landing spot. will be interesting to see how he does.
Is she available Saturday, say about noon?
It was so poorly placed and horrible that it was hilarious. Not in a funny way, but in a sad "retarded person calling someone retarded" way. Bravo!
That's what I was going for.
I would like to see someone with close ties to the program.
How would close ties to the program make him any better of a DC? When can't put limitations on the search, if RR stays let's get the best damn DC available.
Jim Harbaugh for DC
Why do you think JH would come back home when he is running a great program at a prestigious (sp?) university in a WARM climate ?
First off - no one really thinks Harbaugh will be the DC. Also, Stanford University is prestigious, but the football program is not at all compared to UM. And Harbaugh played here. If he had the chance to come back to UM and be the second coming of Bo (likely for a lot more money than he's making at Stanford), I wouldn't be surprised if he did it.
JH has probably reached his ceiling at Stanford. A couple of the other teams are up and coming, and USC probably won't be down for too long. If he were to leave, within the next couple years would be the right time.
Yes, that was the joke.
And don't think the irony of a "(sp?)" tag on the word "prestigious" is lost on me. It surely isn't.
Yes, that was the joke.
And don't think the irony of a "(sp?)" tag on the word "prestigious" is lost on me. It surely isn't.
No one predicted RR would hire GERG after we went all 3-3-5 on Purdue two years ago w/ Puppet Schafer at the helm, so good luck guessing RR's next hire in this thread.
Tony Gibson is promoted internally. *shotgun in mouth*
Realistically I think you start backing truckloads of cash up to Casteel's house until he comes here if we retain RR. Guy with a respectable track record and proven results working with RR (although perhaps he stated at WVU because he felt RR was too much of a control freak, who knows).
If RR for whatever reason agrees to completely clean house I'd make a play on Trgovacs and let him hire whoever he wants for position coaches.
I certainly hope Gibson is NOT promoted, but I don't think he's as bad as everyone says. He has had practically the WORST collective unit of talent/experience since arriving. Honestly, I'd be fine keeping him around so long as Casteel were to come.
...as much attrition and failure to develop high level recruits at a position group as Michigan has had with the defensive backfield, it is generally laid at the feet of the position coach.
I think we should start an MGoCollectionPlate to raise enough money to get Jeff Casteel to come here.
Assuming Bill Stewart continues to drive WVU into the ground (and they could easily lose their next 4 games), I think RR will try one more time to get Casteel to come up and run the 3-3-5 for us.
Seems to make sense. Smart guy, close ties to RR, and has legitimate experience running the 3-3-5 effectively, unlike GERG
You owe me a Coke.
The problem I see with Casteel is that he is probably looking for some stability. Just my guess, but he'd probably rather sign up for a program where the staff won't immediately be on the hot seat ala Rich Rod if he's still here next year.
I'd love to have him though, but I find it hard to believe any amazing DC will want to take over this mess.
I have to assume that RR has already tried to get him, from day 1, and both Shafer and GERG were back-up choices.
I understand if the guy doesn't want to leave a good situation. Which is why we should all hope for a Hindenburg-type end to WVU's season.
you said +1 but there is no upvote on that comment. really?
a Hindenburg-type end to WVU's season
I've been hoping for that for the last three years since every person I've met from West Virginia started showing me irrational hatred (when your administration won't adequately pay assistants and upgrade facilities, you shouldn't be mad at your golden boy coach and his new traditional powerhouse when he is forced to leave for real big time opportunities).
I was thinking this too. Depending on who RR hires, maybe DB can give him a contract extension with a lower buyout to help with recruits and with the DC/position coaches.
On the other hand, if Casteel completely turns around our D he would get a lot praise nationally and set himself up for a future HC job.
"Yeah, but if we win the lottery, we'll have to pay all those damn taxes."
Look at it this way:
All next year's coordinator will likely have to do is keep teams to < 30 points. The offense will take care of the rest. That doesn't sound too risky to me.
That sounds familiar...
and take a shit before the game, rather than right there on national TV during the game with everyone watching and all.
...you have talent at every position group, however, that talent either hasn't been developed (or had questionable development) or is being criminally misused (Craig Roh).
Get someone in here who'll run a 3-4 (with Roh at his natural position as rush linebacker in a 3-4) and spend some serious time developing our 4 star recruits in the D-backfield and you'll see a tremendously improved defense.
