In addition to too many years of bad football and basketball this poll reflects UM-Ann Arbor's highly selective admissions policy and its practice of admitting large numbers of out-of-state students who then leave Michigan. The result is that fewer and fewer Michiganians actually have family and friends who are UM alumni. In contrast, lots more have friends and family with MSU ties.
MSU has become practically the university of Michigan while Michigan has become the University of New York, LA, Chicago, the United States and the world. UM probably polls better in Winnetka, IL than it does in Farmington, MI.
Rick Snyder is the first Michigan alumnus to be elected governor since G. Mennen Williams, over fifty years. In that same time, MSU has produced two governors -- Blanchard and Engler -- and whole lot of legislators.
Didn't Monahan also give Bo an A2 Domino's franchise to stay at Michigan back then? Given the amount of that crap we ate, that alone would have been worth a fortune.
Thoughts on the Stormy Tenure of Michigan Coach Rich Rodriguez From a Writer Who Was There
"When Michigan's 63-year-old head coach, Lloyd Carr, announced his retirement in 2007 after 13 seasons, athletic director Bill Martin seemed genuinely surprised. At the outset of a monthlong search for his successor, ESPN reported what just about everyone suspected: former U-M player and assistant Les Miles, who was about to lead Louisiana State to a national title, would succeed Mr. Carr.
But contrary to popular belief and published reports, Michigan never tried to contact Mr. Miles, and his calls to Ann Arbor went unreturned.(Mr. Martin, who's now chairman of Bank of Ann Arbor, said Wednesday that he had been traveling in search of a coach.) Mr. Martin instead offered the position to Rutgers' Greg Schiano, who turned Michigan down..."
Occam's razor. The simplest explanation tends to be the correct one.
Rich Rod lost too many games. He lost all the big games. He lost by a lot. He had no defense. He had no kicking game. The so-called improvement on offense (that never really scored a lot of points against good competition) consisted entirely of one player. After OSU and Miss State, Brandon's email in-box must have been a sight to behold.
Because of all that the fanbase and alumni were on the verge of revolt. They were starting to vote with their feet and their wallets. When, aftet two years with no bowl game anywhere, Michigan cannot sell out its full alotment of tickets to a New Year's Day bowl game in Florida, something is seriously wrong. From that, one can make a pretty educated guess about the emails Brandon was getting that threatened the ticket base in Mich Stadium.
If UM does not sell out UM Stadium the whole house collapses. DB knows that. No way could Brandon toletate in 2011 a repeat of the 2009 OSU game where there seemed to be as much scarlet & gray in Michigan Stadium as maize & blue and the S&G was more vocal. Brandon had no choice but to terminate.
"I live in Columbus, and people are actually beginning to be frightened of Michigan's offense."
This poster comes across as so counter factual and delusional that I think it may be an attempt at satire.
I live in Columbus too and I assure down here they are as "frightened" of Michigan's offense as they are any MAC school. The fact they love Rich Rod down here is all the proof of that one needs. The worse part of being a UM fan down here is that they hardly think of UM in terms of a real rivalry any more. Sure they pay lip service but no one gets especially energized about it. It is assumed that OSU will cream Michigan.
"We'll beat Ohio State when we're a better team than Ohio State. It's that simple."
"Vince Lombardi could come, too, and it's not going to fix some of the problems we have on defense," ~ Rich Rodriguez
That proof enough for you?
RR sure knows how to inspire the team. Real Knute Rockne, our Richie. The players must really appreciate a vote of confidence like those. Really fire 'em to go out and put their bodies on the line against the hordes from Columbus.
Words like that would never come out of Jim Harbaugh's mouth about a Michigan team he coaches.
Your analysis is really an argument against keeping Rich Rod.
That fact that Stoops won a National Championship in Year 2; Corker in Year 1; Tressel in Year 2; Carroll in Year 3; Meyer in Years 2 and 4; Miles in Year 3; and Saban in Year 3 just makes comparisons with Rich Rod at UM all the more pathetic. Rich Rod's barely eking out a winning record in Year 3 just makes his failings all the more glaring.
