PSA: 5 P5 teams have better record than Harbaugh @ Michigan

Submitted by huntmich on
I've mentioned this in a couple threads already but I feel it needs broader distribution. 20-6 is good enough for sixth best record in the P5 over the last two years. 3 of the 5 teams with better records were playing in the playoffs this year. This was with the same squad that went 5-7 and didn't go bowling in 2014. For all of you giving Harbaugh mediocre grades for his short tenure thus far, please keep in mind what has already been accomplished by this coaching staff essentially immediately. http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-football/news/michigan-florida-state-o…
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erald01

January 1st, 2017 at 4:29 PM ^

In todays sports especially college you cannot win playing clean ball. Out of the 4 teams in the cfp only one is a clean program (UW). The rest got there with cheating one way or the other. I am not saying they still cheat but at one point cheated enough to be ahead of everyone else and give them that boost to stay ahead of everyone else.



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MGoStrength

January 1st, 2017 at 4:30 PM ^

But, it's hard not to think what could have been with so many close losses all at the end of the season and most on the road and some near misses on positions of need in recruiting.  I am so glad we have him & the staff, but it's hard to think we'll beat OSU next year and it's hard to think we're going to likely go 0-3 against our bitter rival who only continues to out-recruit us.

 

If in 2018 we've beaten our rivalsl, won a conference championship, finish the season strong, don't have major team flaws like a mediocre offensive line etc., and are recruiting even with OSU then all is good in the world.  But, if in another two years those things are still not yet happening many will remain hopelesslesly frustrated, albeit less so than under the previous two coaching staffs.

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lhglrkwg

January 1st, 2017 at 4:47 PM ^

I saw someone say "harbaugh is half the coach lloyd carr was" in the aftermath of the game. A lot of ninnys implying similar things.

Harbaughs track record speaks to itself. If you thought he was winning the national title in year 2 you were a little too over enthusiastic about what was realistic for harbaugh



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huntmich

January 1st, 2017 at 5:03 PM ^

The post literally above yours is already predicting a loss in The Game next year and then extrapolating that by 2018 fans may have reason to light pitchforks. I have seen an identical line of thinking from others on the board; it is what has sparked my vehement defense of this coaching staff over the last 24 hours. My argument is that we have already closed the gap on OSU and there is no reason to think we won't be able to compete with them next year at the Big House. In addition, regardless of the outcome of that game, Harbaugh has already brought us back to national relevance in breakneck speed. Based on his results in the first two seasons, there is no justification for this kind of self-defeating thinking.

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Hotel Putingrad

January 1st, 2017 at 5:31 PM ^

the way I see it, we only regularly play one team per year (OSU) with equivalent coaching and talent. If Harbaugh coached another 10 years, and we win 7 of those ten games, that's good enough for me. And I'm certain that at least one of those seven years would also include a national championship. I like winning, but I like beating OSU and running a clean program we can be proud of more than anything else. I'd probably say the same for Beilein and the basketball team as long as we're winning 60% of our games vs MSU and Indiana.

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Harboner35

January 1st, 2017 at 5:04 PM ^

I'm not at all impressed with his inability to win the big game. He is a great recruiter, and a good coach, but until he learns how to win the big ones he is a failure in my book. All sizzle and no steak. I think it can still happen, but it needs to happen fast

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Harboner35

January 1st, 2017 at 7:32 PM ^

You couldn't be more wrong. Lifelong Michigan fan here, just not one thats looking to settle for 3rd place instead of 6th place. We should be expecting the best should we not? Its the Leaders and Best, not 3rd place and I'll take my participation trophy now please. Stop being a bitch, and realize that getting better is NOT why Harbaugh was hired. You pay him $9 million per season to win B1G ships and win in the playoffs. Urban Meyer didn't need 4 years to win, so if we as Michigan fans wanna talk shit about being on their level, we need to have higher expectations!

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Don

January 2nd, 2017 at 10:57 AM ^

I don't think he's a troll from another fanbase. He's just a typical representative of the segment of every major fanbase that regards the success or failure of his team as a reflection on his alpha male masculinity, as his past comments show:

"I'm not the typical homer fuckboy."

"the truth hurts their feeble little feeling"

"Stop being a bitch..."

"another Lloyd Carr where they have nice 9 or 10 win seasons. Thats cute.."

"Caris being a pussy"

"I am flaccid in disappointment"

"I creamed 3 times while posting this just thinking about dat ass!"

