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I've been a long time 247 subscriber and have loved the content. Sam and Steve are great. However, recently the site has enacted a policy of insulating Bill Green, and by extent Zach Smith, from criticism by using moderators to delete posts and topics (TLDR version below). For people with rivals, how is that site? From what I've heard they don't have the same access to the program that 247 does, but I wouldn't mind a slight dip in content as long as it wasn't drastically inferior. On another note, it seems the program is close to Sam/Steve and give them a lot of access, but maybe not a great decision on UM's part if 247 continues their support of Bill Greene and his advocacy for Zach Smith.
Background version: 247/CBS sports employee and 247Wolverine contributor Bill Greene went on the ZS podcast and is a strong advocate for Zach Smith. When posting content on the michigan 247 website he receives criticism for this position. Steve and Sam have not commented on this development nor his standing with the website, other than Steve saying "I have no thoughts." Today moderators (non-247 employees) made the call to delete and lock all threads critical of Bill Greene and his support for Zach Smith. The whole situation is incredibly surprising and frustrating. First, that a 247 employee would so publicly support Zach Smith, and second, that Sam and Steve would leave these tough decisions to moderators and not speak out one way or another. Either way, it's hard to rationalize a subscription to 247 now without acknowledging their companies support for ZS, and I was wondering how rivals compares as an alternative.
WHat a horrible thread!!! What are you trying to accomplish?? Are you asking us if you should keep your Subscription?? Are you trying to get Sam & Steve to Comment?? Are you trying to get people upset with Greene?? What is the point of the thread.
So bill Green supported ZS. Big Deal. Should we kill ZS or Bill Greene??
Good For Bill Greene doing what he thinks is right. Listen to the Podcast, it was harmless.
ZS is an idiot and is paying a steep price for his actions. Should he not be allowed a career ever again and shunned for ever???
Hmm... I would use a different label than "idiot" for a serial spousal abuser, maybe I'm not with the times.
Thank you for the recommendation, I'll probably catch up on other podcasts before his.
Due to the circumstance of his actions, I would say supporting Zach Smith would fall in the category of being a big deal. Theres a reason Bill Greene is the only one to do so.
As for being allowed a career etc... I don't follow OJ on twitter if that helps?
To your last question, no, I don't think he should be allowed any football-related career or to work with kids. I believe in redemption and second chances, but it seems ZS has had a whole lot of those already.
I would say if he can get a woman to hire him, than let him work!
He said what he is trying to accomplish. He is asking if Rivals is a viable alternative to 247 and he gave his reasons why he wants to switch.
That was my impression, too. Only I wish he had taken another sentence to remind us who Zach Smith is. I don't give enough of a damn about some of these weenies to have them spring to mind automatically several years on.
If they're defending the bum and preventing members from speaking up about it, that's very very weak, though. The OP is right to consider moving on.
Legit post, and legitimate question, even if I found it hard to piece together at first.
The mods on 247 started off by deleting comments on Greene's post today that was bringing up going on the podcast. It was later locked when most people were saying they didn't want him to post on the Michigan side after giving ZS support by going on his podcast.
I signed in to upvote this amazing gif of Jesus eating popcorn. Made me laugh
Would you say you were satisfied with the GIF?
I was today, but I doubt the satisfaction will last.
I guess I could be in the minority here but this seems to be a pretty lame reason to cancel a subscription if you like the coverage.
Basically, “The company that employs guys that I like also employs another person that is friends with another person that I don’t like so I’m no longer going to support the guys that I do like because of it.”
Not trying to be disrespectful but it just comes off to me as faux outrage. Just my opinion.
fair, but there's a difference between friends and active professional promotion. At the end of the day it's the company's decision who to support and the consumers voice is the dollar. I doubt it is Sam or Steve's decision whether or not Greene does podcasts with ZS, it is up to 247sports/cbs. I also don't pay Sam or Steve, I pay 247sports/cbs.
If it's possible, try contacting Bill Greene in a private message and respectfully ask him about his position on ZS.
