EspnU Chris Childers and Rick Neuheisel (neutral observers) saying if UM goes 11-1 CFP committee will discount MSU loss due to ref screw job
So neuheisel, who hates Harbaugh and is an impartial observer, as well as his co-host Chris Childers, are going on and on about Saturday’s ref screw job and throwing stuff at their TVs while watching the game.
One can agree or disagree with their opinion of the officiating, but there are less invested professionals that understand it was a significant factor in the game.
More importantly, they believe if it’s an 11-1 situation at season’s end, UM gets the nod because the CFP committee will understand that aspect of the loss.
So that’s a positive take I hadn’t thought about…
November 1st, 2021 at 1:03 PM ^
You're last sentence lost me...
Otherwise - this scenario played itself out in 2016. The ref's stole a game, and Michigan never recovered. The next three seasons played out with familiar endings - collapses resulting in the team quitting. Last year was so far off that nobody was on-board from Spring training!
This year has seen a renewed sense of value from the team and coaches. It felt more like 2016 than it has since 2016. So what happens now? Do they give up and continue failing like previous iterations have? Or do they man up and show some resolve by picking up the pieces and gluing them back together for a solid run into the OSU game?
My money says it's the 2016 answer. I say it's 10-1 when those jackasses come up to Ann Arbor.
November 1st, 2021 at 12:15 PM ^
its a loss to a top 10 team, by one score, on the road. that's not a bad loss.
November 1st, 2021 at 12:39 PM ^
There was no ref screw job. We sucked.
November 1st, 2021 at 12:49 PM ^
Both things can be true. Both things are true.
The refs fucked us out of (at least) 4 points. That said, it should have never come down to those four points.
November 1st, 2021 at 12:46 PM ^
I mean, good, great -- but let's get to 11-1 first and worry about all of this later, eh?
November 1st, 2021 at 1:01 PM ^
If ESPN personalities are discussing ref malpractice, which is usually taboo in the sports media, then it's a legit issue that we are not just imagining
November 1st, 2021 at 1:29 PM ^
Exactly, this is huge for public perception, that people outside the fanbase concure that the refs tilted the game away from us. There shouldn't be a single fan here not beating the drum that we were hosed.
November 1st, 2021 at 1:01 PM ^
What people are missing, is that there are other factors beside scoreboard. Michigan led in statistics, on the road, and controlled much of the game. Our usual bad luck of bullshit up in EL haunted us, again. Those watching, seeing points taken away by bad officiating, realize, that the better team didn't necessarily win. Which is why UM only dropped a couple of spots in the AP poll.
As far as OU and OSU, it came down to an ill advised pass leading to an interception late, that cost OSU the game. As the season progressed, OSU's qb has improved and they've been annihilating their opponents, while Oregon has struggled. They went down to the wire against Cal and UCLA, both mediocre teams.
Chances are, the Buckeyes beat the Spartans in Columbus and if Michigan can take care of business ( does anyone know who the real Penn State is?), it will come down to our last game.
A three way tie for the Big East would put Michigan in the Big Championship. Therefore eliminating everyones worries about MSU's feelings.
November 1st, 2021 at 1:03 PM ^
Sounds great but there's a long way to go before we're 11-1
November 1st, 2021 at 1:20 PM ^
Reminds me of the Steve Martin joke of how to have $1 million and never pay taxes.
"First, get a million dollars..."
You too can get the CFP committee to discount the MSU loss...
"First, beat Ohio State..."
November 1st, 2021 at 1:29 PM ^
Is there a link to this?
November 1st, 2021 at 1:44 PM ^
I left the game feeling like this was 80% ref screw job and 20% shooting oneself in the foot, but that ratio has significantly changed in my head since:
Michigan was 0-7 on replay reviews. 5 of them were likely the right call. The two I am unsure on are:
- The strip sack/touchdown. Of course, if all they had available to themselves was the TV feed replays, this was an atrocious reversal. But I'm betting later this week, when Steve Shaw posts his weekly video on teachable moments from officiating, we are going to hear that they used other video from inside the stadium (e.g. all-22) that proved to be conclusive.
- MSU's Second Two Point Conversion. The rule states you need to control the ball all the way to the ground, which is pretty hard to say he did given that Turner had the ball at the ground and upon getting up. That said, MSU's receiver did take 3 off balance steps in the endzone before falling. At this point I don't know what the right call is. Remember the UTL when Gallon caught the game winning touchdown and bobbled it as he fell out of bounds? If that is a catch, then MSU's 2 pointer is too.
Other than that, I remember a missed hold where Aidan was in the backfield, and a crappy call of holding on Anthony that otherwise would have set up first and goal at the 4.
Two crappy calls do note make a screw job. Are their other calls people still take an exception to?
The plays that do keep going through my mind, that I think ultimately lost the game, were:
- Dumb backup QB handoff fumble
- Letting MSU make significant plays on 2 4th downs
- 2 dropped passes late in the 4th quarter on 'need to have it' moments
- 1 dropped interception
- Awful defensive substitutions - I understand one in the first half but, really, all game long?
