A lack of RB and critical analysis of #16
My main point is Denard will significantly improve in this system when we have a consistent RB. Fitz is the answer here. Smith is a help here too. Saturday Hopkins played his way out of the rotation hopefully. Mike Shaw had 2 carries for -3 yards. We converted 5 third downs rushing vs. 10 third downs passing.
Denard had 16 carries on Saturday. Let’s give Fitz a few games with 15-20 carries, Smith-5 carries or passes, and Denard 15. If other teams stack the box like ND did, we will continue to hit the deep ball with #21, #10, and #12.
Any M fan that’s crying for Gardner over Denard needs to rewatch the final 2 minutes of the game and shut their yapper (Matt Foley can motivate them to do this). These are the same idiots who wanted young Mallett in over upperclassman Henne vs. App State-ignorance blames the QB rather than the complexity that is the team.
The only thing I want to compare this year to the last three is our record on the field and the number of recruits we’re gaining w O-state offers. As of now we’re 2-0 with a top ten recruiting class. #28, #2, and the OL will step up and help #16 as he leads this team to 9-10 wins with both his legs and arm like he did on Saturday.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:28 PM ^
What does Vincent Smith have to do to get respect from his own fans? Smith is tough, and has shifty, deceptive speed. As he once again demonstated late in the ND game, he is brilliant at picking his way through traffic and plays well when the pressure is on.
He's not Jamie Morris or Mike Hart, but he is still a very good running back. He can't "move the pile," but he can make one or two people miss, and an arm tackle isn't going to bring him down. I want to see Fitz do well, to, but V Smith should see the ball at least ten times a game, and I really don't think he is a terrible downgrade if he has to see more action due to Fitz going down.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:39 PM ^
cant run through tackles as well as others. i hope fitz gets the job and stays healthy because hopkins runs like he's drunk and has pam on his hands.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:17 PM ^
Hopkins has Pam Ward on his hands? *shudder* I wouldn't play well in that situation either.
September 12th, 2011 at 10:51 PM ^
Play well and you don't have to put out for Pam Ward anymore
September 12th, 2011 at 8:18 PM ^
How often has Shaw run through tackles in his career?
September 12th, 2011 at 8:18 PM ^
I've always liked Smith. He's terrific in the open field. I'm not sure he's the best option on 3rd and short, but otherwise I think he should get some carries.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:19 PM ^
Actually Smith has done quite well on 3rd and short situations in his career.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:22 PM ^
He's also the best pass protector, which adds to his 3rd down mystique. Also, I want to see Devin a lot --- lots of time with the other guys as DRob enjoys his 4th qtr rest after rolling it up. I'm surprised everyone doesn't feel the same way.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:30 PM ^
HolyShit recurit. I'd take him over any rb on the roster to start. Denard (imo) wants him out there if he needs a rb to block for him also...
September 12th, 2011 at 8:34 PM ^
I don't mind him getting a few touches as long as they don't come on kick returns. He was NOT effective in that role on Saturday. I had a first hand view of all of his returns. He doesn't have the speed or fearlesness required for that job. Of course allot of the kick return game depends on blocking but still I have to say I didn't see anything from VS to suggest he's the guy best suited for that role.
September 12th, 2011 at 9:04 PM ^
One thing V. Smith does not lack is fearlessness. He may not be the fastest guy, but he is one tough SOB. I'd like to put any of us in his body out there on that field and see what's running through our heads besides "AAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH get me outta here!!!!"
That said, I'd rather have Dileo get a shot at returning SOMETHING, so putting him back there with Gallon is a way to get Dileo involved and save V Smith for the running back duties he may need to have his role increased for.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:31 PM ^
"Any M fan that’s crying for Gardner over Denard needs to rewatch the final 2 minutes"
........
wut?
September 12th, 2011 at 8:03 PM ^
"Any M Fan that's crying for Gardner over Denard needs to rewatch the final 2 minutes of the (ND) game..."
left out the ND part-thx.
September 12th, 2011 at 10:03 PM ^
I thknk that "final two minutes" was the key part of that sentence. The initial 58 minutes (OK, not quite that much) were really bad. Denard's completion rate was under 50% and he threw threee picks. That's not going to get it done moving forward.
Don't get me wrong, I definitely think that Denard is the starting QB at this point (and for the foreseeable future) but there's a lot to be concerned about offensively if you want to compete with the Top Tier teams in the Big Ten.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:33 PM ^
I think that screen pass highlighted exactly what V. Smith is good at, and exactly why he should be our 3rd down back. I don't think you can use the ND game as a great way to evaluate our running backs considering we got down 14 points quickley, and were fighting the clock the entire game. Those situations don't call for a lot of MANBALL.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:26 PM ^
...(imo)was the play of the night. If Smith dosen't take it to the house then...game over. The clock then becomes Michigan enemy. I like how he sidestep the tackle of Darius Flemming (should have chosen Michigan,but thats another story) and weaved his way to the sideline to score.
That screen was sweet!
September 12th, 2011 at 9:33 PM ^
If M had taken an extra minute to score and given ND 12 seconds instead of 1:12, then M would likely have won 28-24. It was a great run but I dont think it was anywhere near game over as I dont think it was 4th down.
