WagerTalk.com Talks Michigan vs Penn St, One Of Them Says The QB, Not Jim Harbaugh, Is The Problem
October 17th, 2019 at 6:01 PM ^
I hate to say it but I also think Shea is the issue. The weird thing is that he was very efficient last year so it could possibly be Gattis and the new system.
October 17th, 2019 at 6:46 PM ^
If you failed in life would you blame your parents? If not them, who? Is Gattis fumbling the football? Do you understand, yet? I blame you for Shea’s inefficiency. Can you understand yet? Well that’s how you sound by saying Gattis is the reason a Senior is struggling with HIS performance. It’s called self responsibility.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:47 PM ^
People who don’t know shit about the game always blame the coaches. It doesn’t take much film study to recognize how Patterson struggles mightily to make even simple reads on the field. Not holding the ball on that fourth-down run at Illinois, the interception against Iowa, there is only so much that coaching can do before the player has to execute.
October 17th, 2019 at 8:58 PM ^
Good God... Your meds are in the cabinet in the bathroom... Please go take them
October 17th, 2019 at 7:08 PM ^
In year 5, if the QB is the issue, then the "QB guru" head coach is also the issue.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:13 PM ^
Did Harbaugh ever refer to himself as a "QB guru"?
October 17th, 2019 at 7:14 PM ^
Lol. Of course not.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:35 PM ^
Nitpick my comment however you want, but QB is the position Harbaugh knows best. He played it at the highest level and has coached it. If there is any position on his team that should be playing at a consistently high level, its the QB spot. The fact that we have a former 5-star, senior and returning starter QB playing this poorly is on Harbaugh. Of course Shea himself take some of the blame, but when you see Shea, 2017 Speight and 2017 O'Korn all play with a lack of confidence, being careless with the football, making dumb decisions and often times looking totally clueless, that is a QB development issue that falls on Jim Harbaugh.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:58 PM ^
100% agree. Year 5 and JH hasn't started a QB he's recruited that was even moderately good. His transfer QBs seem to get worse the longer they're in the program. Very puzzling and troubling from a coach who played QB in the NFL and should theoretically understand how to coach/develop QBs.
Cue the excuses...
October 17th, 2019 at 8:38 PM ^
I think this has something to do with the constant transfers in/out of the program at QB, combined with the ever-changing offensive coordinators/scheme. Seems like there isn't any solid base for the QB to develop. For example, Shea transferred in, had to learn a slogging game/clock management pro style offense, and now has to go and learn a "speed in space" spread style. Might explain why he is having trouble making reads. With the flashes of greatness that I've seen from Shea, I'm holding out hope that the offense starts to click for him, he can start making the right reads and getting the ball to the open receiver, and we can win some big games down the stretch.
October 17th, 2019 at 11:42 PM ^
Yeah, Justin fields is struggling with his new offense too.
October 19th, 2019 at 9:50 AM ^
Logged in to like.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:15 PM ^
Quick question. I’ll be simple with this one. Whose fault is it that the QB is not protecting the ball?
October 17th, 2019 at 7:35 PM ^
Whichever coach(es) are giving him too much to handle/putting too much pressure/messing with his rhythm and instincts too much.
Shea has too much on his plate this season. Who put it there? Who knows. His instincts (at Ole Miss and at UM) have been phenomenal.
Could be Harbaugh, could be Gattis, likely it's both (obviously).
There were 3 fumbles all year last year. Again Karan Higdon was easily the most valuable player on the team last year, he fought like an animal for yardage, danced behind the LOS multiple times converting key, game-winning/drive-sustaining first-downs, and hit a few nice home-run TDs, so not having him certainly hurts.
But Shea is clearly overwhelmed, and it could be Harbaugh micro-managing (anyone could easily see that happening), and it could be the new scheme (anyone coud easily see that happening too). And it could be Shea himself simply trying to do too much and put the team on is shoulder playing HeroBall (anyone could easily see that happening as well).
It's likely all three factors, and sadly, I doubt anyting will change.
October 17th, 2019 at 8:37 PM ^
One thing Shea is definitely NOT doing is playing hero ball. Hero ball to me would be him carrying the ball around 10 times a game and taking multiple deep shots.
October 17th, 2019 at 9:31 PM ^
The volume of fumbles makes no sense to me after only three all of last year. THREE for the season. I can't believe the constant fumbling; seems a lack of focus and or attention to detail
October 17th, 2019 at 10:05 PM ^
JR3410, joined in August, 2018. I have your number.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:26 PM ^
Can't believe we're in year 5 and not playing a Harbaugh recruited QB from HS.
If Shea is the problem, then it's Harbaughs fault for having him on the roster in year 5.
October 17th, 2019 at 8:14 PM ^
Well...…
The coaching staff walked Peters to a door and said - late brah.
Seemed like they had every intention of getting DMac snaps, and for good reason. Doubt he's been available. If he is I would say Shea is on a short leash.
Anyone who thinks Milton is ready is kidding themselves.
October 17th, 2019 at 10:51 PM ^
Agreed. Milton isn’t close to being close.
October 17th, 2019 at 11:10 PM ^
Disagreed.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:46 PM ^
He’s regressed. Hopefully he’s a scratch golfer though.
October 17th, 2019 at 10:38 PM ^
while I would normally agree with you, I will say this....
QBs under Harbaugh seem to underperform...much like Shea is. ALL OF THEM COME IN highly touted, and few of them have left with accolades.
This isn't to say that this is Harbaugh's doing...but QBs seem to regress here.
October 17th, 2019 at 6:02 PM ^
Win the game
October 17th, 2019 at 6:04 PM ^
Never thought of that. What a concept. I wonder how he came to that conclusion?
