QB Injuries in the Harbaugh Tenure
Came to mind on the drive home from Thanksgiving. Harbaugh's tenure has been absolutely snakebitten when it comes to QB injuries. Meanwhile, I'm not making excuses - OSU won a natty with a third-string QB.
2015 - Rudock: knocked out against Minn but otherwise okay.
2016 - Speight: suffered a broken collarbone against Iowa that probably cost UM a B1G title and Playoff appearance.
2017 - Speight: back injury against Purdue (leading to O'Korn false hope game and later BPONE). Peters: suffered a concussion against Wiscy.
2018 - Patterson: surprisingly healthy. McCaffery: Broken collarbone against PSU.
2019 - Patterson 2.0: suffered golfer's elbow in the summer leading up to preseason, which may have prevented him from making QB run reads s/. Suffered oblique injury early in the season. McCaffery: suffered a concussion from a hit against Wiscy (pattern?) that sidelined him for a large portion of the season.
2020 - Milton: mystery injury. McNamara: shoulder injury against PSU.
Looking at the list, it seems as though the program rises and falls with the health of the starting QB (2015 was a hopeful time, pre-Iowa 2016 was electric, pre-OSU 2018 was also a mostly happy adventure and that debacle was not about QB health). Again, the obvious critique is that we need a deeper QB room.
December 1st, 2020 at 8:10 PM ^
As I mentioned in the McCaffrey diary post ... his collar bone break was really due to his own poor judgment: on a QB run he decided to lower his shoulder and pop a defensive back. He should never have done that, and I doubt very much Harbaugh or whoever the QB coach was at the time recommended QBs do that.
December 1st, 2020 at 8:54 PM ^
True. But whatever Harbaugh is “recommending” his QB’s to do isn’t working either.
December 1st, 2020 at 9:03 PM ^
Agree ... but with respect to that particular injury, I think trying to pin that on Harbaugh isn't quite fair.
If memory serves, didn't McCaffrey also hurdle someone moving in for a tackle? That's another risky move -- if he doesn't clear the defender, he could go head over heels and land who-knows-how-badly. In other words, I think McCaffrey -- bless his heart, as they say in the south -- has an aggressive attitude when he's running the ball. He's a hell of a runner, but as QB he has to be a bit more careful.
December 2nd, 2020 at 9:06 AM ^
Gotta keep up with big brother in the NFL
December 1st, 2020 at 9:36 PM ^
Yeah, but notice how often commentators gush about tough a QB is when running into a defender.
December 1st, 2020 at 9:37 PM ^
Do you remember Conner Cook absolutely trucking Delano Hill and setting the tone for toughness? Some QBs are football players and know how to protect themselves. It’s starts with be able to either deliver a blow or make a guy miss and when to do so. QBs that turtle before contact get hurt.
December 2nd, 2020 at 1:09 PM ^
Or maybe the high rate of injuries on our QBs is absolutely terrible coaching. Not teaching proper sliding techniques, how to fall, how to absorb a hit, knowing when to run out of bounds, etc. Harbaugh frequently puts his QBs in a terrible position where they have to make something happen instead of teaching them sometimes you have to go down and live to fight another day. As the poster above pointed out, ALL of these injuries occurred while being hit, none were freakish ACLs or other non contact injuries. We are seeing a pattern, not bad luck. It just so happens this pattern is one of many under this regime.
December 1st, 2020 at 8:12 PM ^
Golfers elbow?
December 1st, 2020 at 8:28 PM ^
It is a real thing. But believe this is just a sarcastic way of saying Shea wasn't dedicated as evidenced by the much referenced comment about golf.
December 2nd, 2020 at 9:51 AM ^
I caught it as soon as I read it. Outstanding description of Shea injury.
December 2nd, 2020 at 1:02 PM ^
I'm glad at least someone got the joke
December 1st, 2020 at 8:17 PM ^
I would like to say that this is because of some really unfortunate luck, and perhaps some of it is, but the other part of this is horrendous oline play where your qb is running for his life or getting drilled most of the time.
December 2nd, 2020 at 12:20 AM ^
True, but that hasn't been the issue since Warinner arrived. Shea stayed healthy in 2018, then got injured on a successful scramble in 2019 on the first play of the season. Cade was also hurt on what looked like the arc read RPO we like to run sometimes.
