable with them, be wooed by their Hummer limos, etc.
I think he'll end up at Auburn.
Plus looking at it this way, if he goes Blue it will be a pleasant bonus, whereas if I expected him to, and he doesn't, I'd be really disappointed. And at this point I've just had more disappointment than I can take relative to M football over the past couple years.
Reading about the way he has excelled at the 7 on 7 tournaments catching the ball out of the backfield makes me actually believe more and more that he is going to end up at Michigan. Seems like hes noticing thats one of the strongest components of his games, and the sucess of Smith last year was largely based on his ability to make plays catching the ball.
Any mention of quality OL/LB from Tom VH makes my recruiting wood go from 6 to midnight.
Good Lord Almighty.
To be fair, that's probably about what Vincent Smith and Odoms weighed going into their senior years, and not much less than guys like T-Rob and Gallon. And he's probably faster than all of them.
Numbers like that just make me envision my old 120th string wide receiver who used to get tossed around like a rag doll. I'll admit that he wasn't athletic nor did he run a 4.4. It just seems like that is incredibly small. And in reality, it is.
The craziest one that I missed? Roy Roundtree, who came in at 154lbs., and 6'1". That makes 5'8" 156 look like a linebacker.
...him coming fast across the middle, catching a 7-yard pass, and getting plastered head on by a 6' 4" 260 pound linebacker. Not a pretty sight.
Out of curiosity, what is the value of having recruits visit when our coaches are on vacation? Who does the "hosting" in these situations and what does this look like? I would think if recruits were interested in visiting over the summer then our coaches should be around to show them the program. Maybe give them two weeks vacation after a bowl game?
All the important coaches will be back tomorrow. This is too important of a day for them not to be there.
James Ross went to GT and UGA over the weekend. At GT the coaches were on vacation so the graduate assistants showed Ross around the campus and facilities.
The Linebacker coach came in and showed him around at Georgia. And from what I understand this was a last min thing due to Ross's family being in the area.
If UM can pull in this group of OL, Hart and any other skills position should be fighting each other to get their verbal's in for this class.
Preaching to the choir, but building your trenches first equals a winning team. It the way dad did and it shouldn't change now. Fuck I'm happy.
Richardson really has no right to complain. Nor will he have any right to complain when Jenkins-Stone gets offered before him, making Ross and RJS our first 2012 instate offers.
Ross and RJS worked out at Michigan. This coaching staff has made it very clear that if you're a local kid, they would very much prefer to see you in person before offering. If Richardson wants his offer this early, he needs to earn it.
I tried finding some information on the web about this trio with no sucess. How big of recruits are we talking about for them three? Top 3 instate, top 50 nationally? Any perspective on that would be greatly appreciated.
I'd guess Ross is one of the top 3 instate prospects, perhaps even #1. Richardson would be down the list a ways. I'm not quite sure about Jenkins-Stone, but I think he's better than Richardson.
Richardson isn't as far down as you imply, but he's definitely below Ross and RJS, who are (at this point) easily 1-2 in the state for next year.
Of course a year ago at this time, nobody had heard of Brennan Beyer, so it's moot really.
the best player in the state of Michigan in the class of '12. Ross should be a national recruit. He's a stud and he impressed me a lot every time I see OLSM play.
I agree with you on Richardson. He may be technically pretty sound as a corner but he's very small. He weighs, at most, 160 pounds and is no taller than 5'7".
If you google James Ross Orchard Lake St. Mary's you should find more than enough info.
Hypothetically if all three were to commit I wonder what would happen with Tony Posada?
Well, I doubt we'll get both Hobbi and Walsh. I think realistically we're looking at Ryan Kelly, Walsh, Fisher, Miller, and Posada rounding out our OL recruiting. Kelly can play OC or OG, Walsh and Miller are OGs, and Fisher and Posada would be OTs. Pretty solid group IMO.
Did you forget about Zettel, or just rule him out?
I'm pretty sure he said he wants to play DL in college.
