Flashback: Seth on Ravens Defense in 2021
It would be an understatement to say that opinion on this blog is polarized about the possibility of Wink Martindale as defensive coordinator. There's been an debate about whether Wink's defensive style is really akin to that of MacDonald and Minter, and some people have even argued about whether he should more properly compared to Don Brown.
With that in mind, I thought it might be interesting to link to Seth's write-up of the Ravens "Amoeba" defense back in February 2021 (when Martindale was still the Ravens DC). It's linked without comment -- I know very little about this schematic stuff, so I'll let others discuss the nitty-gritty of it:
February 8th, 2024 at 10:31 PM ^
I have not yet formed an opinion on Wink.
I just hope we hire someone who knows the current scheme and that we don't have a mass exit to the portal. Our returning personnel on defense are elite.
What do people have against him? I am completely uninformed.
February 8th, 2024 at 11:04 PM ^
According to well-placed sources, Wink Martindale had lunch with Warde Manuel one time and complimented Warde's tie, which prompted Warde to tell Wink that Wink will always have a job at Michigan if he fails in the NFL. Then they got drunk together and went to a strip club with Joe Cullen.
February 8th, 2024 at 11:24 PM ^
......and claimed the entire experience as a tax write off
February 8th, 2024 at 11:36 PM ^
What was Joe wearing at the strip club?
February 9th, 2024 at 12:26 AM ^
All I heard is that Cullen was at the strip club. It's unclear whether he was there as a customer or in some other capacity.
February 9th, 2024 at 1:58 AM ^
Not much, actually. Less than the dancers...
February 9th, 2024 at 9:25 AM ^
Appropriate attire.
February 9th, 2024 at 7:04 AM ^
What do people have against him???
He's old
He doesn't recruit
He hasn't coached college in 20 years
He obviously wants to be in the NFL but they don't seem to want him anymore
He's had bad defenses for the last 3 years
He clearly wasn't Moore's first choice
Neither of his last two employers wanted to keep him.
February 9th, 2024 at 9:09 AM ^
If this reassures our current starters that they won't have to learn a new system and keeps the team together to get ready to promote Clink next year, I'm fine with it.
February 8th, 2024 at 10:42 PM ^
I'm ok with Wink as DC.
February 8th, 2024 at 10:45 PM ^
Excel’s DB comparison is off base. If Wink was 36 he wouldn’t be saying that.
February 8th, 2024 at 11:01 PM ^
I haven't arrived at a firm opinion on Wink, though I would have strongly preferred Cullen.
And this doesn't have that much to do with Wink, but:
CJ Stroud won offensive rookie of the year, the year after Garrett Wilson won it. What do they have in common?
They lost to Michigan.
It turns out OSU wasn't bad. Michigan was better.
February 8th, 2024 at 11:17 PM ^
Out of curiosity, why would you have preferred Cullen? He's a career DL coach who had two very short DC stints this century that went very poorly.
February 9th, 2024 at 1:41 AM ^
He's not sure. This is the first time SJK has taken a side in his life.
February 9th, 2024 at 6:09 AM ^
Well we had OSUs playbook downloaded in Stallions brain and we’re brazen enough to switch up our defense and yell “pass”, when Cj emptied the backfield pre snap. It’s fairly obvious we cheated!
February 8th, 2024 at 11:34 PM ^
“They do it by blitzing more than anybody in the league”
That does not sound like McDonald and Minter’s scheme. The idea that this would be a continuity hire is ridiculous.
February 9th, 2024 at 12:53 AM ^
You won’t have to blitz at a high rate with our D Line next year.
February 9th, 2024 at 2:38 AM ^
Actually, in 2021 Michigan blitzed a lot more than people remember, and from all over. That team didn’t have 4 guys on the line who could consistently handle 5 blockers like the 22 and 23 teams had. Minter adapted to having that luxury by blitzing less and making the coverage schemes even more confusing for QBs.
February 9th, 2024 at 7:42 AM ^
Look at our 2022 game against OSU. Without our best DL (Morris), Minter consistently rushed four - but almost never the same four. We were blitzing from all over and dropping people into the hot routes. The key was not the maniacal "Leeeeroy Jenkins!" rush, but the fact that Stroud didn't know what he was looking at. There were quite a few plays where he had all day, but Harrison was doubled, Johnson was locked on the next read, a DL had dropped into the hot route, and no one had leverage.