November 1st, 2021 at 1:58 PM ^
The thing with the fumble is Thorne lost control on initial contact and bobbled it . He tried to regather it before ultimately losing it all together. I still see very few people talking about the fact that it wasn't clear he regathered completely initially even before being down or not ever came into the equation. There is no angle that would have made it a conclusive review.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:01 PM ^
Precisely! Putting the palm of your hand towards the tip of the football and trying to press it against your leg doesn’t mean you have control of it.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:20 PM ^
Yeah - if you are going on the video we have seen I don't think anybody will argue that it was an atrocious call.
I'm curious what other video they had to draw the conclusion they did (e.g. all-22).
November 1st, 2021 at 2:37 PM ^
The MSU catch that bounced off the turf was pretty iffy too. Especially at full-speed as Seth pointed out on the podcast.
I'd say that B1G Commissioner Kevin Warren's son's team faired quite well overall, especially on the highest leverage calls.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:19 PM ^
Yeah, that is the next call up for me in terms of ones in my vivid memory. I think it was clear that the ball hit the turf, but the rulebook allows for the ball to hit the turf as long as you maintain possession. Once the Spartan had possession he never relinquished it. Did he get possession before the ball hit the ground or after? I don't know.... tough call for me.
November 1st, 2021 at 4:18 PM ^
You could see the ball kick up the turf, that was unreal
November 1st, 2021 at 4:34 PM ^
hi scottie. just wanted to make sure you didn't miss any of my posts so you could 'neg' them. have a nice day. maybe consider therapy.
November 1st, 2021 at 1:56 PM ^
Is there a link to this or just satellite radio?
November 1st, 2021 at 1:59 PM ^
I pity MSU is they somehow make the playoff. Put them up against a team that doesn’t shoot itself in the foot with insane defensive substitutions, and give them a fairly refereed game (or likely a game with refs tilting in favor of Alabama or whomever) and it will be carnage.
November 1st, 2021 at 1:59 PM ^
If the playoff committee took Michigan over Michigan State because the committee believed Michigan played a significantly better season and just happened to get hosed by the officials on the road in one game, there could only be one correct response:
LAUGH OUR FUCKING ASSES OFF
November 1st, 2021 at 2:03 PM ^
I could see the Committee considering the garbage officiating, but I think the much more important factor is who else is in contention and what their records are.
11-1 Michigan is not getting in over 12-1 Georgia or 12-1 Alabama (if Bama wins the SECCG).
11-1 Michigan is not getting in over undefeated Oklahoma.
11-1 Michigan is not getting in over undefeated Wake Forest (no one believes in them but you can't leave out an undefeated P5).
11-1 Michigan *should* get in over undefeated Cincy, but hard to say without having any initial CFP rankings. If Cincy is #2 in Tuesday's rankings, then it's hard to see them being left out if they go undefeated.
11-1 Michigan probably gets in over 12-1 Oregon. Oregon has looked terrible in Pac-12 play, and if we beat Ohio State, then that neutralizes Oregon's sole quality win.
11-1 Michigan probably does not get in over 1-loss MSU, but maybe a 12-1 Michigan does. I don't see how the Committee overlooks the head-to-head result unless Michigan somehow wins a 3-way East division tiebreaker and then wins the Big Ten. Head-to-head carries huge weight, you'd need a conference championship to have any shot.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:32 PM ^
I'd give Cincinnati the edge in getting in, but not certain.
I disagree about Oregon. There's no fucking way a conference champion 12-1 team gets left out in favor over an 11-1 team without a conference championship. Results have to matter...don't care how "terrible" Oregon has looked, if they earn it they earn it (and anyway, their 1 loss is arguably more tainted than ours, because they got hosed by a bad penalty call on a game-deciding play).
The only way an 11-1 Michigan gets in is if the team (MSU or OSU) which gets to the B1G championship loses that game (at this point I can all but guarantee even an 11-2 OSU gets in over 11-1 UM, because our existence is pain). I think 1 Big Ten Team is all but guaranteed, but I don't see a scenario in which there is more than 1 considering how many teams are in the hunt this year. The only conference that could get in 2 teams at this point is the SEC if Bama wins out and has an identical 12-1 record to Georgia.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:03 PM ^
I will say alot of people are discounting that the committee may just say we want the best four teams. I think the majority of people watching that game besides MSU fans came away with the feeling that the better team did not win. So a scenero with a 11-1 MSU and UM with a UM win over OSU and a blowout loss to OSU by MSU is one I could see head to head in such a close game being potentially discounted. The more likely scenero would be a 11-1 UM being put in over a conference winner in a weaker conference though.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:08 PM ^
If - MSU loses one game, and not two, and we somehow finish 11-1 (not happening now), and Sparty wins the BTCG, it would be a real surprise if we got the nod over Sparty.