Yeah, this is what he is saying now, but it might not be where he ends up. He's good enough to play both spots very well, so we recruit him hard nonetheless, but it would be better for us if he played OG. However, we could use another DE in this class anyway, especially if it's one as good as him. You can never have too elite linemen, on offense or defense.
I don't think we'd take him. Walsh and Hobbi are guards. Fisher is a tackle. Miller is a center. We need 4-6 offensive linemen in this class, and the other 1-2 linemen would need to be tackles, IMO. Unless the coaches think one of these guys can play tackle, they can't afford to take 3 guards in this class and not address the tackle situation.
Magnus, what makes a player better suited for an offensive guard or a tackle (or even a center)? Height? Weight? Technique? Speed? Strength? Just curious, thanks.
I'm not Magnus but I can give some info. A tackle is typically the biggest man on the field. They're 6'5" + with long arms and good footwork. A guard is normally a little more athletic than the other lineman because they are pulling or have to be quick enough to reach the linebackers at the next level. A center is going to be a little shorter (6'0" to 6'2") but also pretty athletic and smart. The center is going to make the majority of the calls for the blocking schemes on the given play.
To add a little to that, O linemen usually get shorter as they get closer to the middle, i.e. OG is taller than OC, OT taller than OG. As for weight, even though guards are usually a few inches shorter than tackles, they don't always weigh less. It's not uncommon for a team to have a tackle who is 6'6" 300 next to a guard who is 6'4" 320. A lot of times this is because the guards line up over the DT's, whereas the tackles line up over DE's. Center are almost always the smaller in height and weight.
However, they are often somewhat interchangeable. UM linemen usually all know 2 positions, and a few of them (Huyge, Schilling, Omameh) have played multiple positions. Guys like Schofield or Lewan, however, are strictly tackles since they are 6'7" and 6'8", respectively.
Height is a key indicator. You'll notice that none of our tackles are shorter than 6'6". Guards are typically 6'3" to 6'5". Centers are typically 6'1" to 6'4". That's largely because of the players those guys match up against. For example, Terrance Taylor and Mike Martin (both nose tackles) are a shade over 6' but extremely strong. If they're lining up across from a 6'6" center, the leverage advantage swings toward those defensive guys. And if that nose tackle is 6'5" and 330 lbs. like Will Campbell, then your center had better have the leverage advantage. Coincidentally, that's one of the biggest reasons that Will Campbell hasn't made a huge impact yet - he hasn't been able to stay low enough to outmuscle Molk (who's 6'2") or Khoury (6'4") consistently.
Tackles are tall, long-armed and probably the stiffest of the offensive linemen. They have to move well laterally, but generally don't have to get downfield to make blocks. They're generally battling the physical freaks of the defense (6'5", 270 lb. guys who can move quickly), so they have to have long arms to combat that speed and size.
Guards are generally the guys you wouldn't want to mess with in a bar fight. They're big, they carry more "bad weight" than other offensive linemen, and are often the strongest guys on the line. For example, Quinton Washington is 6'4", 307 lbs., and supposedly the strongest offensive lineman on the team. They're quick enough to get to the second level, short enough to have some leverage on defensive tackles, and generally have to be the meanest, most relentless players on the line.
Tom, got a quick question for you. Do you think FL WR Chris Gallon could be a back-up plan or are we not looking at him?
But Gallon is clearly a slot receiver. This year, we'll take a slot receiver if we can land an elite one, but I don't think there is enough of a need for them to have "fall-back plans". Damiere Byrd is clearly an elite talent, but the staff must have others in mind right now. They would be comfortable "falling back" on Damiere, but I don't think Gallon is talented enough for a spot in this class. That being said, he is transferring to DP this year, maybe he'll show up big and land a few bigger offers.
After reading last week's article on Posada I opened mgoblog every day looking for a "Welcome Tony Posada". Unfortunately, I haven't seen it. Tom said he was expecting a commit soon (possibly as early as that week). Then cam the news that if he dropped some weight he had another offer. I thought it was Miami. That Miami. Anyone know where things stand?
I thought he was dropping weight for Florida
Correct, it's florida that wanted him to lose 10 pounds.