October 17th, 2019 at 6:09 PM ^
So wait the problem is the QB not the head coach who continues to play said QB?? Interesting take
October 17th, 2019 at 6:18 PM ^
Every time someone posts this, I automatically think back to the Minnesota game where Gardner was benched in favor of Shane Morris. It did not go well.
Fast forward to 2019: One backup QB has a tendency to get hurt when given significant playing time and has already been out for multiple weeks with a concussion. The other backup QB has thrown more interceptions than TDs in garbage time.
Now, neither of those guys are Shane Morris, but isn't it just possible Harbaugh keeps trotting Shea out there because he's the best option?
The real question IMO is why Patterson seems to have regressed. That's a legit criticism of the coaching staff, and I can't believe McDaniels isn't getting more heat there, too. Isn't that his job? It's not all on Harbaugh.
October 17th, 2019 at 6:22 PM ^
Shea is playing because he continues to be the best option. I do think that Dylan was going to get a bunch more playing time but got injured in the Wisconsin game. I think you will see him get at least two possessions Saturday night.
October 17th, 2019 at 6:22 PM ^
So the deepest QB room in the nation was a myth?
Don’t forget The regression of another returning QB.
They haven’t coached the position very well. Blame whoever you want, kids, Jim, Pep, Gattis, McDaniels, Drevno, etc.
I’m not even asking for another QB but to blame the kid they keep trotting out as the problem while ignoring the fact they have gotten no one else ready to take his spot is quite the blame game and scapegoating Jim
October 17th, 2019 at 6:30 PM ^
It was a myth, however, I still have faith in Harbaugh's ability to develop QBs. He made Jake look great in 2015 and made Wilton Speight into a serviceable qb until he got injured. Think about that for a minute. We went 20-6 with those two qbs. Shit, he even made Kaepernick into a decent qb for a few years and he has less talent than almost any qb who ever played in a Super Bowl.
October 17th, 2019 at 6:34 PM ^
Jake put up very similar numbers as he did at Iowa. Speight was downright awful in year two people forget how bad he was looking. Purdue game he couldn’t move the offense similar to what we’ve seen this year.
Don’t care about the NFL and he had Greg Roman.
October 17th, 2019 at 6:39 PM ^
Greg Roman = offensive genius.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:45 PM ^
There is more and more data suggesting Roman is the one who knew what to do with a mobile Quarterback,
October 17th, 2019 at 6:49 PM ^
Keyword:almost
October 17th, 2019 at 6:27 PM ^
Hey buddy you listen hear, Joe Milton is high flying athlete and I’ve scoured through his 247 highlight film and I know he’s cardale Jones
October 17th, 2019 at 6:42 PM ^
He probably is the best option but that’s on the head coach. The head coach that was brought in as a QB guru. He’s had ample opportunity to bring in his guys and they’ve all been a disappointment with the exception of Rudock.
October 17th, 2019 at 6:51 PM ^
Pretty sure his take on Milton was total sarcasm. Go look at his high light real and then you will see.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:19 PM ^
If there’s such a high light I’d probably just reach for it! If Joe Milton is not a good QB it’s his fault also? Whew. Well I’ll just take a few hours away from the board tonight it’s becoming slightly confusing at the moment.
October 17th, 2019 at 8:46 PM ^
Sorry Wes but fans like you make no sense to me. You speak in rhetoric, and it’s weird.
October 17th, 2019 at 10:07 PM ^
Wes, you’ll be ok.
October 17th, 2019 at 6:48 PM ^
Preeeeeach!! I completely agree thru n thru
Go Blue
October 17th, 2019 at 7:05 PM ^
Agreed about McDaniels. And I always come back to reality and you can only with what you have. If you cannot teach a senior new tricks it's not going to happen.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:12 PM ^
Your point is valid, but you have to also admit that there is a possibility that we would be better off playing McCaffrey and we haven't for one a few possible reasons: injury, hoping Shea figures things out, change adverse, etc.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:31 PM ^
Saying you don’t play the backup because he’s been hurt a couple of times is not wise. Shea is not the best option Harbaugh is just stubborn when it comes to his starting QB. Some of it I’m sure is because he was a QB and doesn’t want the starter looking over their shoulder. But he needs to get past that and realize Shea is not getting the job done. This offense needs a qb that can effectively run a read option and also have the ability to stand tall in the pocket and go through progressions. Shea has not shown the ability to do either and it has made our offense stagnate and easier to defend. I would love to see Dylan get some serious playing time and see if can make this offense click
October 17th, 2019 at 7:31 PM ^
So when is Harbaugh going to fix the QB problem? Not like he hasn’t had time to recruit and develop a QB. I think we had 10+ years of putting our starting QB in the NFL under Moeller/Carr. So now it is too much to ask to get one serviceable QB in 5 years.
October 17th, 2019 at 7:43 PM ^
This is dumb.
October 17th, 2019 at 6:15 PM ^
Home alone face, wow what deep analyses of Michigan, he must be making money hand over fist
October 17th, 2019 at 6:16 PM ^
Shea may be the problem this year, but Harbaugh has been the problem overall in terms of QB development. In his 5 years we've had more seasons of downright bad QB play (2017, this year) than good QB play (2nd half of 2015, 2018). You have freshmen and sophomores starting all over the place, but a guy like McCaffrey can barely see the field and when he has been on the field he's looked like solely a running threat. QB development, IMO, has been the biggest reason why we have yet to reach the pinnacle under JH.
October 17th, 2019 at 6:25 PM ^
This. We can keep trying to make excuses all we want, but QB development has been shit for years and years. Hard to field high powered offenses when the QB derps all the time.
October 17th, 2019 at 6:28 PM ^
And this is Shea’s third or fourth OC since he started college. He looked like a different player at Ole Miss.