It feels like you're making a mountain out of a molehill (to use an incredibly outdated phrase). You do pay 247 sports/cbs but they use your money as well as the money of many other subscribers to pay Sam, Steve, Bill, and all the other journalists who work for them. It is fair to say a portion of your money goes to all of them. What isn't fair is lumping the entire company in with one guy and his opinion of another guy you don't like (even though I agree Zach Smith's picture should be under the word "scum" in the dictionary). If you personally have a problem with the fraction of a cent that you pay Bill with your subscription, then by all means unsubscribe. Just remember that your actions affect more than just Bill and while you may not agree with it, Bill has a right to his opinion just as much as you.
By the way is it just me or does this thread have a big "social justice warrior" vibe?
Well said DTOW, faux outrage. If OP is soo outraged it would seem as if he/she would just cancel 247 without caring if Rivals offers comparable content. I read it as “I want to be outraged and virtue signal as long as I still get the info I enjoy following”. Maybe I’m just soured by all of the over the top outraged social justice warriors these days, but that’s just me.
But what if it really did hurt Bigfoot’s feelings? Think of the children! OP can do whatever he chooses with his subscription $ but it would have been a more convincing diatribe if he said he had cancelled due to his deeply held convictions. Instead he is shopping around to see what other content is out there. That’s like being kinda pregnant. You are outraged enough that you cancel or you’re not.
I have no idea why anyone uses a pay site for "inside info" on the team or recruiting. I get everything I need to know here. It may be delayed a bit over a pay site, but in the big picture, none of the info you pay for to get "now" is really that important.
Mgoblog pretty much stopped reporting insider info a few years ago. I'm amazed how much stuff gets reported by Sam and Steve that mgoblog doesn't talk about. There is definitely some valuable content if you're hungry for info. I'm finding it most useful in the preseason, and during the height of the recruiting season. And sometimes midseason when there are rumors of injury or something like that.
I suppose, but I find out eventually. I guess being around long enough, the suspense of a recruit no longer moves the needle for me. And if you're injured, you're injured. The details come out eventually. I just don't care anymore to "need to know now".
I find it hard sometimes to justify paying to watch the games - certainly never felt the need to pay for inside info and rumors about a sports team.
Agree- even listening to Sam on TMI there is a lot of stuff that never really makes it to MGoBlog.
To the OP, I’m pretty sure Sam has more access than just about anyone, so if you go elsewhere you’re likely going to get inferior content.
That's your reason for wanting to leave 247?
If it is their policy to allow employees associated and legitimized by their brand to promote an unrepentant serial spousal abuser, and to delete or lock posts critical of this position, its worth considering at least. Maybe I'm breaking it down wrong, but that's the math for me right now.
I think this is a good reason. Many pointlessly verbalize their condemnation of spousal abuse on blog forums, which is the sports equivalent of "keeping them in our prayers" during a catastrophe. This guy feels it and is taking action, and further he's starting a post on a completely different website, spreading his view and explaining it to others. I like this.
Used to subscribe to rivals but wouldn’t do it again. They really don’t have the access or knowledge they pretend to have and don’t give subscribers very much good information. A few of them have been there awhile and have very high opinions of themselves also. I would avoid that site
I’m with Steve.
I have been a member 247/TMI for 13 years and enjoy the content on the board. I also subscribed to Rivals for some time and consider Rivals to be inferior as compared to 247. I have enjoyed Bill Greens content in the past and was quite suprised with his post with the Podcast with Zak Smith. I wondered at the time of the post how it was going to be received. It took some time but it know is causing issues on the board. I believe that the ultimate decision will be the responsibility of CBS to keep Bill or release him although they may other issues by terminating him. I will continue with my subscription and determine if i choose to read any of his posts. In the past he has made some very insightful posts on the board.
The reporters at bucknut 247, or whatever the official name is, are shockingly unprofessional. Like to the point that I'm not sure what they would have to say to get canned.
That's some BS on some ZS
If you want to cancel your 247 subscription for that reason, go for it. I think that's a good reason. I'm not a big fan of censorship, especially when it comes to fair criticism of professionals. I haven't seen it (don't spend much time at 247), but if it just becomes a bunch of people name-calling Bill Greene or something, then I can see why it would be deleted. Name-calling and such is stupid.
If it's "I don't think you should be doing this" or "Why are you going on ZS's podcast?" then I think that's perfectly fair.
As for Rivals, the content is vastly inferior to 247's. And there's less of it.
