Talking Cars Tuesday - Vehicles for Young/New Drivers
Mates,
I know, its not Tuesday and I am not JeepinBen. Guilty as charged. But in my defense, Thursday is the only other day of the week that starts with a 'T', the two days are like kissing cousins. Also, I have read posts by JeepinBen, so we are like brothers. (with apologies to JeepinBen)
We are at that point where the young ones are turning into driver-eligible teenagers faster than sparty commits felonies. I have an old farm pick up that is semi-reliable and they can drive that but I think I need to add to the fleet. I am well-versed in pickups, but the vehicle that has caught my eye lately is the generic Subaru from, say, 2005-2012 time period. Seems like low cost, and AWD is a biggie for us living up north. We have 1 tons/pick-ups so maybe something smaller now? Please remember we are country mice so our budget is limited. So the two questions are:
1. Would/did you ever own a Subaru? Please share the good and the bad - reliability, mileage, safety, cost to repair, whatever you've got.
2. Regardless of your answer to Q #1, what do you think are good vehicles for new drivers? I am particularly interested in 4WD/AWD rigs, but of course others may benefit from your suggestions of regular 2WD vehicles.
XM
January 17th, 2019 at 11:28 AM ^
and you can neg me all day if you'd like. i was fresh out of gravy recipes.
January 17th, 2019 at 12:04 PM ^
At least you didn’t fall into a wormhole and post a posbang on a Thursday...(looks in mirror...face palm)
January 17th, 2019 at 12:19 PM ^
dude, i want to party with you....
January 17th, 2019 at 12:22 PM ^
ha ha - challenge accepted.
January 17th, 2019 at 1:32 PM ^
There was an episode on Planet Money about how Subaru found out that lesbians really liked Subaru so they started marketing to gays. I always wondered how they managed to stay in business. It was a pretty good episode.
Edit:
https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2018/09/05/644984060/episode-729-when-subaru-came-out
January 18th, 2019 at 10:03 AM ^
Late to the conversation. But love this talk. I will get to do this in 10 years and love to occasionally play the game, "what car would I buy now if I were 16 again".
I haven't owned a Subaru, but have friends that have, and they loved them. In Colorado, they are bought a lot for the folk that love to travel into the snow in the mountains.
Not sure if this is sound advice or not, but I paid for a lot of my first car, with some help from my grandparents to get a little nicer car based on how much I saved for it. Even though it was still a beater, it was my beater car, and I worked hard to keep it in good shape. Having the kids take ownership of the car will hopefully mean they will make sure to make it last.
I'd love a follow up on the decision. Kids cars are both the best and worst cars at the same time.
January 18th, 2019 at 10:03 AM ^
Late to the conversation. But love this talk. I will get to do this in 10 years and love to occasionally play the game, "what car would I buy now if I were 16 again".
I haven't owned a Subaru, but have friends that have, and they loved them. In Colorado, they are bought a lot for the folk that love to travel into the snow in the mountains.
Not sure if this is sound advice or not, but I paid for a lot of my first car, with some help from my grandparents to get a little nicer car based on how much I saved for it. Even though it was still a beater, it was my beater car, and I worked hard to keep it in good shape. Having the kids take ownership of the car will hopefully mean they will make sure to make it last.
I'd love a follow up on the decision. Kids cars are both the best and worst cars at the same time.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:30 AM ^
If you get a Subaru in those years with at or above 100,000 miles, make sure the timing belt has been done. They are notorious for failing around then and then you have a big problem on your hands if it does. Very good car though, a lot of kids drive them up here in northern MIchigan.
January 17th, 2019 at 12:03 PM ^
Are they interference engines?
January 17th, 2019 at 12:25 PM ^
yes. The timing belt went on my '07 Legacy at around 120k miles. Engine was destroyed.
January 17th, 2019 at 12:28 PM ^
I despise interference engines. I'm sure there is a reason for them but I can't tell what it is. And all interference engines should have CHAINS
January 17th, 2019 at 12:05 PM ^
I own a 2014 outback with around 60k miles on it. Do you know if its obvious when the timing belt needs to be changed from wear? Or is it best to just proactively do it before 100k?
January 17th, 2019 at 12:26 PM ^
Proactive. Change it around 90K would be my recommendation
January 17th, 2019 at 12:47 PM ^
100k miles is a good number. Subaru is known for head gasket failures causing leaks also.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:34 AM ^
My g/f has a Subaru Outback and loves it. We're in TN but have driven it through snow, and Subarus are known for being great in snow and yuck.
My first car was a Ford Pinto manual transmission. We called it "Jaws" because the top of the front grill was ripped off in ragged fashion. It had strips of nylon where the seat covers once existed. Only car I've driven where pedestrians would see it, stop, point and laugh. The clutch was incredibly touchy so it would stall whenever I tried to shift in low gears. It was a fantastic (albeit frustrating) way to learn to drive a stick. Probably irrelevant these days with fancy-shmancy gear shifts, but thought I'd share a bit of nostalgia and encourage you that first cars needn't be fancy or new.