September 12th, 2011 at 11:09 PM ^
ND before the Smith score...we were playin the clock. Every second counted on that particular drive. The timeouts (2 or 3 can't recall) we had would have been used either to stop the clock(if he hadn't score or if there wasn't a stop of play) when we had the ball or when ND(if we didn't recover the apparent onside kick) had the ball. When we scored last,the clock showed 00:02 sec. Even with the quick scoring by the irish...we got the ball with less than 20 sec (can't recall) so yes...by smith scoring,as he did help us later
September 13th, 2011 at 12:52 AM ^
Sure are a lot of contingencies to make such a definitive statement. Sure, maybe they score on the next play and since the clock said 0:02 left then simple logic says that time would have run out before they scored. However, you can't assume everything would have played out the same way. In the end, if he doesn't score on that play, then no one really knows how the rest of the game would have played out.
September 13th, 2011 at 1:00 PM ^
LoL Flemming was also the guy who got his ankles broken by Tate on that 4th down run in the 09 game. Poor guy.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:39 PM ^
My only problem is that people don't understand that those "jump balls" Denard was throwing is actually a good throw. He has man to man coverage and the DB has his back turned. The worst thing you can do is over throw your WR, never even giving him a chance.
Hopkins should only see the field as a fullback and Fitz is the best RB currently on our roster.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:52 PM ^
When a receiver has to break off his route and come back to a ball that's a bad throw. Also throwing a jump ball to a receiver thats a foot shorter than the DB covering him is also not a good idea.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:55 PM ^
You're assuming that routes don't change in the middle of the play. Which they do, all the time, especially in a pro-style passing game. It requires that both the receiver and QB to recognize the coverage and placement of the defenders, and they both know to change a route, which often calls for breaking off the route early.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:13 PM ^
A bad throw sails 10 yards over their heads. Watch an NFL game and see what throw the qb makes when he has man coverage down by the end zone. The worst throw is not giving your WR a chance.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:21 PM ^
When you're throwing to a guy like Hemingway, who isn't particularly fast, an underthrown ball is probably your best bet. Hemingway won't outrun that many DBs, but he'll outjump most of them.
Also, the average DB isn't nearly as tall as you seem to imagine.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:28 PM ^
Do you watch much football? Those underthrows are very effective when the receiver isn't open and the DB has his back turned. Receivers break off their routes all the time.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:53 PM ^
Thank you. Denard did have some jump balls, like the bomb to Hemingway, but those TDs were brilliantly thrown. I like when Stafford throws a back-shoulder fade to Johnson in the end zone, it "OMG great receiver! great placement by awesome QB!", but when Denard does it to a 5'8" receiver, it's just a jump ball and they were really lucky because, obviously, the people involved don't fit the typical mold.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:40 PM ^
I don't understand why everyone is angry Denard was throwing "Jump Balls". When you're down by 10 in the 4th Quarter and you don't have a guarantee you're defense will stop them you have to take shots downfield. Obviously Denard was bad in the first half, but by the second half he was adding some nice touch to his balls and finding open guys.
Totally agree with you about the Backs though, Fitz/Shaw are 1st and 2nd down type guys with Fitz getting more carries. Smith is a 3rd down/5 wide set guy, and Hopkins is our Goalline-FB
September 12th, 2011 at 7:42 PM ^
Fitz just isn't going to stay healthy. He already has a tremendous body of work in the injury department against a very skim record of actually playing. It sucks but those things don't just change on a dime one day.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:46 PM ^
I think if Rawls doesn't see any playing time against Eastern then he should get a redshirt. It would be obvious then that the coaching staff doesn't have big plans for him going into conference play this year, and I hate to see a good RB waste a year on the bench.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:48 PM ^
Any M fan that’s crying for Gardner over Denard needs to rewatch the final 2 minutes.
I love Denard , but even in the last 2 minutes that was the receivers saving him from bad throws. He made 2 good throws all night, first one with with a Notre dame lineman holding on to his jersey the 2nd with about 20 seconds left in the game.
I think more credit should go to the receivers and the offensive line than to denard for that comeback. I think Denard would be the first person to say this also.
Devin might be a better pure passer than Denard, I'm not a coach , but Denard is deffinately the biggest playmaker on our team. If he is throwing or not he is a big play waiting to happen and thats probably the only reason we did'nt see Devin come in late in that game.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:58 PM ^
The throws to McColgan and Grady were right on the money not to mention the passes that Hemingway and Roundtree dropped in the first half. The whole offense needs to be more consistent but Denard was not nearly as bad as you're suggesting.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:25 PM ^
I don't think Denard's gotten nearly enough credit for the throw on the 64-yard play, either. Yes, Gallon was wide open, but Denard was throwing on the run and hit Gallon in stride some 30 yards downfield. Not an easy throw to make.
September 12th, 2011 at 9:03 PM ^
Not only those but the td to roundtree was a great, great throw. It may have looked like a jump ball, but the cb was playing inside leverage, as they did all night, and that pass was a textbook example of how to place a fade against that coverage. People criticizing that throw as a 'jump ball' just don't understand the game very well.