Why didn't he come in the first place?
How about tomorrow? Anyone with any sort of intelligence level, coaching experience or not, could do a better job than this undeserving-of-his-hair ignoramus we have right now.
The contrast between your comment and your signature is humorous.
Well, Robinson is ruining this team. The players, fans, and other coaches don't deserve this level of incompetence.
And I did notice my ironic sig before I read your comment, but I'll stand by it the instant Robinson is removed from the coaching staff.
Yeah, but who would win? A Ditka defense, or a hurricane?
Trick question: Ditka is all and everything so he is part of the hurricane and the hurricane is part of him.
Ditka would dispatch his hair to distract the hurricane from one side while he wallops the hurricane into the last century from the other side.
what if the hurricane's name is Hurricane Ditka?
"You gonna play the Fridge this week? You're 11-0 for crite pete..."
If Magnus doesn't take a HC position somewhere else, he is the choice. No question.
Jim Herrmann circa 1997.
Does Charles Woodson, Glenn Steele, Andre Weathers, Dhani Jones, and Marcus Ray come with that package?
For those of us willing to entertain the possibilities of this stuff both if Rodriguez stays or if he goes..............
1) If RR stays..... you have to expect there will be changes in the defensive coaching staff. HAVE TO. But who will come with RR still facing major threat of being removed the following year. Casteel is obviously a popular choice but again, why would he come here if he could get dumped the following year barring improvement. Think it will be hard to hire someone of quality. Further, RR hires haven't been great. I really don't have a clue. Do we think David Brandon would stick his nose into it?
2) If he is relieved of his duties.....I'll divide this into (A) & (B)
(A) Brandon goes for a Michigan Man at the helm.....lets face it, after having an outsider, there should be pretty solid pressure on Brandon to come back to our roots and Jim Harbaugh makes a lot of sense in that regard rather than trying our hand with another unknown. So lets call this likely options with Harbaugh....
(i) His current D.C. - Vic Fangio http://www.gostanford.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/fangio_vic00.html - Check out the NFL roots on this one.
(ii) Someone from the Michigan family -
Corwin Brown?? Wasn't exactly a world beater at ND
Steve Morrison (unlikely after Western broke him off as D.C.)
What about Mike Trgovac - Many years as DC for Carolina Panthers and currently coaching in Green Bay.
(B) Someone from outside the Michigan Family is hired as Head Coach... This is simple...SWING AWAY. I guess anything is possible.
But who will come with RR still facing major threat of being removed the following year.
Yeah, that's precisely why I included "legitimate and reasonable" in my initial post. You make a great point.
I'm close to what you laid out here.
Basically 2 options...
1. New DC in '11 and RR and the whole gang along with the new DC get til '12 to prove their worth.
2. No real big shakeups in def coaching staff and '11 is the judgement year for Rrod. I doubt if Rrod will trust GERG to save his job.
I guess 3 is a possible option as well...
3. Rrod religously frequents MGoBlog. He spirals into a horrible depression and resigns. GERG is promoted to HC and turns our program around and is regarded as the new Bo 30 years from now.... yeah
Your option 3 gave me a much needed chuckle. Sorry I don't have any points or whatever they are to give you.
We just need a cohesive staff on the defensive side of the ball. Whether that comes from getting Casteel back up here with his old gang, or completely cleaning house and bringing in a staff whole from another team. We need a DC who doesn't have to learn new terminology and schemes from his assistants. We need a full set of defensive coaches who are all of one mind, and have familiarity in working with one another. Other than bringing up Casteel, I just don't know how else to achieve that kind of chemistry.
There is no way that RR cleans house with the defensive staff. I think he is too loyal to those guys he brought with him from WV.
Dave Brandon knows no loyalty to the defensive staff. If he wants them out, they're out. What's RR going to do aside from begging? If I were Brandon I might say it's either half of your entire coaching staff, or all of it. Take your pick.
Cleaning house would be a great way to lose all of our recruits on D.
Respectfully disagree with that. Do you honestly think there are 4* and 5* recruits out there watching our defense and thinking "I can't wait to play for Greg Robinson"?
If anything, I'd say the opposite. There are D recruits out there that are not considering Michigan because they don't want to be part of this sieve. Replace Gerg with someone promising, and we could reap benefits in recruiting.