Anyway, a used Subaru seems like an ideal first car to me.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:37 AM ^
what year is your gal's subaru?
post picture of pinto. a classic.
January 17th, 2019 at 12:23 PM ^
2017. Would love to post a photo, but I don't think I have one--would have to ask my mom if she has one tucked away. I believe that color photography was discovered the prior year.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:55 AM ^
Whereabouts? We live just south of Nashville in the countryside of the suburbs.
January 17th, 2019 at 12:12 PM ^
Franklin?
January 17th, 2019 at 2:45 PM ^
Nice! So do I.
January 17th, 2019 at 2:54 PM ^
Columbia and Goose Creek. Used to be a massive farm and then subdivided into smaller farms.
January 18th, 2019 at 11:29 AM ^
We're tucked away behind the Ag Center off of Peytonsville.
January 17th, 2019 at 12:27 PM ^
We're in East Nasty--Edgefield.
January 17th, 2019 at 2:49 PM ^
Nice. Good spot.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:35 AM ^
I like Subarus. Never owned one myself but a lot of my friends have and they last forever. What's great is even their sedans are AWD. My first car was a mid 2000s Toyota RAV4 and it was perfect. Compact SUVs with AWD I think is perfect for a new driver.
Edit to add: I was also looking at a Honda CR-V at the time. I currently work for one of the Big 3 so I'll recuse myself from making a specific recommendation.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:36 AM ^
I've never owned a Subaru, so I don't have an opinion on them.
As to your second question, I just put my MGoDaughter into a 2011 Nissan Rogue. It's AWD, and she loves it. I've been driving a 2016 for 3 years, have had no problems with mine. We got a great deal on her 2011, it had low miles, runs great, and had decent options (we did have after-market seat warmers put in because Iowa winters are cold). For the value, I'd recommend it as something to consider.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:38 AM ^
if you don't mind my asking, what was the cost of the '11 nissan?
January 17th, 2019 at 11:44 AM ^
I got it from the dealer where I got mine. After trade-in on her old car, haggling and everything, we got her into it for around $8k (but it only had 65,000 miles on it and a 1-owner car)
January 17th, 2019 at 11:57 AM ^
shoot me a note if you are ever in the market for a new Nissan. I can issue friends and family discounts.
jonathon dot nelson at gmail.com
January 17th, 2019 at 1:45 PM ^
I second the vote on a Nissan!! Love the 2 that I have owned!
January 17th, 2019 at 3:15 PM ^
Easily the best vehicle I've ever owned was a Nissan Xterra, kept me happy in California and up in Canada. Replaced it with a Jeep Cherokee Trailhawk, and while a good vehicle, its nothing compared to that Xterra, shame they did away with it.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:37 AM ^
You can't do any better than an unmodified (no lifts) late 90's Jeep Cherokee with a manual transmission. The trick is finding them. Learned to drive on one, very reliable. Repairs are easy and accessible if you like doing your own. Great visibility. Easy to steal though. (pop out the ignition cylinder and use a straight screwdriver to crank and you're on your way (thus the manual transmission)).
January 17th, 2019 at 12:08 PM ^
Everyone wants one of these things and it's drives the prices up a lot for a used vehicle.
Been looking for one for myself, and it's crazy what people are asking for one.
January 17th, 2019 at 12:17 PM ^
A few folks like to modify them for off-roading purposes. But they are just well-made vehicles. Word from an insider was that they stopped making them in part because dealerships couldn't make money on repairs. The product was just too good.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:38 AM ^
Had a ‘99 Forester until I needed a third row — new to about 100k miles. Great car in the snow, stuck to the pavement. Reliable. One of the best cars I’ve ever owned. Felt like an old pair of work gloves, almost a Mary Poppins practically perfect car.
Shopping now for my teens too, and am likely going Subaru.
I missed the gravy thread. Scratch always, and the magic trick is Wondra, it is amazing. Doesn’t need cold water, but better if u use it.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:42 AM ^
gravy threads. it was a heck of a day here yesterday, but so many of those wild threads turn into comedy fests so they tend to be pretty fun. not all of 'em, but many.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:40 AM ^
I currently own a 2018 Subaru Forester and really like it! Rides nicely, great in bad weather, comfortable, decent on gas, etc. If given the chance, I would likely purchase another. I have heard many stories about Subaru's lasting forever and being super safe. Sounds like a great car for a first time driver.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:42 AM ^
As naters pointed out, make sure the timing belt is done before purchasing and have a mechanic check the Head Gasket as well just in case.
