Explain Sparty hate to a puzzled outsider
First off- I come in peace
Second, I come in peace (in case you missed the first sentence)
OK
I have lived in Columbus Ohio all my life since 1959. I heard "Go Bucks!" more often than "Good Morning!" (BTW we did have mornings there). So I sort of became a UM fan out of rebellion. I "get" the OSU vs UM hate- both teams have been dominant a long time and knocked each other out of fun stuff a lot.
I do not have as good a sense for what goes on inside Michigan (the State). I sense, from reading these boards, that most of you guys may actually hate MSU more than OSU (I scientifically counted things like "Fuck Sparty!"). I understand CFB state rivalry, but not this one so much.
There are reasons this dislike should NOT be so intense:
1. UM has owned Sparty forever in terms of wins and losses- despite recent losses
2. I would assume there are many more UM fans in the State of Michigan than Sparty fans due to MSU's long track record of mediocrity- so you should outnumber Sparty fans quite a bit and feel like neighbors/coworkers are on your side
3. MSU has a high percentage of players who are from Michigan and that should give anybody from Michigan a sense of satisfaction when they achieve
So what is it? Is it the recent losses only? Was it this intense 15 years ago? Is it the coach? Would a nice guy coach end this dislike? Is it the fans? Are they really different than other fans? Does the fact that ANY team from Michigan is in the playoffs mean nothing?
I believe JH will have us back in the playoffs sooner than later and don't really think about MSU much. So, as an outsider to the state of Michigan, I am curious as to what has happened to make this hate so intense. I understand OSU vs. UM but don't understand why MSU angers so many more given the 3 items I outlined above. What am I missing as an outsider to the state?
thanks ( and I promise not to bring the subject up again)
Go Blue!
December 6th, 2015 at 10:24 PM ^
Hi, pleased to meet you. I'm flashOverride here, but I'm HerbieBlue over at RCMB.
Oh, wait. No I'm not. Come to think of it, I don't have an account there. It must be my inferiority complex.
December 6th, 2015 at 8:12 PM ^
Red Cedar Message Board and there is a thread titled: "I think scum just hit bottom (Update: awaiting dead cat bounce)." That thread has over 14,000 posts and over 1 million views.
December 6th, 2015 at 9:24 PM ^
Got a new job where I train in Lansing. Most of the people are State grads so I already know what to expect.
Overheard a guy talk about Michigan saying the "delusion is real" about something or another. Mentioned that we always keep saying just wait until we get a QB. Then discounted John O'Korn, as though there would be no way in hell O'Korn or whomever is the starter next season could possibly be great.
Not like Connor Cook was a random 3-star or anything.
December 6th, 2015 at 9:39 PM ^
....everyone knows that Michigan is forever better than MsU in everything in the long run.
In the end, nobody will ever think of them as 'the best'....
That's reserved eternally for Michigan & those that support Michigan.
That's basically the problem.
December 6th, 2015 at 10:36 PM ^
From a historical perspective MSU is an agricultural college vs UM being a blueblood institution. Instate hatred between these types of schools is pretty common in the United States and the rivalry goes back 100 years.
You can google it for more reading if interested.
In state we are rivals 1/3 to 1/2 the state growing up Sparty fans or Michigan fans. Families, couples etc are split down the middle between the schools in many cases. We hate them, they hate us and it will be that way until Jesus comes back which is the only way we can ever love each other.
The personal remarks about their coach I don't care for much...the rivalry existed before our current coaches for decades and will exist long after our coaches (and us) are gone.
December 6th, 2015 at 10:53 PM ^
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December 6th, 2015 at 11:07 PM ^
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December 7th, 2015 at 12:20 AM ^
I'll say one thing that's Pro-Sparty.
It must be difficult to have the school you identify as your rival, your enemy, look back at you as an annoyance on their way to play their rival (who also sees them as their rival.)
It's got to be like being the 3rd wheel.
The rivalry between Ann Arbor & East Lansing goes WAAAAAYYY back though. Detroit was once the most populous city in the state, home to the University of Michigan and the state capitol. When the outstate reps didn't like the power all in the big city they voted to move the capitol. AA was considered the top choice, but the outstate bumpkins thought it was still too far, so Lansing got it. As a consolation to AA, Detroit was stripped of the fine university established there.
December 7th, 2015 at 3:57 AM ^
If it needs explained your not much of a fan. If your a Michigan fan regardless if your from Michigan or not, this is an easy answer. Im getting a troll vibe here
December 7th, 2015 at 1:17 PM ^
December 7th, 2015 at 11:16 AM ^
December 11th, 2015 at 6:11 PM ^
"This used to be a prevailing thought around here."
Like back before they started owning the rivalry? Bottom line is our rival is in the playoffs due in large part to one of the flukiest plays in the history of college football, and that play happened against us, in our stadium. Therefore I am openly rooting against them. Is that so hard to understand?
