Turner's Future and how that relates to RR/Staff
I think of all of those that left our program for whatever reason (NFL, attitude, playing time, academic, team rules, etc.) Turner's departure should be the most telling.
If he transfers to another D1 and has a very successful career that is very telling.
If he transfers to another D1 and is mediocre-to-does nothing that would be very telling.
If he transfers to a non-D1 for football that is very telling.
If he never plays football again that also would be very telling.
I'm not sure how much affect this will have on RR's tenure at UM, his success in continuing to recruit Ohio, etc., as this fall's W/L record will decide most of that. However I think Turner's future will be very interesting with regard to RR and his staff and how they manage a program.
August 11th, 2010 at 2:51 PM ^
That this is the situation with the Zen master and the little boy?
August 11th, 2010 at 2:56 PM ^
Justin Turner is no longer in the program. The future of RR and this team will be determined by what happens on the field. Maybe I'm just telling myself that - but I believe it.
August 11th, 2010 at 3:06 PM ^
Now that is a brilliant ad campaign!
August 11th, 2010 at 3:20 PM ^
I'm going to be sad when my 50+ points expire only because I will no longer be able to plus 1 things like this. Sigh.
August 11th, 2010 at 4:11 PM ^
And as a former Tokyo resident, I wish you well.
August 11th, 2010 at 3:05 PM ^
is that with the 3 safeties, you really don't have a need for a nickel CB, which places a bit less need for depth at CB. Hopefully Floyd and TWoolf can hold it down with Cullen getting some reps as well.
August 11th, 2010 at 3:11 PM ^
and he kept away from them, I thought that was a pretty significant comment; not saying Justin is/was a disease, but this move seems like an odd coincidence when combined with Troy's statement.
August 11th, 2010 at 3:22 PM ^
to the op's comments can we deduce that his future success or a lack there of can have either a positive or a negative appearance on this program? I suppose if I was drinkng this early in the afternoon, that would make sense but in the sober state that I hapen to be in right now I tend to think more of a guy named Sam Mcguffie who left for personal reasons and was (not litterally, but you know) never talked about again. Let us remember that this year he will be able to play again and from what I have seen he is not being used as the litmus test for RR, the staff, or the program. my guess is that in 3 months the question will be JT WHO.
August 11th, 2010 at 3:23 PM ^
to the op's comments can we deduce that his future success or a lack there of can have either a positive or a negative appearance on this program? I suppose if I was drinkng this early in the afternoon, that would make sense but in the sober state that I hapen to be in right now I tend to think more of a guy named Sam Mcguffie who left for personal reasons and was (not litterally, but you know) never talked about again. Let us remember that this year he will be able to play again and from what I have seen he is not being used as the litmus test for RR, the staff, or the program.
August 11th, 2010 at 6:14 PM ^
McGuffie had concussion-induced depression, and needed a year off from football simply because his brains needed to re-find that comfy spot in the head. Doing that in a town far from home during a rebuilding project where tensions are extremely high and he hasn't known anybody for more than few months, well, that wasn't a great option. And there were family issues that made it even harder for him to be away.
He didn't transfer to a team that will play Michigan, or to his other options during recruiting. He went to a great school near home.
Sam's leaving didn't say anything about McGuffie, or the program. It was just one of those bad luck things.
Plus, Sam's position was filled with other players similar to him, and at the time he left there were two seniors at the top of the depth chart, and lots and lots of young talent.
Turner leaves either because RR cared more about program values not being violated than placating a high-calibur recruit, or because Turner's will was not strong enough, or maybe both.
August 11th, 2010 at 3:48 PM ^
Over weight and out of shape and unable to crack a lineup where the secondary was in shambles. Had all season to turn around is unwillingness to actually get into shape and could of started. Comes in his second season at almost 200 pounds and out of shape. I just don't understand what that has to do with the coach. This guy blatanly diddn't want to play and apparently never cared enough to think for two seconds, hey if I get into shape I/m starting for this team last year and this year. It's a tought loss because of his potential but obviously his work ethic is an issue. Good riddens let's move on people.
August 11th, 2010 at 5:16 PM ^
Now the OP certainly would be placed in the high-risk category, with regard to getting negbanged, pretty much any time of year. But I'm going easy on him.
For one, this board is not loathe to repeat the same justifications ad infinitum, and so I will invoke the tried-and-true, "Hey, it's nearing the end of the offseason and we're all cracking a bit, becoming highly vulnerable to looking too deeply into little things." In the absense of true substance, the mind creates subtance-like-substance. So there's that.
But if these "telling" signs are, indeed, telling us anything, their message should not be considered to exist in a vacuum. The OP is pointing out that this departure may reflect a failure, by the coaching staff, to manage difficult attitudes -- and that certain circumstances, if observed down the road, would allow us to infer such a conclusion. And this is not the first time evidence has pointed to inability to manage and motivate players (consider the Illinois debacle last season, among others).
We all know that RR has received undue negative press, and we are aware of the dearths of talent lately -- but that does not necessarily paint the entire picture. We're dealing with a football team, it's a complex system, so linear causal pathways --although conveniently used by people of diverse affiliations-- are not going to be accurate. There may be more to the picture than a lack of talent in the cupboard. Winning football games is a human endeavor, after all, and so psychology is the most important factor (at least, so say the majority of players and coaches... /anecdote). And one's psychology can be influenced, mediated, and modified.. Some players are hopeless, but there is a gradient between "cancer" and "problem." If Turner pans out elsewhere, why wouldn't it indicate a failure of management here?
Anyway, just my ten cents.
August 12th, 2010 at 10:31 AM ^
(1) We have no idea what will happen to Turner, so there's not much reason to speculate about what hypothetical future scenarios MIGHT mean in terms of the Michigan staff's handling of the issue.
(2) As you point out, these matters are sufficiently complex that it's hard to pin blame on any one factor, even when in the future we will be able to look back on Turner's collegiate career.
(3) He's ONE PERSON, certainly not enough evidence to establish a pattern.
RR and his staff should be judged on the success and progress of the program as a whole, not the success and progress of one particular player. I hope that Turner's absence doesn't have a big effect on the success of the team this year. Based on what people have been saying, it sounds like he would have had a steep hill to climb in terms of his conditioning to make a significant impact on the field this year.
August 12th, 2010 at 10:50 AM ^
The OP reminds me of my degenerate gambler uncle-in-law who is always reading way too much into irrelevant info to help him pick the winner.
Wait…
Uncle Ronnie, is that you?