Finally, look at the 2023 National Championship (boy, that's never getting old) game. We confused Penix in the same way, but more so, because we were crushing the OL. Double the "unleash the dragon" read, drop someone into the hot route, and read 3 is Mason Graham.
-----
If the offense executes perfectly, it always wins. This implies that the defense either has to hope the offense isn't perfect, or it has to take its chances. Every defense has a hole. The key to blitzy defenses - "solving your problems with aggression" - is putting pressure on the offense to find the hole before they find the ball. The more flexible your personnel, the more you can hide your weakness and trap the offense into playing to your strengths rather than the reverse.
The difference between Brown's defense and the Ravens iterations is that flexibility. Brown would not give up the middle of the field and make the offense make plays out wide. This puts a premium on those corners because that's where the under-pressure throws will go.
These defenses will put the weakness anywhere, which is a bigger burden all around. The defense has to be smart and execute the call with all the complex drops and coverage rules, but when they do the processing burden on the QB is huge. Even Stroud and Penix struggled with it.
February 8th, 2024 at 11:34 PM ^
I think even before Wink came up as a potential D-Coordinator candidate, this is an article worth looking back on, particularly since the structure (though perhaps not the tactics) both won the College Football championship under Minter, and became flavor of the month in the NFL under MacDonald. Much like how there was a point where the Fangio defense took the NFL by storm in the early 2020s, we're seeing the multiple amoeba style defenses at the forefront now.
I think there are a few key differences the way that Minter/MacDonald run the scheme versus how it's portrayed in the article/how Wink runs, the main one that being in the coverage/blitz balance. As noted by the MGoBlog crew many times this year, the Ms were deathly prepped for Ohio State, often to the detriment of their non-OSU opponents, essentially playing a 2 high shell constantly prepping for the Ohio State attack. Meanwhile, Wink continued his heavy blitz style in New York, earn praise when it worked (2022 Giants playoff run) and jeers when it didn't (2023 Giants fizzling).
The equalizing factor is that both Wink and the Michigan duo did this at the cost of their run support, where they relied on fitting to the run. While this was the Giants achillies heel last season, the fact that Minter had Jenkins, the "Gifts from the Gods" duo and depth beyond that let him get away with an extra zone defender and then some. Presuming Michigan retains their defensive talent, Wink should have the free reign to get away with some of his crazier stuff, albeit that margin will likely tighten significantly against competition like OSU.
I think I would be okay with Wink as a D-coodinator for Michigan, so long as he's willing to make some context based adjustments for Michigan's situation. He's an incredibly accomplished defensive mind having started the base form of the amoeba defense, is usually the better half of his teams (Ravens fans thought Greg Roman was the issue in Baltimore and he bore the yoke of the Giants putrid offense last year in particular), and players do tend to really like him.
Where my concern would lie with him comes in the details that he'll be tasked with handling. It's true there is some Don Brown in him that he is blitz heavy in his gameplans and uses man to cover that, something that OSU have proven the ability to dominate. His falling out with Daboll is also quite concerning considering Daboll had accused him and his right hand man (the same linebackers coach he's looking to bring to Michigan) of attempting a team mutiny last year due to his popularity with the defensive side of the ball. Whether that's Daboll being a jerk (which there's evidence of as well) or on Wink, who had a good reputation in Baltimore under John Harbaugh, is unclear.
Bottom line is that if it is Wink, they're bringing a guy who is more familiar with the scheme that is in vogue and successfully brought Michigan glory than anyone else. Whether it will pay off though will depend on how Wink handles adjusting to the college competition (with an eye to the high flying offensive attack of OSU, and maybe taking a page from his predecessors) and whether he's stays in line under with a first time head coach far younger than him. I understand the reservations with bringing him on, but it might just be worth the risk to get someone well versed both the Ravens system and a track record of success (as opposed to overpromoting a truly unknown Ravens assistant), a rare combo this late in the hiring cycle.