How many defensive recruits did we lose in 2008 after RR let all of Lloyd Carr's defensive staff go?
Besides, should we really be held hostage by a few kids who may or may not come here, anyway?
...how many position coaches on D have had a lot of raving about them (which is hte only way that D coaches effect recruiting)? Only Bruce Tall...with many of the transfers really critizing Tony Gibson as D-backs coach. And we had no decommitments that I can think of when GERG fired the LBs coach after last season.
Loyalty works great in Mafia, gang, turf war style management.
In business, which CFB is, loyalty over competence is a recipe for DOOM.
Can't he just move Gibson to special assistant to the special assistant?
What if he has no choice?
whomever the next head coach selects as his DC. However, in an effort to play along (and get props if this actually happens), I propose
92 Co-Captain, All B10 DB, Currently DB of the Pats, so DC @ Michigan is a promotion.
a top coordinator. Let's face it, if you come to Michigan next year (with Rod in place) you have to be concerned it is a one-year deal. Also, if RR is under the gun, I don't see him turning his future over to someone he doesn't know. He made that move with Robinson and we know how that worked out. That's where Casteel might come in. There is the relationship, and WVU is going the wrong way. Casteel might do it to support Rod, and if he's successful he has definitely improved his resume for HC jobs.
if that's a coach's concern, he can get a multi-year deal w/ a buyout if he isn't retained.
The zooker got petrinos brother to come be the OC when he looked to be more out the door then RR doesn now.
Steve Sharik. End of story.
Hell, hire Mathlete as the OC and put TomVH in charge of recruiting, and we'll take the whole damn thing over. So Brian Cook becomes the next head coach of the Michigan Wolverines. Film at 11.
I would love to see a press conference where Brian discusses each player's rating from the UFR. The phrase "peanut butter jelly time" has also not been used enough in press conferences to date.
Instead of spending millions of $$ to buy out RichRod, UM should go out and buy the best DC there is (whomever that is). I believe that's more than any college DC and should make us very attractive. Much better investment than canning RR and searching for a new HC
You do realize that there won't be a spending of millions for a buyout. Every coach in the NCAA regardless of school or sport has a clause that allows the school to void their contract if the NCAA rules they committed a major violation. As we've already self imposed a major violation, thats going to happen and accordingly, if he chooses, Brandon will have a one shot opportunity to get rid of the staff without financial concern. If they allow him to continue, based on contract law, arguably they would lose that ability.
All that said, IF things go poorly and a change is made, I suspect they'll throw the staff a small financial bone (nothing remotely like paying out the rest of the contract) and let them resign rather than being fired.
We'll honor the contracts of any fired coaches. Brandon knows that the violations are peanuts. It doesn't matter, because donors will step up to the plate. Retaining RR might actually be the bigger financial gamble. If the next four games go anything like the previous three and RR is still retained, there is a non-trivial chance that we'll take a hit in ticket sales and donations.
chance for ticket sales to crash. Not in my lifetime. Donations, possibly.
that will be up to the new head coach.
Or, so I hear.
Who will come if Rodriguez might be fired after next year? Money can make a lot of guys willing to take the chance. Illinois brought in two coordinators by backing up the money truck even though if one or both failed they would be out of a job as Zook would have been canned. Bring in whoever they're going to hire (and it had better be someone proven, and not proven in a bad way like GERG) on a 3 year guaranteed contract. If Rodriguez gets canned because the D is still bad then that DC still has financial security while looking for another job. And if Rodriguez doesn't get canned, the DC has clearly done a good enough job to warrant his sticking around for that contract.
If we're willing to pay, the fact that Rodriguez is on a supreme hot seat won't prevent making a good hire.
flip of the coin is that all we really need is an average defense and we're top 25, and competing for a big ten title. So it's not that bad of a situtation, we're just missing a big piece that a good D coordinator could bring.
Maybe he'll bring Woodley with him....
Trgovac would be an excellent choice. His name was on the list of candidates to replace LC before RR accepted the job. The only person I can think of who would be a better choice would be Charlie Strong and that just ain't gonna happen. My only concern with Trgovac is how long it will take him to get fully up to speed in recruiting. He has been in the NFL for the past 15 years and probably has few if any strong relationships left with high school coaches. His resume is perfect though and he is a very solid guy. Note to Dave Brandon: Trgovac will be expensive.