December 7th, 2015 at 11:23 AM ^
My take has always been this:
1. MSU fans have never hidden their vitriol and hate for all things Michigan. For me this is not has always been a two way street. Since they have become a successful program in fooball social media has also become a thing so all that comes to you via newsfeeds very easy and you don't have to get out of bed to read something ridiculous or hear trash talk.
2. Although they have decent fans who are great to talk to about all things cfb and B10 they also have a very famous and large sect of their fanbase who takes pride in being over the top, offensive and off color and who may more than likely have been bullied by a Michigan fan at some point in there life and enjoy Michigan losing at anything more than MSU winning anything. More than likely they are only fans of State because they hate Michigan (see the RCMB). The good fans often go out of their way to acknowledge these fans and not condone their representation of the program and distance themselves from them.
3. Depending where you live in Michigan you probably have more Spartan fans in your ears than OSU fans. They will chime in every time MSU wins or every time Michigan has someone decommit. They are your classmates, coworkers and relatives. Especially if you reside in rural areas or the Lansing area. Because of your relationships with these people they will never go full RCMB on you and only rib you or give you a smirk, but to be safe you must assume they all post on the RCMB.
4. They will indict Michigan based on effigys and stereotypes that have been perpetuated long before I was born (arrogant, classless, etc.), and pride themselves on a code of honor from a Frank Miller movie, but when a State player does something and a big deal is made about it they will spin the story to fit their narrative. Jim Harbaugh yells at the refs too much. Tom Izzo sticks up for his team, Mike Hart is disrespectful but Draymond Green is just having fun. The Fab 5 were too brash and cocky. Connor Cook is just a kid and he was caught up in the moment.
Everyone's reasons are different, but I think most in state Michigan fans can probably relate to this list. Feel free to add to it.
December 7th, 2015 at 11:50 AM ^
State overshadows Michigan in athletics and it has been that way for years now, a couple of decades in basketball and almost a decade in football. Hate is always born of fear in this case the tangible fear that this status quo is going to remain for years to come.
December 7th, 2015 at 6:01 PM ^
Basketball? Yes. Which is funny because Michigan is the last of the two of them to have the deepest run in the tournament, and that happened within in the last decade. Their national championship was 3 years after Michigan's last football NC. Football? They have had more success, but I don't think they overshadow Michigan as far as presence or image or marketability goes. That's what frustrates their fanbase is their football team's biggest wins have all been under covered on a national stage compared to Michigan's last 3 coaching searches.
December 11th, 2015 at 8:47 PM ^
"Michigan is the last of the two of them to have the deepest run in the tournament"
I guess you didn't tune in last year?
Edit: You are correct because of the way you worded this, but I don't tink it's a good point because they made it to yet another final four last year.
December 11th, 2015 at 9:39 PM ^
December 7th, 2015 at 2:27 PM ^
Because that's how in-state rivalries work.
December 11th, 2015 at 5:22 PM ^
Michigan hates MSU for a lot of reasons. It goes back a century and a half to when UM wanted MSU to be a sattelite campus, and continued to UM's opposition to MSU's entry into the Big Ten.
But recently, UM hates MSU simply because MSU is better. Not necessarily academically, though MSU is world class in many areas (I have 2 degrees from UM [B.A. and J.D.] and 1 from MSU [M.A.Ed], but let's be honest, if this was only about academics, UM would hate Northwestern) but as an athletic department. Their basketball team has been dominant since Robert Traylor rolled that SUV over, and their football team has been dominant since Ryan Mallet transferred. MSU is better at being Michigan in football than MIchigan is. UM had the tough teams, the big running backs, the maniacal defenses, the QBs who got drafted... now MSU does. Kids who are Juniors in high school were 8 years old when Lloyd Carr left, and it is occurring to Michigan fans that their whole "MSU will go back to being MSU" might refer to MSU of the 50's and 60's (where they completely dominated UM).
Many here like to say that MSU is Staee (has anyone noticed that the car was a junker in that photo? Often the type of junker than kids would beat with a sledgehammer? Like... the rivals of that team?) and mock MSU for various reasons. The reality is, its a rivalry. Michigan's rivalry with OSU is like a country club rivalry (each team wants the other to be undefeated coming into the Game) whereas the UM-MSU rivalry is a gang war where any fan of either team would rather their opponent never played again... You tell me who the bigger rival is.
December 11th, 2015 at 8:50 PM ^
Staee car definitely not a junker:
December 11th, 2015 at 9:54 PM ^
December 14th, 2015 at 2:05 PM ^
But Michigan hates MSU too. That is how rivalries work. Michigan fans don't want MSU to be good because college football tends to be a zero sum game. This fake air of superiority is somewhat annoying to MSU fans because at least they are honest about it. You think Alabama doesnt take time to mock Auburn (they do), you think Texas cares about Texas A&M's recruiting (they do).
The point is, have fun with it at least. I don't hate Michigan, but I certainly think it's fun to get all riled up. Why not? If you don't care about your rivals, then you are rooting for a team in a vacuum which, at least to me, makes little sense.
December 11th, 2015 at 5:47 PM ^
December 14th, 2015 at 4:05 PM ^
Edit: Removed because it does not tell the story we want to hear.