December 2nd, 2020 at 11:49 AM ^
Also, it's not just the QBs, Michigan is going on a decade+ without having a running back worth a damn to take the load off their QB, or any sort of receiving threats. And Michigan just had 4/5 players from the OL drafted -- the OL has been the one good spot on the offense (except this season).
The real problem is they haven't had a single player on offense that any defense has had to truly worry about since maybe Jake Butt.
Everyone always wants to point to the QB as the problem, but if you're constantly putting Purdue/Indiana/Northwestern level skill players around your QB you shouldn't be surprised when you get Purdue/Indiana/Northwestern level results.
December 2nd, 2020 at 12:24 PM ^
Ok if we have a good OL then why can't the QB sit back there and make multiple reads on a play. No way is everyone covered on every single play. College defensive backs are not good enough to cover every receiver on every play.
December 2nd, 2020 at 1:02 PM ^
Again...4 out of 5 went to the NFL. Trying to pretend the OL has been an issue the last few years is just stupid. It's clearly an issue this year, but it sure as hell wasn't last season or the year before.
Overall, it's a combination of a bunch of things. The WRs we have aren't good and poorly coached and can't get open -- even against college DBs. We saw that a bunch last year -- there's a reason someone with all the physical attributes DPJ has was a 6th round pick.
When they are open, the QBs aren't very accurate and have trouble hitting their targets. And because there's never any sort of threats in the backfield for defenses to worry about, they can funnel more coverage to the secondary and cheat the defense to their advantage.
Also, QBs that can just sit back in the pocket and make a bunch of reads are pretty damn rare in CFB. Good offenses know that and tailor things to create easy reads and simple to execute plays to cheat things to their advantage. Michigan doesn't do that.
December 2nd, 2020 at 1:10 PM ^
I'm not sure about your point r.e. a lack of playmakers. I recall a number of deep balls to DPJ/Nico that were missed. I think defenses should have had to worry about our Wrs (specifically Nico) but the lack of quality QB play and the schematic lack of emphasis for #4 seemed to hamstring his production/threat level.
I don't think RB is a problem either. It might not be the best position group out there but the RB production under Harbaugh has always seemed, to me at least, to be a positive. The lack of RB production seems to be largely schematic (i.e. not using players like Evans as a receiving threat and constantly rotating backs).
December 2nd, 2020 at 1:17 PM ^
I don’t know how you can look at our rosters during the Harbaugh tenure and say we don’t have good enough guys. Their coaching has obviously been terrible as evidenced by years of UFRs.
December 1st, 2020 at 8:18 PM ^
Rudock got knocked out of the Ohio State game with what I think was a shoulder injury.
December 1st, 2020 at 10:39 PM ^
Correct. Minnesota was a 1 game head injury
December 1st, 2020 at 8:21 PM ^
That Iowa game fucking hurt...
December 1st, 2020 at 9:00 PM ^
Good news is he’s had multiple disappointments since then so it hurts a lot less now.
December 1st, 2020 at 9:14 PM ^
I was there. It was even worse in person.
December 2nd, 2020 at 11:09 AM ^
I was there with my son, not a sole in that stadium believed Iowa had a chance. Very cool fanbase.
It was all there if we had won that game, O line was abysmal, especially on the safety.
December 1st, 2020 at 8:30 PM ^
OSU gets QB injuries all the time too. But, guess he won their only NC for them? Cardale "I ain't come to play school" backup QB Jones. Did you see when Haskins replaced Barrett off the bench in 2016? Our backups should be able to play. They are not.
December 1st, 2020 at 8:47 PM ^
This right here. When one of our best players gets hurt, it’s a panicked scramble to find someone to try and fill in...when OSU has an injury, the next guy up is prepared and ready to play, regardless of whether they’re a freshman or third string.
At some point, we’ve got to stop whining about injuries and start questioning why none of our backups are ever ready to go.
December 1st, 2020 at 10:18 PM ^
In defense of our backups, the starters aren’t necessarily ready to go, either.