Rather than being competitive for a national championship or even a Big Ten title in his Year 3, Rich Rod's signature accomplishment is now having UM fans thinkings in terms of "games we are supposed to lose". Rich Rod's next most noteworthy accomplishments are to have divided one half of the UM fanbase against the other and to get the pro-Rich Rod half to clutch at straws which, with all due respect, is all your post is.
You need to better inform yourself about Michigan football history.
UM's greatest period of football success was not the 40's. It was the 39 consecutive winning (with one .500) seasons that ended upon the beginning of the Rich Rod nightmare.
2. Chris Spielman is quoted as saying that Mike Martin is the only UM defensive player who could start at OSU. Spielman is right. And that's after two complete RR recruiting classes? That is just unacceptable.
This is poster child material for delusional Rich Rod supporters -- in their minds Michigan will only get exponentially better while all other teams will stagnate or get worse.
So, then, the best explanation is that Rich Rod just did not know that to succeed in college football generally and the Big Ten in particular he needed both an offense and a defense.?
"Would Denard reverting to early season form be a miracle?"
Yes.
That's because it would take a miracle for Michigan to get to play Connecticut, Massachusetts or Notre Dame next week. Its pretty obvious that Denard's early season form had as much to do with the low caliber of the competition as with anything else.
Maybe Rich Rod's first call should have been to Mallett instead of Pryor. Oh. Right. Mallett didn't fit Rich Rod's "system". (That would be the "system" that decimates teams that can baredly beat anybody else but is unable to beat teams that have actual overall winning records.)
In addition to his being exactly right about that facts, here's the worst part about Spielman's comments -- the genuine remorse and sadness in Spielman's voice as he talks about the decline of a once great football program and worthy rival.
Spielman's a football purist and a Buckeye to his marrow. He knows it does the Buckeyes no good to see their greatest conference rival decline into mediocrity season in and season out.
What is the minimum number of wins Rich Rod has to get next year to get a year 4? Six? Seven? Eight? And against what teams do these wins come?
Brian Kelly took over Cinci in 2007, just a year before RR took over UM.
The year before Kelly got to Cinci it went 7-5. Same as Michigan in Carr's last season. Cinci is a basketball school with no real football tradition. But, in just his second year at Cinci, Kelly was 11-2. Cinci is now 12-0 and is the 4th ranked team in the nation going into the bowl season.
In your wildest dreams do you see RR going 12-0 or being ranked 4th at the end of next season, in his third year?
Ask yourself, why is that such a ridiculous expectation? Answer: Rich Rod's system is so specific to its needs that it cannot produce results in the same time frame that Kelly was able to at Cinci or a dozen other coaches were able to at other schools. IOW, RR and his system are the problem,not the solution.
Michael Rosenburg's supposed "double standard" is no doubt why the NCAA found sufficient cause (that is, evidence) to commence the first formal NCAA investigation into the Michigan football program in its history.
http://tinyurl.com/yk9t28n
And Rosenburg's alleged double standard is also the reason that Rodriguez' football program failed to file the monthly Countable Athletically Related Activities (CARA) forms that track how much players work out and practice; a tool UM developed to fulfill its obligation to comply with NCAA rules.
You Rich Rod supporters let your loyalty to a failing coach run away with your common sense.
RR's accent explains it all. That's why these same fans despised and disrespected Lloyd Carr for every minute of the 13 years he won for UM -- because of his pronounced Tennessee hillbilly accent. [Sarcasm off]
The Triumph of Hope Over Experience...a/k/a The None So Blind as Those Who Won't See,
Through sheer force of will these RR supporters will themselves to ignore all the facts that compel the conclusion RR was, is, and always will be a bust. Best characterized by the "wait'll RR gets his recruits in place ..." types these RR have no answer for the conundrums: (1) How many years will it now take for RR to reach the same winning percentage that got Charlie Weis fired? (Answer, RR cannot realistically expect to ever reach that high lofty plateau of .565 in the four years he has remaining on his current contract. (
2) How is it that Urban Meyer and Paul Johnson -- both gurus of the same spread option RR proclaims -- were able to win in their second years at Florida and Georgia Tech? Why was it not necessary to take those programs down to nothing before they could be built back up?