As for Casteel, I doubt it. Something prevented him from coming with RR initially. It simply might have been that he thought he had a real shot at the WVU head coaching job. Word is he was offered the DC position at FSU under Jimbo Fisher but turned that down last year, so something is keeping him at WVU. As Stew's seat gets hotter (and it is warming up fast), Casteel gets closer to a second shot at the top job at WVU. Why leave now to come to UM and take the DC job you were offered three years ago but turned down, especially when it looks like the head coaching position at WVU might be opening up again soon? My guess is he rides out the WVU situation a year or two longer (or at least until it becomes clear he will not get that job) before going anywhere else.
My recollection of the reason Casteel stayed at WVU when RR asked him to come to Ann Arbor with him was that he didn't want to move his family; kids in school and all.
But unless his kids are now out of school, he will face the same decision. Not sure why he would move his kids now if he wouldn't three years ago.
Because if he's not hired as the new HC at WVU or stays on in some other capacity, he'll be able to stay in Morgantown, but he'll be out of a job.
But, maybe he really didn't come because he didn't want to be stuck with those same defensive assistants he had at WVU. Just speculating, but it's plausible.
is the only established DC that fits. No experienced DC is going to come when he will be pigeonholed with running this scheme, and using these assistants. Another possibility is that Brandon tells RR to blow the defense up and clean house. That he is to hire a good DC, and let him bring in his own people.
If Casteel were available, I think he would come. He would be working with people that he knows, fixing a scheme that he understands, and it will also be a regular paycheck. If he succeeds, it will become more then just a one year job.
Experience as Defensive Coordinator, Defensive Backfield Coach, D1 Head Coach, and recruiter. Was at UMass previously.
TCU consistently fields great defenses and he's been their DC for the last several years (yes, I know some of it is due to having Patterson as their HC). Going from TCU to UM would be a promotion.
"The Bumpas Hounds"
or second time RR needed him because of stability concerns, there's no way he's coming now.
And since the non-Casteel DC would be hamstrung with the 3-3-5 and position staff that aren't his, I can't imagine anyone decent wanting the job.
Whoever the next HC is, he'd better have a solid DC lined up before he even talks to Michigan.
Casteel didn't come the first time because he had the option to keep his family put in Morgantown since he had a job there. The "second time," he still had a job, so why would he leave. If Bill Stewart gets the can, his option to stay in Morgantown may be nonexistant.
I like the Casteel idea. Let's raise a ton of money to get Casteel to come here, and if he doesn't, raise some more and just get Harbaugh. I was as big an RR supporter as there was, but I thought we'd be better by now, and Harbaugh is looking really good.
And for as much as I love the spread (and I do), it wouldn't be bad to see Michigan Football again.
Give me any reason except pride that JH would leave a world class university in a warm climate where he is worshipped to come sit on this hotseat ? Makes no sense now that Stanford is doing so well. Keep RR, change the DC.
1. The total lack of institutional support at Stanford for football. There's support for football in the Stanford AD, but in the university at large it's seen at best as a distraction annd more broadly as detrimental to the university's core mission (I'm speaking about faculty and university administrators). It's highly unlikely that Stanford's administration would support any increase in spending on Harbaugh's salary or football in general. The university is in fairly dire financial straits for an elite private institution, to the point that their graduate admissions have been frozen for the past few years in many departments. A dramatic increase in Harbaugh's salary would risk a fairly significant faculty revolt, and at Stanford, the faculty's voice in university governance is actually quite strong.
2. Also, with Stanford being shuttled into the Pac-12 North, the football program became more peripheral on the national media landscape.
as DB is going to force any change (for yet another year in a row) on us. It's terrible in business and it's terrible in coaching (for many reasons listed throughout above).
I think he will appreciate the personnel struggles (from a player standpoint) we've been through and value continuity over grasping at greener grass once again.
If there is change mandated, the ONLY way to go is clean house on the D side. I am in full agreement with those above that state we cannot continue to "shoehorn" an outside DC into a job where the assistants (his underlings) have the rule of the roost, to the point of outliving multiple bosses. This would be unheard of in again, both the business and football worlds.
