Coaching
For having 8 months to prepare for this game, the offensive coaching was garbage. Borges got manhandled and taking the most dynamic player in college football in and out of the game was beyond baffling. The 4th and 1 call was one of the worst calls I’ve ever seen. We haven’t been able to throw all game and play action has been blown up every time and then to go back to it was shocking. Whether or not they like it or not, the spread is what's best for this team. The loss is squarely on Hoke and Borges. On the flip-side, Mattison knows what he's doing. What is everyone else's thoughts?
October 15th, 2011 at 4:11 PM ^
Bring RR back.....dope
October 15th, 2011 at 4:25 PM ^
I prefer to leave RR out of it, but his lack of recruiting was very evident in this game. Nevertheless we had a chance to win.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:04 PM ^
If Brady Hoke GETS IT, i wish he would give some of IT, to Al Borges. He single handedly took our best player out of the game.
4th and inches, OMG, where is 'our return' to glory man ball? i hope this isn't a sign of Borges' capabilites for the future.
October 15th, 2011 at 5:10 PM ^
Hoke's manball mantra is a fasade. Borges has always been a West Coast guy and the WC is based on setting the run up with the pass. It is a finesse offense not manball. Check SDSU games last year and you'll see the same thing- in close games and loses the passes greatly outnumbering runs. This included a 54 pass game against a terrible BYU team.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:06 PM ^
Agree to a point. Offensive line play, or lack thereof, along with a poor showing from our quarterback is why we lost this game- defense played well enough to win. Good teams make other teams pay for the blitz- we offered no adjustments to the blitz- and have no idea how to throw a screen pass under blitz pressure. We are not being objective if we feel we can win games against physical, well coached defensive teams if we do not improve our decision making at the quarterback position- this includes schematics and play calling.
That being said- we clearly have talent issues on both sides of the ball- and can learn from this loss. I believe our staff is excellent, and will realize the mistakes made and adjust appropriately.
October 15th, 2011 at 5:08 PM ^
I have remained strangely calm all day today, win or lose, because I recognize, perhaps as a former athlete and coach, that we are in a transition. At the end of the day, we are not yet what our coaching staff intends for us to be, and the puzzle pieces we have may not be what we ultimately want for the coming system. However, they, the coaching staff, are doing an excellent job of working with what they have, but let's not kid ourselves, if we have been overmatched in the recent past, our personnel hasn't changed significantly. A loss to Sparty, I don't like, but, for this team, it is NOT the end of the world, they are STILL learning to play football...., in the B1G...., for a new coaching staff......growing pains are gonna happen. Is this team one of our best? Probably not, but then we've had teams legitimately ranked in the top ten, even #1, which lost to Sparty, not just in EL, but also at Home! I love our kids, we will be fine, they will learn, grow, and continue to develop. Go Blue!
October 15th, 2011 at 4:07 PM ^
Agree to a point. Offensive line play, or lack thereof, along with a poor showing from our quarterback is why we lost this game- defense played well enough to win. Good teams make other teams pay for the blitz- we offered no adjustments to the blitz- and have no idea how to throw a screen pass under blitz pressure. We are not being objective if we feel we can win games against physical, well coached defensive teams if we do not improve our decision making at the quarterback position- this includes schematics and play calling.
That being said- we clearly have talent issues on both sides of the ball- and can learn from this loss. I believe our staff is excellent, and will realize the mistakes made and adjust appropriately.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:09 PM ^
Hoke is defense. Borges is offense.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:38 PM ^
Hoke may be a CEO coach and let Borges do whatever he wants, but when things go wrong he will always have some of the responsibility. This is why you see most coaches working on both sides of the ball just to keep informed of what's goign on.
October 15th, 2011 at 5:15 PM ^
You can't say that, maybe Hoke isn't the best Offensive Coach, but a Head Coach is responsible for the entire team, that's why they're the Head Coach and not a Coordinator. It's the same thing with the RR/GERG thing, sure RR may be a Offensive Coach who doesn't know much about defense, but ultimately the blame/praise falls on the Head Coach
October 15th, 2011 at 4:11 PM ^
Agree to a point. Offensive line play, or lack thereof, along with a poor showing from our quarterback is why we lost this game- defense played well enough to win. Good teams make other teams pay for the blitz- we offered no adjustments to the blitz- and have no idea how to throw a screen pass under blitz pressure. We are not being objective if we feel we can win games against physical, well coached defensive teams if we do not improve our decision making at the quarterback position- this includes schematics and play calling.