February 9th, 2024 at 1:36 AM ^
Also, the "Ohio State defense" might not need to be the same as it was. They don't have Stroud and Harrison anymore. Or Fields and Olave. They're bringing in a mediocre thrower who will probably be tasked with some designed runs while leaning on help from his star RBs.
Tweaking a defense that looks the same but operates differently might be a perfect counter to what OSU will be adapting to after getting beat by the same style of defense three years in a row.
February 9th, 2024 at 2:29 AM ^
OSU attempted to become more balanced last year but now with two top backs to feed and the play calling out of black beards hands they are destined to run more.
February 9th, 2024 at 8:10 AM ^
They brought in the top WR in the country as well as a couple more talented QB's, and they will have their shit figured out by November. I would never underestimate OSU, even with Day at the helm. They have way too much talent on that roster.
The last three years have been great, but if we get into the Buckeye mindset that we can never lose, that's when the wheels will fall off. I hate OSU but I will always respect them.
February 9th, 2024 at 9:42 AM ^
That was some of my thought too- OSUs offense might be shifting too from the 7-on-7 drill stuff Day ran 2018-2023. Bringing in Howard and that Ole Miss RB plus a new OC might imply it’ll be less pass and more run (since frankly itd be nearly impossible to be *more* pass oriented).
Don Browns defenses actually did great against Urbans schemes in 16 and 17 so “Don Brown but Ravens Dish” shouldn't necessarily be a call for panic as it might match up well with where OSU is heading now
February 10th, 2024 at 12:23 AM ^
Great point.
February 8th, 2024 at 11:45 PM ^
But has Manuel excel read this?
February 9th, 2024 at 1:29 AM ^
No, but Noreaga Powerpoint is a fan of Wink.
February 8th, 2024 at 11:47 PM ^
I'm ready. Let's do this. Give me some Wink and Clink.
February 8th, 2024 at 11:57 PM ^
I thought Wink invented the Ravens defense, like the article says? If Wink is really just a blitzer like Don Brown, then MacDonald invented the Amoeba defense and it should be called the Michigan defense instead of the Ravens defense. Except Minter ran it for a year at Vanderbilt before he came here. I know they are good friends and all, but to suggest that two position coaches invented a defense with no help from the defensive coordinator is insane to me. Plus Moore says he wants an experienced play-caller at DC. Who better than Wink? Maybe he can run the same defense MacDonald and Minter ran here, which was actually an improvement on the defense that he created in Baltimore. Plus the board won't have to make any more Wendy's jokes. Give me Wink over Cullen.
February 9th, 2024 at 8:06 AM ^
What Mac and Minter did was scheme coverage disguises, which either Wink doesn't do or doesn't do well. Those disguised coverage schemes were a HUGE reason for all our defensive success the past three years.
The general concern, and comparison to Don Brown and the blitzing are legit, but yesterday on the Roundtable Sam noted that Wink didn't blitz like a mad man when he had a great DL. The Giants are a cluster fuck and he did what he had to do there with what he had. We have the benefit of a great DL so in theory we shouldn't be worried about the mass blitzing.
I am still concerned about his coverage schemes though, but I guess only time will tell.
February 9th, 2024 at 11:44 AM ^
But if Clink is still a CoDC after this shakes out and is in charge of the DBs then maybe this becomes a bit less of a concern. That's at least my hope as this hire doesn't fire me up much.
February 9th, 2024 at 1:08 AM ^
Fun fact: Kalel Mullings was the projected MIKE LB in that Neck Sharpies post.
February 9th, 2024 at 1:47 AM ^
Also, none of those recruits worked out besides Benny.
February 9th, 2024 at 5:45 AM ^
Anyone who thinks Wink doesn't know the Ravens style defense just doesn't know what they are talking about. It's that simple
February 9th, 2024 at 8:42 AM ^
I had to go back and replace the clips because gfycat is gone.
February 9th, 2024 at 11:49 AM ^
My concern is that I watched my Cincinnati Bengals and Joe Burrow absolutely shred and dismantle Wink.
February 9th, 2024 at 12:13 PM ^
There was a guy who charted the Ravens' defensive formations in 2020 and 2021 (https://www.filmstudybaltimore.com/). For what it's worth, Wink ran that 5-1-5 Nickel look about 8.2% of the time in 2020, and then only 4.2% of the time in 2021.