December 1st, 2020 at 11:31 PM ^
Hahaha touché
December 2nd, 2020 at 7:35 AM ^
I wonder if as a fan I am always in panic mode with every thing that goes wrong with the Wolverines while it seems that OSU has more calm and confidence throughout the game (fewer penalties (refs aside) and backups performing) than Michigan. It appears that OSU is better coached with respect to adversity. That is what bothers me most about all this. The lifetime skills.
Of course, playing with the refs on your side and the lead doesn't hurt.
December 2nd, 2020 at 10:16 AM ^
It helps that their backups are 5* recruits.
December 1st, 2020 at 10:17 PM ^
And in 2015 they had Cardale Jones, JT Barrett, Braxton Miller (who switched to WR) and Joe Burrow sitting on the bench.
December 1st, 2020 at 11:18 PM ^
It’s almost as if recruiting matters.
December 1st, 2020 at 10:31 PM ^
i agree with this!!!!! i was telling my dad and friends about how amazing suckeyes prepare their quarterbacks to be ready no matter what and meeeechigan needs to prepare every single dang quarterbacks for every game... no matter what!! man!
anyways, GO BLUE!
December 1st, 2020 at 8:32 PM ^
Deeper QB room? How about an offense that blocks consistently well enough to keep QBs healthy? Or plays that rarely put QBs in harm's way? Without both of these, it doesn't matter how deep the QB room is.
December 2nd, 2020 at 9:30 AM ^
You're not wrong but it doesn't really apply to the above as presented by the OP.
With the need to have a QB who runs occasionally in modern college football (unless you're Bama, who also got Tua hurt), QBs will take some hits. The OL had nothing to do with either injury to McCaffrey or the one to McNamara.
December 1st, 2020 at 8:38 PM ^
Conspiracy theory? We've had enough of those in 2020.
Shit happens...next man up (if you have one and they are prepared).
December 1st, 2020 at 8:39 PM ^
They attained 5 yds in the 4th in 2016. QB or not that was what cost a trip to indy that year.
December 1st, 2020 at 8:40 PM ^
Next man up mentality. Expectation is for the position. Tired of excuses, time to jettison JH !!
December 1st, 2020 at 8:51 PM ^
Milton?
December 1st, 2020 at 9:22 PM ^
No clean house if that is your choice
December 1st, 2020 at 9:36 PM ^
Deeper and better QB room yes.
The transfer portal is way more reliable than recruiting an unproven high school kid.
Evidence Fields for OSU, Burrow for LSU and even Ramsey for Northwestern. Our best QBs by far - Rudock and Patterson - both transfers.
December 1st, 2020 at 9:48 PM ^
I might have said that the first few years while you recruit and coach up talented high school kids. By now, Peters, McCaffrey, Milton or McNamara should have panned out.
December 1st, 2020 at 10:11 PM ^
Many of the best top 10 teams have transfer QBs. Likely to be the future of college football.
Edit - we need to access the transfer market at every position of need. Especially QB. This is The future of college football. Look at Rutgers improvement purely from the transfer portal.
December 1st, 2020 at 9:48 PM ^
If you don’t have a running QB, running your QB is dangerous. Not just because they aren’t fast enough, but because if they aren’t natural rilinnee a they don’t know how to take hits.
December 1st, 2020 at 9:51 PM ^
Requisite -1 for "natty."
December 2nd, 2020 at 9:10 AM ^
Unless of course you're ordering a Natural Light.... in which case, -2
December 1st, 2020 at 10:42 PM ^
Gutierrez, Henne, Denard, Gardner, it's been a thing for a while.
December 1st, 2020 at 10:58 PM ^
People like to point to The 2016 choke at Iowa or the 2016 robbery in the shoe as the inflection point for Harbaugh’s tenure’s downward trend.
The truly fateful day was against UW when our NFL tackle Grant Newsome was injured (and nearly lost his leg) in a low hit dirty play by the Wisconsin DB.
Healthy Newsome probably leaves us with a healthy Speight and playoff birth. Would the success have sustained?... no idea. But the trajectory since that injury has been downhill and we’ve never been able to roster manage and recruit the depth needed to overcome such events.
December 2nd, 2020 at 9:32 AM ^
Agreed on all counts.