"douche canoe typing in his mom's basement?"

To him, anybody who's not outraged by Harbaugh's manifest failure to deliver championships and not demanding "accountability" (whatever that means in practical, real-world terms—bombarding Manuel with angry emails?) is less of a man than he is—if not downright effeminate.

It's all about self-image, as his cartoonishly masculine avatar name shows. What's most important is being seen as aggressively hard, stiff, tough. Long ago Josef Jughashvilli started using the last name of Stalin, which roughly translated to "steel," and one of the iron laws of the internet today is that the most obnoxious posters always choose an avatar name that is self-aggrandizing in a way that emphasizes strength or some aspect of alleged superiority.

Speaking of his avatar—with his disgust over Harbaugh delivering the sizzle and not the steak, you'd think he'd change to some other figure more representative of the high alpha male standard he thinks he represents himself. Given his stated contempt for Carr—who delivered the only NC we've had in the last 68 years—and of course RR and Hoke, it's not clear why he's a Michigan fan in the first place. Seems like he'd be happier rooting for OSU or Alabama.

 

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goblue16

January 1st, 2017 at 5:05 PM ^

Most people are angry because of the NFL talent this team has. It doesnt matter that it's his second year there was wayy too much NFL talent to just match last years record. With that said I think a fair assessment of harbaugh will be 2017 and 2018. If he can't win at least 9 games next season or starts out 0-4 against OSU or make the playoff in 2018 or win a big ten title than I think it's fair to start questioning whether he's he guy for the job. Until then I will continue to support him



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bcnihao

January 1st, 2017 at 7:31 PM ^

"there was wayy too much NFL talent to just match last years record."  But that wasn't the evaluation voiced by many in this forum before the season, given that the team would face MSU, Iowa, and OSU all on the road, and that UM would again have a first-year starter at QB.

(MSU turned out to be worse than expected.  But other teams, notably Colorado, were better than expected.)

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huntmich

January 1st, 2017 at 8:03 PM ^

Again, if we 'start questioning' Harbaugh, leading to his firing before the fifth year, with the immediate turnaround he has already executed, there will not be a single good coach in the country that will take the Michigan job going forward. It would be a coaching gig where impossibly high expectations are demanded with zero patience.

 

Michigan is not Alabama. We can't demand national championships just because. Michigan has had 1 national championship in the past 60 years. I don't understand where the entitlement from some of our fanbase comes from. Harbaugh is building something potentially legendary. He immediately took a shitty team and turned it into the 6th best in the country, and he is following up that success with repeated top 5 recruiting classes. The only way we lose here is to not be patient.

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Perkis-Size Me

January 1st, 2017 at 5:07 PM ^

Hard to be mad with where we're at. Two years ago, we were the joke of the college football world. Now we're playoff contenders and recruiting top players. Two years ago we were light years away from competing with MSU/OSU, much less being able to beat them. Beat MSU, and went shut OSU down almost the entire game this year; should've beaten them too.

Next year will be a bit of a rebuilding project since there will be a lot of freshman and sophomore contributors, but the Harbaugh Effect is in force. These guys will be the foundation of successful years to come.



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Harboner35

January 1st, 2017 at 7:36 PM ^

Its because I'm not the typical homer fuckboy that just cheers for a team blindly. I believe there is a standard they should be held to, and if they dont play to it, they should be held accountable. Instead, people like you negg away because sometimes the truth hurts their feeble little feelings

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Harboner35

January 1st, 2017 at 8:08 PM ^

A twit? What are you a 40 year old balding douche canoe, typing in his mom's basement? Comeon. I have a differing opinion and everyone wants to bombard, instead of listening to facts. Exactly why everyone in the country picks on our fanbase. YES, SUPPORT HARBAUGH AND THE TEAM! But when shit hits the fan, don't make excuses, ask for accountability!

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UMFanstuckinOhio

January 1st, 2017 at 9:11 PM ^

Carr is the definition of mediocre. He won a NC with Mollers players and rode off into the sunset of average. And he is a king to most of the fan base. When in reality he left the talent level at below average because he got lazy in recruiting his last 2 years and then made the next coaches job immposible by working behind the secenes to get him ousted. He is not what everyone remembers him to be that is for damn sure.