I really don't have a lot of use for Brandon Brown's (Rivals) or Brice Marich's (247) input, but Brown is about 50% of the output on Rivals (the other main guy is Chris Balas), while Marich is only 33% of 247's (they have Lorenz and Webb). Even if I skip over everything Marich posts, there are still good articles to find.
That was going to be my point/question as well, Magnus. Was there an attempt at a discussion regarding the issues with going on ZS show, or just a bunch of name calling and the like. I can’t answer that because I don’t do the paid site thing.
Welcome to the real world, where some people hold and voice opinions you don't like. You are, of course, free to end your subscription because you don't like what someone writes. But in a free world people will occasionally hold differing opinions.
The fact that 247 employs a writer who holds opinions on Smith is not, at all, the same thing as 247 "supporting" Smith. The fact that they don't want nonstop threads criticizing an employee is their choice, but if there were threads that were just hammering an employee of mgoblog, those would get shut down here, too.
I mean, I get it, I don't like Smith at all either, and probably wouldn't like things written in his favor. Go ahead and cancel. The Athletic might be a good option. But be clear on what it is.
No one is made because he wrote some nice things about Smith. They are mad that he went on "menace to society", Smith's new podcast. He was 100% supporting Smith in his attempt to get the podcast up and running.
I wouldn't say there have been non stop threads criticizing Greene either.
I only saw one thread on it when it happened and people were letting it be know that they did not want Greene to give further updates on the Michigan side of things. Then his first article on the Michigan side was today and people were calling him out and letting it be known that they are not cool with contributing to the Michigan side. Mods tried deleting the post calling Greene's actions out and it eventually was locked because the overwhelming majority of comments were in that nature. There was one more thread after it was locked basically stating he was canceling his subscription if Greene is allowed to contribute and the mods silence those who speak up.
I, too, have cancelled my membership because of this. I didnt do it because Bill Greene was allowed to post there, I did it because ANY discussion of the merit of having him post there was locked or deleted. It is outrageous that simple conversation was shutdown like it was.
I dont plan to have any paid subscription moving forward, I'll get my fix here.
Maybe I’m too old and don’t have to rely on getting inside information as much as I did during my brief career in sports journalism over 40 years ago, or maybe I just have more important things to worry about and do, but I’ve learned that having to pay for inside information and commentary about sports isn’t worth it for me.
Kudos to those like Magnus and umbig11 and others who post on MGoBlog for giving me all of the inside information about Michigan sports that I need, even if it comes significantly later for me than it does for those of you who pay for that information.
Since the advent of “submarine” training camps for Wolverines football, I’ve realized that I‘ll just have to wait patiently for the start of the season to learn about the starters, the depth chart and the impact of new players and coaches.
It all depends on if 247 supports blue cheese with wings. Ranch, you see is a common substitute but is used to trick the masses. If 247 encourages ranch use, they are evil people that can go straight to hell.
I’m super into this most important of social issues. #ranchtoo
#BigFoot #Nessie
Hide-N-Seek Champions since 1969!
They're both gross. Just eat your wings like a man.
You’re one step from dipping mayo, you sick fuck
Eating wings without dipping sauce at all = dipping in mayo?
Just like my sister, this is something I can get behind.
I literally spit out food laughing at this
I too support your sister in her personal endeavors.
OT season...
One a tangent: I did the trial for TheAthletic based on recs here and will keep the subscription ($5/month). Many fluff pieces, but higher quality fluff pieces.
For example, there was a minor article on recruiting kids in Texas (football). It was filled with actual stats (e.g., Texas and TAMU even with ~65 blue chips over the past 6 years; of the relatively few kids that go out of state, Stanford is a leader etc.). Even an actual pie graph.
Another fluff piece was a Stewart Mandel article on the formation of a super-conference (28 team premier league of CFB). Again, very similar to the re-alignment posts that we get for free from here or other sites...but it was relatively filled with the payout per team figures etc.
Just small improvements but worth 15 cents per day to me.
I think Ohio State should rehire Zach Smith. They deserve each other.
I'm trying to figure out how Zach Smith has a large enough following to have a podcast and also has enough friends to have guests on that podcast. For half that post I thought maybe there was another person named Zach Smith because why would anyone support him or want to listen to him speak. I guess truly everyone has a podcast these days.
He's cornered the ball-lifters demographic.