Bringing Casteel into the fold seems like a possible fix, but if it comes with keeping everyone else, I still think it's a mistake. If we can argue that the D is SO BAD that we need a thrid D Coordinator, we HAVE to place some accountability on the position guys as well. They don't get off for free, just because their boss kept them from succeeding. (That has obviously NOT been the case, if anything, the opposite is true.)
What do you mean? I don't get how DB forcing RRod(his subordinate) to change would be anything other than shrewd. On the contrary, I think it would be prudent to step in. It's not like this would be a hasty move. It's painfully obvious that there are a variety of factors which are causing the demise of the defense. IF the defense was better than last year, or making progress toward that end, this would be a non-issue. The fact that GERG has been here for two consecutive years coupled with the fact that even the experienced members of our defense look lost or are schematically ineffectual(save Martin) leads me to one conclusion: We must change the only thing we can change. And since we can't impart ability into our current players, the only option would be to get someone in here to maximize hteir abilities. I understand that this coaching staff is trying, and has been trying, to do this for almost 2 seasons, but I think the proof is in the pudding that they are incapable of doing so. David Brandon is a good business man, and the shrewd move would be to force the issue.
And the "continuity" argument is pretty worthless when the D is quite possibly the worst in BCS-conference football.
What happened to Chuck Martin? His name was kicked around for the ND DC spot.
He's the DB's coach and recruiting coordinator at ND. He's quite unlikely to leave his buddy Brian Kelly to come here.
is #4 in the country... GERG's defense is not. If you are under the delusion that GERG's defense will be #4 or better overall in his 3rd year, I am sad to say you're wrong. I understand this is under the assumption that RR is solely responsible for the offense and GERG solely for the defense.
Sure RR deserves blame for hiring GERG, but I think most people see that we do have 1/2 of a BCS quality team (special teams aside). If we give up RR then we start from scratch. If we give up GERG at this point what do we lose? Absolutely nothing. So the question is do we trust RR to have another go at finding a DC or just cut our losses now? Wouldn't want to be Dave Brandon.
How many recruits do we really have in common with Stanford right now?
Bring in a reasonable kicker and we'll be fine at special teams. Sure I buy that we are young and inexperienced, it's painfully obvious. But I don't think it has to translate in one of the very worst defenses in all of college football. Bottom of the B10 and below national average I could swallow but not this.
I also agree you can't keep RR soley on the basis of preventing another coaching transition, but likewise firing RR without considering if we can get a better replacement makes little sense. I still think firing GERG we lose nothing, firing RR we do lose something.
We obviously need a new kicker, but the return game has also been really poor.
Special teams is more like 1/6 of a team (at least if you believe Football Outsiders), and the punting part of our special teams has become pretty solid, Hagerup is the real deal. Returns are marginal, and the field goal kicking is obviously terrible. But I'm not really sure what the hell the coaches can do about that outside of finding another kicker in recruiting.
Returns aren't marginal - we're near the very bottom of the country in both punt and kick returns.
fire all you want it will do no good. We need the young guys to get experience and RR to keep recruiting quality players for D. Think about this, if we had an average defense we would be undeafeated!
The infusion of Kipling quotes alone could get us into the middle of the pack in the Big 10.
lets face it, the man knows the personnel, has personally analyzed every snap of the last few years. He will create much cooler terminology and he can tap into us when he needs schematic assistance.
Why is it that we would want RichRod to hire a defensive coordinator who has experience in the 3-3-5? Why wouldn't our ideal be that RichRod move to a 4-3, taking a DB off the field and installing a smashmouth defense with a coordinator who can run a smashmouth defense? Can we talk about taking up a collection for that?
Sorry, but Jeff Casteel isn't going to come in and magically turn our current defensive backfield into the days of Charles, Marlin, and Leon. He did run the 3-3-5 successfully at times with RichRod, but in 2006 WVU had the 109th ranked pass defense in the country.
He's not a miracle worker. We need a schematic change as well as a coaching change on the defensive side of the ball, that much is very clear. I'm not even saying the 3-3-5 is inherently bad, I just think it's inherently bad in a system where you have a disgraced former head coach with little to no experience with the 3-3-5 pulling the strings on a defense that is woefully untalented in the defensive backfield.