(2) How many years are you willing to accept Michiocrity for the once fabled UM football program before you jump off the RR bandwagon? We know the answer is no less than three. But if three, why not four? And if four, why not five? or six? (The Rodrigexcuse will just transform from ... I don't have my guys ... to ... my guys are hurt, or academically ineligible, or in prison (e.g., Feagin. Remember that savior?) ... whatever...
As it is now, other Big Ten coaches are at this very moment sitting in recruit living rooms telling kids that UM has not been to a bowl in two years, and no player on the team has ever beaten OSU, and no coach or player recruited by them has ever beaten MSU, PSU, OSU, Illinois or ... Toledo... and, having now learned a lesson about what a REAL football school is like, if RR ever is successful he's going to bolt UM for the SEC first chance he gets.
In HIS second year at OSU Jim Tressel won a national championship.
In HIS second year at USC Pete Carroll went 11-2 and ended the season ranked #4.
In HIS second year at Alaban Nick Saban went 12-2 and a number 6 ranking.
In HIS second year at Cincinatti Brian Kelly went 10-3 and was ranked 17th and 20th.
Great coaches find a way to win with the talent they have.
Last year the Rich Rod supporters were going on about "progress". OK, where's the progress? Not in your hearts, but in the numbers? The way it is shaping up, the only progress is the fluke win against the only major team with a worse coach than RR and this year, unlike last, RR managed to beat all his non-conference cream puffs.
Wake up. RR is on track to a worse ... WORSE ... Big Ten record in 09 than he had in 08. That's not progress, that's getting worse.
Rodriguez could be a terrific offensive coordinator. He is not a head coach.
One definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and thinking you'll get a different result.
Its amazing how many posters here are "all in" for Rich Rod despite the the ample evidence the program is going backward.
It was just three years ago this program was ranked #2 going into its next to last game. Just 24 months ago this team was ranked #13 going into its eleventh game. Playing in a New Years Day Bowl was a given.
Explain why a "program" with that consistency of success needed to be overhauled to the point where the Motor City Bowl is an outside ... OUTSIDE !! chance and getting a bid for it would be considered a major accomplishment.
Time to cut losses and reload with a coach who knows that winning football consists of more than an arrogantly personal offensive "system".
Rich Rod = the most overpaid offensive coordinator in football.
At the rate they both are going, Ryan Mallett will win the Heisman Trophy before Rich Rod wins a Big Ten Championship.
Heck, at the rate the two are presently going, Mallett will win the Super Bowl before Rich Rod beats all of Notre Dame, MSU, PSU and OSU in the same seaon.
Comparisons of Rich Rod to Tressel, at least, are unfair.
Concerning Tressel, At the eight game mark of this second year at OSU Tressel was 8-0 (15-5 overall) and on the verge of winning his first BCS championship.
Rich Rod? 5-3 (thanks to his being the scourge of the MAC and DSU), amd 8-12 overall.
They're laughing their a$$es off in Columbus.
Recent Comments
In addition to too many years of bad football and basketball this poll reflects UM-Ann Arbor's highly selective admissions policy and its practice of admitting large numbers of out-of-state students who then leave Michigan. The result is that fewer and fewer Michiganians actually have family and friends who are UM alumni. In contrast, lots more have friends and family with MSU ties.
MSU has become practically the university of Michigan while Michigan has become the University of New York, LA, Chicago, the United States and the world. UM probably polls better in Winnetka, IL than it does in Farmington, MI.
Rick Snyder is the first Michigan alumnus to be elected governor since G. Mennen Williams, over fifty years. In that same time, MSU has produced two governors -- Blanchard and Engler -- and whole lot of legislators.
Didn't Monahan also give Bo an A2 Domino's franchise to stay at Michigan back then? Given the amount of that crap we ate, that alone would have been worth a fortune.
"I asked my dad, "how can you not bring this back for next year?!""
The 42 - 0 can of whupass that Mississippi State then dumped over Rich Rod like a cooler of Gatorade should have answered that question for you.