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Wolverine2349

January 2nd, 2017 at 12:01 PM ^

I agree. I do not want another Lloyd Carr, and I seriously doubt Harbaugh is another Lloyd Carr. I think Harbaugh is as elite as they come and will take us to the elite program we should be unlike Lloyd Carr who never had one great season outside of 1997

 

Keep in mind Lloyd Carr only had one elite level seaosn at Michigan which was 1997. Extra special that year because we actually won the National title shared with Nebraska. However, he never had another season that was elite level. And no you do not actually have to win the NC to have an elite level season.

 

An elite level season means finishing with 2 losses or less with an outright conference title at the conclusion of bowl/CFP seaosn or espeically a 12-1/13-1 type season. OSU in 2006 got blown oit  badly by Florida, but still wnet 12-1 with a Big Ten title and a victory over us, but did not when the NC, but I would consider that an elite level season.

 

Lloyd Carr's 1998, 1999, 2000, 2003, 2004 and 2007 teams all had much more talent than Harbaug's 2016 team and yet they all lost 3 games always blowing 1 game and usually 2 to a team we had no business losing to. Lloyd Carr was a solid to decent coach but was not close to great plain and simple.When Harbaugh has teams in his mold with that level of talent as those years above or better, he will not have underachieivng 9-3/10-3 seasons and instead go 11-2 and 12-1 most of them unlike underachieivng Lloyd Carr.

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ca_prophet

January 1st, 2017 at 5:16 PM ^

We had a once-in-a-generation DL, the best CB in college football and a Heisman candidate but couldn't get it done, largely because one of those better-than-us-and-not-going-away teams is in our division. We have to elevate our game just to get to the B1G championship, to say nothing of the playoff. This is an obstacle we have that the other teams do not. In the long run it matters little - to be the best, you have to beat the best - but in the short run it means that to achieve our goals we have almost no margin for error.

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chatster

January 1st, 2017 at 5:43 PM ^

The biggest test so far for Jim Harbaugh’s coaching ability AND his assistants’ coaching ability will come next season.  Keep in mind that Michigan will be among the youngest and least experienced teams in the Big Ten next season, and there will be question marks and depth concerns with almost every position group on offense, defense and special teams, except for the fullback position where Henry Poggi and Khalid Hill will return.
 
If they (a) pick up some additional excellent recruits for the 2017 class, (b) not suffer any crucial de-commitments and unexpected transfers, (c) avoid serious injuries to anticipated starters like the ones suffered before and early this season by Drake Johnson, Grant Newsome and Jeremy Clark, and the Orange Bowl injuries to Jabrill Peppers and Jake Butt, and (d) mold a small group of returning starters and a large group of supposedly talented, but relatively untested freshmen and sophomores into a team that performs as well as Michigan did this year when it worked with a very large group of players with significant experience, then that will go a long way to determining whether Michigan can be back competing with the nation’s top teams.
 
Somewhat OT --  One Small Key to Next Season's Success:  How much will Michigan miss Scott Sypniewsli, Garrett Moores and Kenny Allen? 

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brianntb

January 1st, 2017 at 6:31 PM ^

I really really want to believe. 

But...this Michigan team -- under year 2 of Harbaugh -- shat the bed at the end of the season. They got worse while other teams (like Penn State) got much better. 

Iowa loss. Meager Indiana win. OSU loss. FSU loss. 

Plus, the very best college coaches (e.g. Saban) don't necessarily excel in the NFL and maybe NFL coaches won't excel in college. 

I think I'm being a pessimist. But damn, these last 2 months...

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Harboner35

January 1st, 2017 at 7:59 PM ^

Because I have a life and don't live on this forum. Don't post much. Not suggesting he be fired, just that you homers demand a little more! Why do you think others around the country pick on the Michigan fan base? Finebaum is an asshole, but he is partially correct.

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McSomething

January 1st, 2017 at 8:04 PM ^

First. I love the "I have better things to do than post all day" defense. Second, what the fuck does us saying anything on here change about a god damn thing with the preparation the coaches and players go through? And if you want to see people bitch, go through any game topic of a loss. Plenty to be had there. Again, fuck off.

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Harboner35

January 1st, 2017 at 8:35 PM ^

Thats the opposite of me. Entitled whine asses expect stuff from a mediocre program based on the history of that program. Like the asshats that tout how Muchigan is the winningest program ever. THATS NOT ME. I just expect more from a senior laden team sending 8 players to the NFL, and had the best D in the country. Big difference

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