Is there a possibility that Rodriguez resigns? I don't ask because I want that but merely because I am curious. Also, I want him to stay, fwiw.
the complete opposite of whomever RRod wants (unless it is Casteel) as he has shown absolutely zero competency in his defensive hiring decisions.
look at Nick Holt @ washington. Great at USC.. At washington not so much..There are Dc's that can coach good players into great players..there are DC's that can coach up players into good players. we need the latter.
The best viable option is to keep RR and his powerful offense and fire most of the Defensive personnel. GERG had just made this defense worse.
if Rrod leaves the O will no doubt be worse. The d may be better but I think it's a wash.
who can stay awake during Monday team meetings following a loss hanging over his head
You're joking, right?
you should hear about it tomorrow bc it was right in front of the team.
they must be a glutton for punishment...
My thought was to have DB step up and make a statement. If I were DB I'd put together a small commity and go find the biggest whale dc money can buy. I'd tell this dc that he can hire in who ever he wants and will have full control of the defense and will get 3 year deal reguardless of what happens with RR. I would then turn to RR and say I'm going to sign you for another two years on the basis that you have minimal input into the defense.
With the idea you keep the sweet offense and make for a stable head coach situtation. You give the d the best chance at turning things around and you get the dc out from under RRs thumb.
I am reluctant to believe that changing just defensive coordinators will magically transform underclassmen athletes into a honed defensive squad. There are some fundamental issues:
1) Many people blame it entirely on GERG, because lack of leadership, which may partially true, but if anything he may be just too fancy for his subordinate coaches and underclassmen players.
2) GERG never had a chance to pick his own defensive coaches, and most of them came with Rich Rodriguez from WVU. There seems to be constant lack of development in the defensive squad. If anything, they seem to cobble together some fundamentals, and try to throw together a squad for games that seem to lack any cohesion or confidence. Hence, the defense fails to wrap up tackles in space, and cannot provide tight coverage in either man-to-man or zone configurations.
3) Progress will first begin with developing the younger players against the offenses they will see, not Rodriguez's spread offense. The Rodriguez spread offense perhaps has been Michigan's worst enemy for developing a good defense, because it is so variable and explosive. Defenders can't get any confidence or sense of achievement. At best, the defenders just try to avoid screwing up badly.
As a result, if GERG leaves or does not leave, it is time for many of the defensive and Special teams coaches, who came from WVU, to leave. I would talk to Ron English at EMU, and see if he would be interested in a trial at DC, and who he would like to bring with him in terms of coaching staff. His record at EMU has not been great, but he was effective while he was at Michigan. More importantly, he would bring a fresh squad of defensive coaches. I am afraid the WVU-bred D-coaches are not developing the fundamentals in the young players, and allow too many bad habits to fester, e.g. the wandering Obi Ezeh. This Michigan defensive squad had some confidence earlier in this season, but crumbles too easily, not to mention injuries.
Whoever leads the defensive coaches must be a good recruiter, and can be respected by Rich Rod to lead the defensive squad. We will lose a few seniors, but there is still a lot of defensive recruiting needed. Now that we are out form under the spectre of the NCAA investigation, and assuming Brandon does not release Rodriguez at the end of this year, we will need at least two years to build a solid defense, but anything would be an improvement over the last two years.
Perhaps, Rich Rod should consider an offensive scout team that is specifically coached to research opposing team offenses and train the defense against them, instead of trying to run down Denard or Tate. It will let build confidence and focus them on what will matter on Saturdays, instead of being cannon fodder for our offense.
Release the special teams coach - they just have not developed the placekickers or return specialists. Both groups are walking on eggshells, hoping they will not screw up, instead of focusing on nailing the next challenge. Avoid tantrums and give the team a set of progressive goals and challenges that will bring them up to a respectable level. Give me placekicker, who can hit 80-90% at up to 40-45 yards, and it changes the equation on offense. Touchdowns are great, but field goals after grinding out 6-8 minutes of a drive extend leads and maintain momentum. Along with the spread, a good offense and scoring will help our defense.
I am reluctant to feel that Jim Harbaugh will solve all our problems on defense overnight, rather it may delay development, if there too many departures during a transition.
Do you remember the first game of 2007? Or perhaps that stretch of years where we were perpetually unable to respond to modern offense schemes that did anything other than keep their QB on a leash in the pocket? I spent enough time as a student praying for a replacement for Ron English that I find a suggestion of his return personally offensive.