Michigan closing bars and restaurants
All bars and restaurants are to be closed by 3pm today. They're still allowed to offer carryout and delivery service, although I'm not sure how that works with booze.
We're now up to 53 confirmed cases, including a "young person". It sure would be nice to know what school they went to.
Stay safe out there.
Read a report that someone associated with UM Dearborn had a confirmed case. No details available, so this is not necessarily the "young person".
Whitmer implied that it was someone in the K-12 age range, stressing the importance of closing schools.
My 8 year old spent the month of Feb teetering on the brink of hospitalization with pneumonia, after testing negative for the flu and strep. In retrospect, it's entirely possible that he had coronavirus. And if he did, "mild cases" suck ass. He was sick as fuck.
And started coughing again last night.
Ohio governor indicated yesterday that all childcare facilities will be closed this week as well. Only reason it was not enacted yesterday (along with bar/restaurant closures) was to give parents time to prepare.
It’s highly unlikely he caught the disease twice, unless he has a poor immune system. I know of people who have caught pneumonia without flu or cold. A colleague of mine did this very thing a few months ago.
March 16th, 2020 at 11:51 AM ^
Repeat infections with coronaviruses are not unknown (I found publications on this phenomenon back as far as 1990). They are an unusual family of viruses because of their unusually high mutation rate (I don't want to get into the weeds, but the way they replicate is a little different from most viruses). The immune response they generate isn't always the classical memory-lymphocyte generating infection you'll see with routine infections.
But generally, given that you'd have to be pretty unlucky to get exposed twice, re-infections should be few and far in between (they've had a few re-infections in Japan, for example, but those are media reports and I always take science reporting in mass media with plenty of salt).
March 16th, 2020 at 10:10 AM ^
I would say Corona virus was not likely unless you were in China. There were many wide spread cases of community acquired pneumonia this year here in Columbus. I would be surprised if it were not the same at least across the Midwest. Community acquired pneumonia is typically difficult to treat and at least moderately severe.
March 16th, 2020 at 10:35 AM ^
He has asthma and has had pneumonia a few times, even as a baby (which was terrifying). I only suggested it because I think there has been widespread community transmission for months now. My doctor speculated that this thing circulated for half a year in China before they even knew what it was.
That had to be terrible, an infant with pneumonia. I had not heard that about the Corona virus possibly having been around for months.
I’m confused by the significance of a “young person” having it... Was there a belief that this just spread from old person to old person?
I think that is their way of saying "see? we do need to close the schools."
Well that’s an interesting straw-man. I don’t recall anyone ever saying “we shouldn’t close schools bc I don’t think kids can get this virus and kids never spread germs...”. The main counterpoint to closing schools was around gaps in childcare and long-term educational impact (an entire nation of kids K-12 are essentially losing 1-5% of their pre-grad education).
WRT childcare, let’s see the call-in rate at the medical facilities today. If they’re >25% we really need to think about the balance of these decisions. Granted if this really gets bad, having 25% of the workforce healthy and ready to step up might be good.
Neither do I, but I can't think of another reason to specifically point out the "young person." They didn't even want to tell us whether it was a college student or third-grader, which kind of matters (IMO.)
March 16th, 2020 at 10:45 AM ^
They are just transparent but not giving you to specific of details. For instance when Christian Wood got infected it just said “Detroit Male. With History of domestic travel”
Are you serious? Just because kids haven't typically developed severe symptoms, doesn't mean that they can't carry and transmit the virus. This isn't complicated.
March 16th, 2020 at 10:51 AM ^
"Young" people (kids) have been more commonly suspected as carriers as opposed to "coming down" with the virus. Very few cases where young people have been inflicted with the disease.
March 16th, 2020 at 11:17 AM ^
A lot of people, like myself, assumed that small children were especially vulnerable like the elderly. Then i read a series of articles stating doctors and scientists were baffled, wondering why small children only showed the mildest of symptoms after testing positive for the coronavirus.
March 16th, 2020 at 11:23 AM ^
That won't happen until October, after the virus summers in the Hamptons mutating into something much more deadly. Just like the Spanish flu did in 1918.
Also, COVID19 is a stupid name. They really should have come up with something more catchy.
March 16th, 2020 at 11:48 AM ^
"Also, COVID19 is a stupid name."
Right? I was thinking the same thing! I mean, we have Spanish Flu, Swine Flu, Bird (Aviary) Flu, SARS, MERS... Why the hell couldn't someone have come up with something better than COVID-19. How lame. As a result, nobody calls it that - everyone still says 'coronavirus'! Coronathis, Coronathat!!
Perhaps, in protest of such a rotten name, this is why the CDC chose to not use the already developed, tested, and fielded test kits, complete with its already ramped up supply chain running full bore?