Get a new screen name.
Here's something Dantanio managed to do before Rich Rod -- win two Big Ten games in the Big House.
Inside a College-Football Tragicomedy
Thoughts on the Stormy Tenure of Michigan Coach Rich Rodriguez From a Writer Who Was There
"When Michigan's 63-year-old head coach, Lloyd Carr, announced his retirement in 2007 after 13 seasons, athletic director Bill Martin seemed genuinely surprised. At the outset of a monthlong search for his successor, ESPN reported what just about everyone suspected: former U-M player and assistant Les Miles, who was about to lead Louisiana State to a national title, would succeed Mr. Carr.
But contrary to popular belief and published reports, Michigan never tried to contact Mr. Miles, and his calls to Ann Arbor went unreturned.(Mr. Martin, who's now chairman of Bank of Ann Arbor, said Wednesday that he had been traveling in search of a coach.) Mr. Martin instead offered the position to Rutgers' Greg Schiano, who turned Michigan down..."
http://tinyurl.com/32r2s2v
Why did Brandon fire Rich Rod?
Occam's razor. The simplest explanation tends to be the correct one.
Rich Rod lost too many games. He lost all the big games. He lost by a lot. He had no defense. He had no kicking game. The so-called improvement on offense (that never really scored a lot of points against good competition) consisted entirely of one player. After OSU and Miss State, Brandon's email in-box must have been a sight to behold.
Because of all that the fanbase and alumni were on the verge of revolt. They were starting to vote with their feet and their wallets. When, aftet two years with no bowl game anywhere, Michigan cannot sell out its full alotment of tickets to a New Year's Day bowl game in Florida, something is seriously wrong. From that, one can make a pretty educated guess about the emails Brandon was getting that threatened the ticket base in Mich Stadium.
If UM does not sell out UM Stadium the whole house collapses. DB knows that. No way could Brandon toletate in 2011 a repeat of the 2009 OSU game where there seemed to be as much scarlet & gray in Michigan Stadium as maize & blue and the S&G was more vocal. Brandon had no choice but to terminate.
Pretty simple, really.
Agreed
If you think RR should get four years then there is no reason to think he should not get five.
"I live in Columbus, and people are actually beginning to be frightened of Michigan's offense."
This poster comes across as so counter factual and delusional that I think it may be an attempt at satire.
I live in Columbus too and I assure down here they are as "frightened" of Michigan's offense as they are any MAC school. The fact they love Rich Rod down here is all the proof of that one needs. The worse part of being a UM fan down here is that they hardly think of UM in terms of a real rivalry any more. Sure they pay lip service but no one gets especially energized about it. It is assumed that OSU will cream Michigan.
"I want the "next thing" not because it's shiny and new. I want it because I want the continued success it has been proven to bring."
Let's examine that "proven" part a bit
3-9
5-7
7-5 (getting throttled by Iowa, MSU, PSU and OSU and barely eking out wins against doormats Indiana and Illinois)
Three straight losses to MSU, PSU, Iowa, and OSU.
First losing season in 38 years
First no-bowl season in 33 years
First back to back losing seasons in nearly 50 years
First major NCAA violations
"We'll beat Ohio State when we're a better team than Ohio State"
KISS. Its about the losing.
"We'll beat Ohio State when we're a better team than Ohio State. It's that simple."
"Vince Lombardi could come, too, and it's not going to fix some of the problems we have on defense," ~ Rich Rodriguez
That proof enough for you?
RR sure knows how to inspire the team. Real Knute Rockne, our Richie. The players must really appreciate a vote of confidence like those. Really fire 'em to go out and put their bodies on the line against the hordes from Columbus.
Words like that would never come out of Jim Harbaugh's mouth about a Michigan team he coaches.
Ever.
Your analysis is really an argument against keeping Rich Rod.
That fact that Stoops won a National Championship in Year 2; Corker in Year 1; Tressel in Year 2; Carroll in Year 3; Meyer in Years 2 and 4; Miles in Year 3; and Saban in Year 3 just makes comparisons with Rich Rod at UM all the more pathetic. Rich Rod's barely eking out a winning record in Year 3 just makes his failings all the more glaring.