That being said- we clearly have talent issues on both sides of the ball- and can learn from this loss. I believe our staff is excellent, and will realize the mistakes made and adjust appropriately.
edit: Damn 503 error- apologize for the triple!
October 15th, 2011 at 4:10 PM ^
Borges is a good coach, but he had a bad game. You don't call one screen, one draw, one trap? I mean, they blitzed almost every single play in the 2nd half, and you call an empty set with no backs to protect? And don't even get me started on the 4th down call, I almost threw up.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:29 PM ^
I still love these coaches, but I absolutely hated that 4th down call. There are times for a sneaky throw on 4th and short, but that call makes no sense when (1) you're already deep in their territory, (2) your QB is wildly inaccurate, and (3) there are 900 mph winds. Save it for a 4th-and-1 from midfield where there's room to break a big play.
October 15th, 2011 at 5:30 PM ^
I also hated it. MSU was getting pressure on Denard all day long, and blitzing like madmen. I was thinking a Denard run towards the outside, or just the inside handoff. You can't get fancy when the other team has been having success against you all day defensively getting to the QB.
I'm not adverse to that type of playcalling all the time...but given the situation the risk outweighed the potential gain.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:12 PM ^
Cheese and Rice people..get a grip.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:12 PM ^
I thought their o line was supposed to be a liability-if anything, that description fits ours. I saw very little pressure on Cousins today. Our offensive performance was reminiscent of what OSU did against sparty. Give them credit for having a solid d.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:12 PM ^
The coaches won't tell us (for obvious reasons), but I suspect Denard's hand injury from the NW game is still lingering. I don't think it was a coincidence that Gardner was consistently put in to throw. It seems like our plan was to protect Denard where we could and hope Gardner could make some plays here and there. Unfortunately, Gardner just isn't ready for prime time and his snaps mostly turned into wasted downs.
The big adjustment I think we missed was not keeping a back in the backfield to protect Denard on passing downs. If you're going to throw the ball on 4th and inches, you've got to make sure no one gets in the QB's face.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:14 PM ^
It wasn't his throwing hand that got hurt last week.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:15 PM ^
missing that wide open TD to Hopkins really killed me.......it hurt real bad.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:14 PM ^
Our lines got demolished on both sides of the ball. That's all there is to it. Denard throws just fine when he has time, and the D wasn't getting much pressure. Frustrating, but that's why we're recruiting so many linemen.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:24 PM ^
both sides of the ball. Everyone agreed that the game would be decided in the trenches and that was the case today.
I agree coaching left much to be desired. MSU defended Michigan exactly the same last year. Yet we made no adjustments despite knowing how they were going to defend us. That speaks to talent. MSU was better and tougher.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:15 PM ^
October 15th, 2011 at 4:15 PM ^
October 15th, 2011 at 4:19 PM ^
It was a bad game all around from the coaches and players. I don't understand why we didn't run the ball more and why Borges had us passing so much in the first half. He definitely called a poor game but I don't put blame on him for that 4th down call. If Sparty doesn't blitz perfectly we had an easy touchdown. You also have to give credit where credit is due to Narduzzi for MSU. He blitzed and called pressure on both Denard and Devin all day which caused alot of rushed or inaccurate throws.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:21 PM ^
this game was lossed due to the offenses inability to execute and the O-lines inability to block my 3 year old daughter. Denards passing ability in this game was a joke and blaming the coaches for his errors is an even bigger joke. People all over the media have been saying it for weeks when your entire team relys on one player like this team does when he has a bad game your going to crash and burn which is exactly what happened today. And those of you who say we should have ran more. I guess you were not watching the same game I was. Sparty was not going to allow the run and was gonna make denard beat them with the pass PERIOD
October 15th, 2011 at 4:36 PM ^
Why do people on here have so much trouble with this word?