March 16th, 2020 at 12:30 PM ^
How about Wuhan Virus?
We can only name viruses after their origin point if that was in the US (see: norovirus.)
Kung Flu?
Kung Flu Panda-emic
March 16th, 2020 at 11:29 PM ^
So underrated!!
I'm not an epidemiologist but I believe the general tendency is for viruses to mutate into something less lethal, rather than more. Viruses that kill their host at high rates (like Ebola) can be contained relatively easily. It's the relatively mild viruses that really propagate.
This may well come back next winter but I think the bigger danger is that our 1) health systems are still compromised from the initial outbreak and 2) that we get a sense of complacency over the summer and don't respond to renewed calls for social distancing, if they happen.
Isn’t the young person the MSU student?
This is the correct move by the governor. Probably should have been done Friday.
‘We all need to hunker down for a few weeks and flatten out this curve.
The internet is still open, so our lives aren’t altered all that much.
Except for the people who, you know, work at these bars and restaurants. Or who own them and might see them go out of business.
France is giving small business owners and employees affected by the shutdown direct cash payments. A massive amount apparently.
Perhaps we should do that here before taking about bailing out cruise lines and airlines (again)?
Don't worry, it'll trickle back down from on high to the lowly restaurant/bar owners that Wahoo is concerned about. That's how it works, right?
Uh, no. See, the entire theory behind trickle-down (whether or not you agree with it is beside the point) sort of depends on people being allowed to work and spend money.
March 16th, 2020 at 11:54 AM ^
That's what the House bill was supposed to do - give money to the people that need it (hourly workers laid off; small businesses). But Trump wanted a payroll tax cut (which only helps out those that keep their jobs), so the two sides had to hash out the differences. I'm not sure that was going to be enough, in any case...
Yeah, it sucks that they are going to lose pay for 2 or 3 weeks, but their income was probably going to be reduced anyway due to less traffic. Owners will be able to reduce expenses by being closed and this helps keep staff free from exposure.
‘We are all going to have pain, but this issue requires a national effort. Ask your grandparents what sacrifices they had to make during WWII.
Interesting thought on WW2. I’ve brought up from time to time with people my age (I’m 31) what would happen if people our age had to make WW2 sacrifices and what the reaction would be. Thankfully, a draft into a very bloody war isn’t happening but I have imagine if this continues into June rationing may be on the table.
Assuming they weren't actually in the service, they had gas rationing and victory gardens and less sugar and what have you. Lifestyle changes that were inconvenient, occasionally painful but that they did put up with. But what they didn't have was a government telling them they're not allowed to earn a living. Part of the reason they were good with the rationing was that it was infinitely preferable to the Depression.
I agree their income was going to be reduced, but that's not the same thing as just straight up zero income for weeks, if not months.
Realistically, this virus was going to cripple our economy once it hit our shores. (Even if it hadn't hit our shores we were probably headed for recession due to its impact on China and other countries.)
You can't have a functional economy during a pandemic of this scale. If we let it run its course, it's going to drown our health system and lead to massive deaths of all kinds of causes (not only COVID-19, but all other serious conditions due to lack of proper treatment). If that is going on you can't just go to work as usual and expect your usual stream of customers to show up. In fact, you'd probably be shutting down and locking your inventory to prevent looting in the social breakdown that probably would occur.
I think all states are going to go this way. NY bars, clubs, and restaurants are apparently all full, while my university has all faculty working from home under strict quarantine procedures.
the local college seniors just don’t want to go home.
Neither do the juniors. Mrs. Hatter is a day or two away from driving to A2 with chloroform and duct tape to get our daughter home.
Never change, Hatter.
The family that kidnaps together, stays together.
My MGoBlog dream scenario is a world where the only two posters are MadHatter and Hotel Putingrad.
Finally, a St Patrick's Day without drunken idiots.
This is like saying "finally! a Thanksgiving without football!"
Don't rule it out yet...we are talking about idiots.
I live in East Lansing- I could go out on a drunken idiot watch, but I don't have hazmat suit handy...
We should replace St. Patrick's Day with St. Alexander Nevsky's Day and drink lots of Stolis.
March 16th, 2020 at 12:00 PM ^
Without drunken idiots in public.
You're underestimating the idiots
Good. Should've been done earlier, but I'm glad it's happening now.
Good short term move. But let's do everything we can to get those back up and running as soon as possible. Good to see a robust response, and let's all hope that everybody is back to work ASAP. We got this.
Changing your tune, eh? Funny how that works.
I'm not changing anything, man. I am here hoping everybody makes common sense moves and avoids unreasonable panic.
You keep on going through thread to thread spreading your panic, though. Keep instilling that in the back of people's minds that there is no escape and we are all doomed to death. I am sure everybody appreciates your perspective, very helpful.