September 12th, 2011 at 9:10 PM ^
...If #7 was the best QB on the team he would be starting. Hoke and company feel #16 gives us the best chance to win. He wasn't perfect, but he plays the game 100mph, and I respect that. He plays to win.
Now that being said, I wouldn't mind seeing a package with both of them in the game at the same time. We should get a chance to see #7 this week. Hopefully EARLY.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:58 PM ^
Gardner over Robinson??? WHAAATT!! (as denard would say)
September 12th, 2011 at 8:10 PM ^
1. RB
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<br>Hopkins was terrible. He hasn't impressed me at all either last weekend or last year. He doesn't have the big play potential of a faster back and he doesn't appear to have the power of a Brandon Jacobs bull moose back. And he fumbles.
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<br>Fitz is our best RB but will never stay healthy. Just too many injuries over several years. A shame but sadly reality.
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<br>Shaw - just does not impress me. Not enough size power to routinely run over guys and while he is fast, he never seems able to turn the corner. Also, not great vision. Just not productive.
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<br>Which brings mr to V. Smith. One of my most routinely used criticisms of RR was that he played v. Smith too much. on balance, not a great criticism. A few points in favor of smith: This kid doesn't fumble, is one of the beat blockers on the team and has great hands. Forget 2010 when he was rehabing from an injury - remember the last few games of 2009 - this kid was a great receiver out of the backfield. May not have top end speed but he is shifty and if deployed properly, he can be productive. Also, when he was in, Denard just looked better (maybe the blocking?). Not a home run threat but if fitz is not healthy smith is our best back.
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<br>2. Denard
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<br>I love Denard an proudly wear by #16 jersey. But he looked terrible in our first two games. Yes, he has he potential to break open a game at any moment, but even in the 4th quarter his throws were not good. So can someone explain to me (and I am prepare for the snark and negs) why not use Denard as a RB. His speed is insane. And, imagine the play that Borges could draw up where devin hands the ball to Denard who starts to run only to pull up anchor roundtree down field? D linemen and lbs would have to defend against that possibility on every down opening up tons of running lanes.
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September 12th, 2011 at 8:34 PM ^
Denard is running those plays now . They should be more effective with him at QB since he gets an extra blocker (or downfield threat).
September 12th, 2011 at 8:45 PM ^
So can someone explain to me (and I am prepare for the snark and negs) why not use Denard as a RB.He just threw for 338 yards on 24 attempts - an insane 14.1 per attempt. How? Because the defense has to worry so much about his running ability that it can't blanket our receivers downfield. Put in a "regular" QB and we lose that advantage (and our WR corps will look a lot more pedestrian). Also, I don't think Denard has the physique to play tailback. He gets the crap beaten out of him as it is.
September 12th, 2011 at 11:12 PM ^
Denard only completed 11 passes...for 338yds...good for 30.7yds per COMPLETION!!! Now THAT'S insane! in the end, it comes down to great understanding, awareness, and communication between QB & WRs that make those plays happen! I, for one, am grateful! Go Denard, & Go Blue!
September 13th, 2011 at 7:03 PM ^
Yards per attempt is more useful than yards per completion. Case in point: early in the third quarter, Denard was 2-10 for 48 yards. That's 24.0 yards per completion - but only 4.8 per attempt. Which stat was more indicative of his performance to that point?
September 12th, 2011 at 9:19 PM ^
...passed for 338 yards! His recievers made plays, but he is not throwing to Edwards, Manningham, Walker, or Terrell. Do we even have a second round pick in our recieving corps? Not bad for a "running back."
The Wunderkind Rees, who was throwing to an NFL first round draft pick in Floyd managed 315 yards.
Maybe, just maybe we are expecting to much from Denard in week two of a new offense?
September 12th, 2011 at 8:29 PM ^
I mean...Thomas Rawls to be given a chance to show his stuff. EMU or SDSU would be a great warm up for him. If Fitz can't stay healthy I think we're headed Thomas' way.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:34 PM ^
Agree. The game against EMU will probably be the last chance to see which freshmen will be playing. No Delaware State to break things up in the middle of this season to empty the bench.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:46 PM ^
The Eastern game is the game to watch, Denard will probably be done by the 2nd quarter and we'll probably have our RB's rotating throughout the entire game. Plus if Fitz can't stay healthy then Rawls could very well get a chance to float his stuff as an everydown type of back
September 12th, 2011 at 8:47 PM ^
I think Vince Smith is the shiftiest and best runner of the backs. Is he the fastest? No. Biggest? Absolutely not. Best? Not sure, but he's the most consistent RB on the roster.
September 12th, 2011 at 9:04 PM ^
September 12th, 2011 at 9:08 PM ^
Did he just not win playing time? Still doesn't know the playbook? Has a bad attitude? Is injured? Won't block?
By many comments from others who know more about this than I do, he was one of the best athletes on the team.
September 12th, 2011 at 8:59 PM ^
Did he just not win playing time? Still doesn't know the playbook? Has a bad attitude? Is injured? Won't block?
By many comments from others who know more about this than I do, he was one of the best athletes on the team.