October 15th, 2011 at 6:01 PM ^
Alcohol.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:44 PM ^
At this point you just hope that MSU had the best front 7 we'll face and that the players can properly execute whatever new blitz pickup packages the coaches introduce to counter this. Unless Sparty runs the table against the remaining conference schedule (vs Wisconsin next week), we've still got a good shot at winning the Legends division.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:27 PM ^
I think you've covered it all. Pathetic play calling + QB substitutions + 4th & 1 call = LOSS. Oh and we picked the windiest day of the year to throw the ball.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:28 PM ^
themselves a number of times today.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:28 PM ^
I called 9-3 to start off the season and I'm sticking with it.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:31 PM ^
The Gardner plays were just idiotic. Its ok as a gimic once or twice a game but Gardner was in the game way too often and all it did was take Denard away from what the offense does best and take Denard out of his rythym. It reminds me of the crap we used to do when we had Henson and it drives me nuts. The time to play Devin is when we have a huge lead or in a less important game. Not in our biggest game of the year on the road.
October 15th, 2011 at 5:59 PM ^
Gardner was in so much because Denard cant seem to complete a pass to save his life. I thought Devin looked good aside from a few rookie mental mistakes (in a huge road/rivalry game).
I've made fun of the "Devin should be starting qb" crowd in the past... But at this point I'm tempted to say we should use the bye and the Purdue game to transition to just that. Denard still has to be on the field of course.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:45 PM ^
that was a rich rod coached game, no blitzing, no changes, same shi* over and over. no screens, no more hard counts, this lost was on the coaches. Michigan played soft.
October 15th, 2011 at 4:51 PM ^
our defense could not read a single play, that motion td. u knew the ball was going to him, when they were motioning him. they always ran to the strong side and we still didn't adjust. we stop the run we win. but seem like we were more worried about thier pass. I guess we aren't even close to compete for a bigten. and when is Shane Morris gunna get here?
October 15th, 2011 at 4:47 PM ^
You guys are a bunch panty waisted retards. I am concerned some of you have the cognitive ability to regulate breathing and heart rate.
October 15th, 2011 at 5:00 PM ^
Won the turnover battle: 2 - 1
MSU Penalized: 13 times for 124 yards
MSU basically ran the same two blitzes all day: double LB's up the middle and CB & LB off the edge. And yet, playcalling didn't change much throughout the game & Denard apparently couldn't recognize it.
Fitz - 2 carries.
Smith - 7 carries.
Cousins' & Denard's numbers were not significantly different.
Baker: 167 rushing yards.
It's not hard to understand what went wrong. Absolutely horrible offensive preperation and play calling.
Also, all season Hoke has been saying the D-Line hasn't been getting off blocks, that was evident again today. No way the MSU O-Line should have looked that good.
Also, also, two sacks in the second half off three man rushes where Schofield was not helping double with Lewan.
October 15th, 2011 at 5:10 PM ^
I'm pissed that these coaches can't figure out what works and what doesn't, they're forcing Denard to be a pro style QB and it just doesn't work, deal with it.
October 15th, 2011 at 6:02 PM ^
Impact the really shitty effort of Denard passing? They can coach him all day long about setting up and throwing a clean motion, but if he starts happy feeting and lobbing off his back foot, how is it still the coaches fault.
On the other hand, yes that fourth and one call stunk to high heaven and even down to hell.
October 15th, 2011 at 7:00 PM ^
I thought the offensive game planning was absolutely atrocious. You have the best, most explosive, dynamic player in college football and you run less than a handful of designed runs for him (and a buttload of designed passes on a windy day no less)? This was also the case in the first half of the NW game last week. Fortunately Borges ran Denard 15X's in the 2nd Half and they won last week.
I have no problem with inserting Devin Gardner and I love how we've been going for it on 4th down's. What I don't understand is why the repeated attempts to use Vincent Smith on first down and the lack of designed runs for Denard? I think I don't understand it because I'm not retarded. We put ourselves in so many shitty long 3rd down's b/c of our 1st down play calling.
Bottom line: Denard should have run the ball 40 times, if necessary. That is, 40 designed runs if that's what it takes (or 20 or 50, until they show they can stop him). If we're not the better team, I'd rather lose with them stopping our best weapon (even it means increasing the probability for injury). We should have seen much more Denard on the ground. There was one set of down's where they allowed Denard to run 3 times in a row and we got a first down after being stopped several times prior.
Personally, I think what we saw from Borges today was worse than anything I can remember from Debord. And that should worry even the most diehard optimists on this board. Despite the link to Carr, I've been trying to keep an open mind about this hire. I'm afraid the evidence from today's game has made the biggest impression on me thus far.