Rather than being competitive for a national championship or even a Big Ten title in his Year 3, Rich Rod's signature accomplishment is now having UM fans thinkings in terms of "games we are supposed to lose". Rich Rod's next most noteworthy accomplishments are to have divided one half of the UM fanbase against the other and to get the pro-Rich Rod half to clutch at straws which, with all due respect, is all your post is.
You need to better inform
You need to better inform yourself about Michigan football history.
UM's greatest period of football success was not the 40's. It was the 39 consecutive winning (with one .500) seasons that ended upon the beginning of the Rich Rod nightmare.
What that guy said.
1. We're not going to beat the effing Buckeyes.
2. Chris Spielman is quoted as saying that Mike Martin is the only UM defensive player who could start at OSU. Spielman is right. And that's after two complete RR recruiting classes? That is just unacceptable.
There has to be accountability.
Wojo is right.
Best catcher not in the
Best catcher not in the Hall of Fame. (which he should be IMHO)
This is poster child material for delusional Rich Rod supporters -- in their minds Michigan will only get exponentially better while all other teams will stagnate or get worse.
So, then, the best explanation is that Rich Rod just did not know that to succeed in college football generally and the Big Ten in particular he needed both an offense and a defense.?
Fire. RR. Now.
Rich Rod is nothing but a $3 million a year offensive coordinator.
Dave Brandon is starting to sound an awful lot like the Lions GM's over the years. Always evaluatin', always explainin' ... always losin'
"Would Denard reverting to early season form be a miracle?"
Yes.
That's because it would take a miracle for Michigan to get to play Connecticut, Massachusetts or Notre Dame next week. Its pretty obvious that Denard's early season form had as much to do with the low caliber of the competition as with anything else.
Yeah? Go through the
Yeah? Go through the 2011 schedule and tell us "haters" where those 9 wins are going to come from.
"makes me feel like i'm cheering for northwestern."
Careful, there. Michigan is lucky it did not have to play Northwestern.
Maybe Rich Rod's first
Maybe Rich Rod's first call should have been to Mallett instead of Pryor. Oh. Right. Mallett didn't fit Rich Rod's "system". (That would be the "system" that decimates teams that can baredly beat anybody else but is unable to beat teams that have actual overall winning records.)
"It's a game we were supposed to lose..."
Don't you love the way Rich Rod has transformed the vaunted Michigan football program? Used to be there were no games Michigan was "supposed to lose".
"You act like Michigan is going to be like this for the next 15 years. They're not."
True enough. Rich Rod will get fired eventually and then this nightmare will end.
"(sorry, but it would be a minor miracle for Michigan to beat OSU in Columbus next week)."
Miracle, yes. Minor, no.
"Where RR is just one excuse away from history..."
EXCELLENT!!
You ought to trademark that.
In addition to his being exactly right about that facts, here's the worst part about Spielman's comments -- the genuine remorse and sadness in Spielman's voice as he talks about the decline of a once great football program and worthy rival.
Spielman's a football purist and a Buckeye to his marrow. He knows it does the Buckeyes no good to see their greatest conference rival decline into mediocrity season in and season out.
But Rich Rod will get another year. That sucks.
Just glad Bo is not around to see it.
Forbes online has a story speculating that this could cost ND $30 million in damages.
http://blogs.forbes.com/sportsmoney/2010/11/01/declan-sullivans-death-c…
Michigan pleads guilty to
Michigan pleads guilty to five major infractions, gets three years probation and yet you guys blame the messenger?!?
You've lost perspective.
"But this thing is happening. It just tagged the 4th best defense in the nation for 522 yards."
And it still lost 38-28. Where does one find "moral victories" in the box score?
"This thing" also has no defense and no kicking game.
One definition of
One definition of Meechigan football should be not losing to MSU three years in a row.
Nobody ever went to
Nobody ever went to Michigan because they got rejected for admission to MSU.
(Yeah, yeah, I know. YOU really were admitted to Michigan but CHOSE to go to MSU. About that bridge in Brooklyn...)