Net - then it is 2015 all over again
November 1st, 2021 at 2:52 PM ^
Do you guys not feel the slightest shame or distaste letting the words "screw job" leave your lips with this annual frequency? It's football, it's officiated by human beings, mistakes are inevitable. Meanwhile, a guy ran for 200 yards and 5 touchdowns on your defense; perhaps you're focused on the wrong things.
Outside the maize bubble, your brand as a fan base is one of unearned arrogance, seasoned with constant crying about how everything's unfair and nothing is ever your fault — it's always fluke this and 1 inch that and waah screw job why won't Warde speak to the manager.
Sure, big picture I enjoy it, but... honestly, gross, don't you guys have any self awareness? You're my friends, neighbors, cousins. I want better for you, this makes me cringe.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:20 PM ^
And a previously maligned QB threw all over the field for 400 yards against your defense on the other side. Any Sparty fan who can take a step back and be objective should be able to admit that they got breaks in that game. Also Spartan or not at minimum should be able to admit they directly got help on the scoreboard on a review that had no business being overturned. What's actually embarrassing is for someone to honestly look at a game where the yards were 530 to 390, where one team did objectively get 4 points taken off the board at minimum errerously (not even including stuff like an obvious penalty on fourth down, etc) that they should have had and sit there and not at least be able to admit that hey maybe we did in fact get some significant luck in our favor. I am not sure if you are a Spartan fan you can count on replay officials not knowing what conclusive means every game after all.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:21 PM ^
Holy fuck, here you are on Page 3 of responses to a message board post of another school's football team.
Go follow your own shitty team and leave us alone.
November 1st, 2021 at 5:57 PM ^
I’m following my team. Drinking your tears on the monday after another win against Michigan is a sparty rite of passage, thank you for participating!
November 2nd, 2021 at 12:01 AM ^
With how important the Michigan game is to Michigan St, you really must have feeling of inferiority. And wow, great job on the burned couches and tipped car.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:36 PM ^
Posters are reacting as if Childers and Neuheisel said the committee should take UM if *both* UM and MSU are 11-1, as opposed to if UM is competing for the spot with another 11-1 team. Did they say that?
November 1st, 2021 at 5:08 PM ^
The flaw with this analysis is that SOMEBODY is going to go to the B1G Championship Game and assuming they win, will end up a 12-1 Conference Champion (or 10-2 if they lose). Maybe that's OSU (assuming they beat Sparty, and we beat them to get to 11-1, and then OSU gets the secondary tie-breaker). I have a hard time see Michigan getting the nod over a 12-1 or 11-2 Conference Champion. Yeah, there's precedent with OSU instead of PSU, but only the Buckeyes get that much benefit of the doubt.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:43 PM ^
It's nice to know that guys who are not Michigan homers think the officiating was poor and one sided. However, I'd prefer the Rose Bowl to having Georgia run us off the field in the semis.
November 1st, 2021 at 4:29 PM ^
Well, you're just posting a negative response after watching the way Michigan did some things against MSU.
Though if Michigan makes the playoffs, then that would mean they're playing a lot better and maybe capable of giving Georgia a competitive game.
November 1st, 2021 at 4:18 PM ^
Neuheisel does not hate Harbaugh at all, btw. Not like Finebaum does, at least (but Finebaum derides anyone who doesn't coach Alabama). Anyway, Neuheisel was actually praising Harbaugh for the most part on their show on Friday - mainly for JH shifting back to the offensive fundamentals that made his Stanford teams so good, and went on to lament that Stanford had lost its way in that respect.
November 1st, 2021 at 4:43 PM ^
I kinda stay away from college football sports talk the following week after Michigan gets defeated in a game.
Though I'm curious to know if other sports talk people were talking about the questionable refereeing and not just the guys mentioned in this thread.
November 1st, 2021 at 5:33 PM ^
May be look beyond just W-L. Thats what everyone looks at but both teams played hard and MSU got some breaks and won. Ok. Now what.
I believe that Michigan can learn and grow MORE vs MSU from here on out. Lets see how Michigan reacts and plays. For one, the McNamara and Andrell connection could be deadly. Can Corum bounce back? can the new DC fix the sub issue? If there is improvement then Michigan can absolutely give OSU all it can handle and beat them in Ann arbor.
Lets go Blue. Excited about next weekend game already.
November 1st, 2021 at 6:26 PM ^
This is really dumb. It's Michigan we're talking about. The only chance they'd pull something like that is if it left Michigan out.
November 1st, 2021 at 7:21 PM ^
I don't think that is going to happen. In 2014 TCU had 1 loss. It was in a rivalry game. And it was affected by a bad call. TCU would have very likely won if not for the bad call. But no matter. The CFP committee didn't take that into account. TCU did not get in.
November 1st, 2021 at 11:00 PM ^
Well, Alabama won a national Championship without winning their conference. If we end up with the same record as Sparty and make the 4 over them, I won’t feel bad. Change the format.
November 2nd, 2021 at 12:08 AM ^
I can't see why the committee would do that. I mean, it fills up time in an ESPN talk show to sit and bs and kick that idea around. But really, head to head would puts State in.