I drive an old 2003 Subaru Forester as a winter beater and I love it...AWD is great and though it's small, it can fit a lot with the seats down. It's a bit ugly and some stuff doesn't work (CD Player, AC needs a charge), but it's a good, little car and would be a great first car.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:43 AM ^
Subarus are fine, my oldest had one until he wrecked it. My philosophy is get disposable cars for kids (Dad of 5) because they will crash/trash them. They are just for local driving. Here in Montana AWD or 4WD is a must to keep them safe as you can. I've also found studded tires an excellent investment.
Make plans when they slide into ditches and off the road, by having the equipment to pull them out. Spoken with experience haha
January 17th, 2019 at 11:47 AM ^
1. Don't know about Subaru in specific, but I assume any car making it's way onto the road is probably going to be pretty decent.
2. Your situation and needs are probably going to be a bit different than what many of the people here are used to. Growing up in a rural area, a BEATER truck with AWD or 4WD is probably what your first time drivers need. They need to be able to get out of trouble and in something you don't mind getting beaten up. I had an '81 GMC Sierra and while that truck was.....eccentric, it could go anywhere and was great for the situations I was in driving out of town for camping/hunting/scout projects/etc. Just my two cents. I think the car you're looking at is fine, but I do think you have to filter it through what your family's needs are and how your new drivers fit into them. Vs. just what the first time drivers need.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:48 AM ^
I am going through this right now with my 16 year old. I am leaning heavily toward an electric car for a couple of reasons.
First, range limitation is actually a positive for this purpose. I don't want her driving around more than necessary.
Second, she can just plug in at home and won't need a credit card for gas.
Third, used car prices are VERY LOW for electric cars. I can get a fairly new Leaf or Fiat e for $10k, and even BMW i3 for $15k.
Does anyone own any of these cars? How do you like them? Probably would be a good Tuesday car talk topic - feedback from electric car owners.
January 17th, 2019 at 11:57 AM ^
My oldest daughter is 14 and 6 months so eligible to start driving in 3 months in MI so I begrudgingly have to start thinking about the same thing. This was helpful and hopefully some others have feedback to add.
My dad has a Subaru Outback that I'm going to say is probably 2007 or 2008. Pretty reliable car with over 200K miles but has had some issues with it in the last year+ - mostly with the body (bearings, axles, etc) and not so much with the engine. I would have no problem getting one for my kids.
January 17th, 2019 at 12:03 PM ^
Third, used car prices are VERY LOW for electric cars. I can get a fairly new Leaf or Fiat e for $10k, and even BMW i3 for $15k.
The reason they're so cheap is because they're largely garbage! The only electric car that isn't going to be a money pit is the Prius. I wouldn't drive any of those you listed even if I got it for free.
January 17th, 2019 at 12:11 PM ^
Can you elaborate a bit on the used e-cars? I was also considering this route and I'm not well versed on anything automotive. I know, a sin if you are from SE Michigan. Car part of my brain never developed.
Also, can't help the OP either, as young drivers in my family have traditionally been gifted with near-undriveable eyesores that are eventually ticketed by the AAPD.
January 17th, 2019 at 12:54 PM ^
I've been looking for a car recently and noticed the same thing...there are so many BMW's and Nissan Leaf's for sale for really cheap. I understand that with fleet-like cars like Fusions and Altima's but it was surprising (and concerning) to me that that so many EV's are sitting on lots for sale.
January 17th, 2019 at 4:14 PM ^
I would not listen to RockinLoud. I have been doing a ton of research on this lately (see, my 16 yr daughter), and the owners' boards are full of people who are happy with their cars. Obviously there are certain issues (i3 tire treadwear is terrible), but other than range anxiety, the owners are quite satisfied. And to me, limited range is a huge plus for this purpose.
There is no engine more reliable than an electric motor. Those things do not require any maintenance and last forever. I am most definitely buying an electric car within next few months.
January 17th, 2019 at 1:08 PM ^
The quality on those three is pretty meh, especially the Fiat and BMW which is borderline bad. The Nissan can be pretty decent if you get lucky and get a good one, same with the Chevy Volt, but I would take the Nissan over that every day.
If the goal is to drive it for as long as possible for as little money as possible, you're much better off getting a traditional car, despite some of the advantages of an electric.
January 17th, 2019 at 1:20 PM ^
Why a leaf over a Volt?
the last time I checked the leaf's range was horrible. From everything I've read the Volt > Prius. And if you want pure EV the Bolt has a range of over 200 miles to the leaf's 100 (new)
January 17th, 2019 at 1:38 PM ^
Depends what your criteria is. What good is range if the car costs thousands more in repairs or dies altogether in half the time?
Prius will still be driving down the road just fine in the time you're having to buy 2 Volts because they crap out, on top of crazy repair costs because of specialized parts and training required to work on electric vehicles. Not to mention Prius will hold it's value way better. Again, if your goal is the buy and drive the car for as long as possible for as little money as possible, Toyota is going to be a much better bet.