OT - First Gen/Low-Income Student Experience

Submitted by AeonBlue on

I never attended Michigan, or any college for that matter. School was never my thing so I joined the Air Force shortly after graduating high school (I worked an IT contract on campus for 6-months prior to that) because they would let me do what I wanted to do (computer programming) without having to go into a bunch of debt taking classes I wasn't interested in. 

A friend of mine that graduated from U of M a few years back just posted this link and captioned

"Speaks so much of my undergrad experience at UofM! Not enough done to welcome those with low income"

I feel like it's an important read, especially for current students. I have no experience to base it on but I feel like maybe this should be more of an idictment on students and student leadership than the institution itself. 

Where I work we get a bunch of people from all different walks of life. We have the 3rd generation military people, we have the rich kids, we have the poor kids, we have the "I would have probably been on drugs or dead if I didn't get out" people. We have people who can barely speak english because they're first generation Americans. We're led by officers who are college grads from places like Duke as well as places like Eastern Pennsylvania State College University of California Technical Institute. We're led by officers who are academy grads.

My point is this: no two people I've come across in the military have the same back-story but we have to pull together and find common ground to make the mission happen. It may not be apparent but you can find it with even the most seemingly disparate people. If you're the 3rd gen Michigan student and you find yourself in this situation, it doesn't mean you have to act like their parents just died when they say their parents are home-makers or bus drivers or whatever. Chances are they're proud of being the first person in their family to overcome the odds and make it there. And if you're the first-gen/low-income college student it doesn't mean that your peers (yes, your peers) think you're sub-human. Chances are that they're pretty afraid of offending you and that's why they're looking at you like your hair is on fire. 

Too often we focus on what makes us different (race, orientation, income, political preference, religion, etc.) that we lose sight of what makes us similar. It's a bitch out there in the world as it is. It's not too far out of the way to make others feel like they're a part of something bigger than themselves regardless of how different from you they might seem.

Also, Harbaugh. That is all.

notYOURmom

January 29th, 2015 at 10:29 PM ^

This is a pet issue of mind as I came from regular folks and went to a school full of posh people. And that was back when posh was 6200 a year not 62000.



I never went home except Xmas and summer because it wasn't in the budget, and I worked in the dining hall during the year, full time on the school grounds crew through vacation breaks.



If anyone knows of any efforts on campus to make life easier for the regular folks I would love to help

diag squirrel

January 29th, 2015 at 11:52 PM ^

I have rich to working class family members. I've noticed the working class kids, even if their grades are strong, are SO sheltered, closeminded and intolerant. They have an aversion to culture, good food, music, etc. Even things that are free or cheap, like going to a local museum are never done. I take my non-wealthy nephews out to dinner and they want chicken nuggets and mac & cheese, REFUSE to eat anything they've never had before. I take another set of nieces and nephews out and they want sushi and cappuccinos, or want to try something new and interesting. The working class kids use the word f*g like it's going out of style, they despise rich kids their age, refuse to try new things, it's just an overall ignorance that startles me. They have chips of their shoulder that come across as hyper-negative and bitter. It's certainly no way to make friends at college.

We can stereotype wealthy offspring as brats or living in a bubble, but in my experience wealthy kids are exposed to FAR more culture and far more open minded and progressive. Further, wealthier kids are far more altruistic. My poorer family thinks volunteering is a waste of time. My wealthy side from 5 y.o. to grandparents treat volunteering like a job.

FieldingBLUE

January 30th, 2015 at 12:06 AM ^

This has some incredible insight.

1. Rich kids who are exposed to more culture seem to be open about it.

2. Poor people don't want to volunteer.

3. Poor kids only like nuggets and mac & cheese.

4. Poor kids are ignorant and bitter.

5. Poor kids are intolerant and closeminded.

 

Got it! Thanks for sharing!

moredamnsound

January 30th, 2015 at 12:37 AM ^

"We can stereotype wealthy offspring as brats..."

"...the working class kids are... closeminded and intolerant."

Apparently you can also stereotype all low income people by sampling only your non-wealthy nephews as well. They probably don't want to try new things because that hasn't been an option for them. Part of having less money is having less options. If they are bitter about anything, it's probably because they know that there are a lot of nice things that they can't have. And the type of attitude that you displayed in this post is probably why they resent rich kids. You look down on them.

I'm not saying that all low-income people are amazing people always, but come on. My parents are outliers in their families. They worked hard and earned more money, and we're not rich by any means. But that doesn't mean that the rest of my family is composed of a bunch of uneducated, homophobic, shit people. They're fucking great, but don't worry about that because they aren't the type of people you'd want to hang with anyway.

Good day.

 

SeattleWolverine

January 30th, 2015 at 1:03 AM ^

There's a lot in your post that I disagree with, but I'll just pick one thing:

Further, wealthier kids are far more altruistic. My poorer family thinks volunteering is a waste of time.

http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/psp/99/5/771/

http://philanthropy.com/article/America-s-Generosity-Divide/133775/

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/22/magazine/22FOB-wwln-t.html?_r=0

For kicks: http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Psychology-studies-suggest-rising…

But whatever.

/class warfare

UNCWolverine

January 30th, 2015 at 1:30 AM ^

GDamn was that a horrid read. I honestly thought it was an attempt at sarcasm initially. I'm from a middle class/working class family and I've volunteered most of my adult life. Just got home from taking my mentee to the Lakers game in fact.

I honestly hope for your sake that you begin to experience things that will change your opinion on these topics. You'll be a better person for it.

mgobleu

January 30th, 2015 at 7:09 AM ^

tale of woe here is singlehandedly one of the most arrogant, ignorant, vacuous, empty headed pieces of garbage I have ever read. If you went to Michigan, you are exactly what the fuck is WRONG with Michigan. You may in fact be exactly what is wrong with this entire country and I'd like you to choose another one to defile with your rants.

Oh, and your username is just a fancy way of saying "Whore", which seems appropriate.

diag squirrel

January 30th, 2015 at 8:59 AM ^

To be clear, I'm not blaming working or lower middle class kids for who they are, they're OBVIOUSLY products of their ethos. I love my half of the family who is lower means. I'm just explaining to you all what I've seen occur dozens of times, I've read countless books on the topic, and how it’s a substantial obstacle in making friends that aren’t like you. Further, I believe these first-gen clubs and even the Comprehensive Studies Program tend to do more harm than good, as they further insulate first-gen students. Another overlooked factor is that many of these first-gen students struggle to compete in the most competitive majors, which tend to have to most optimistic career trajectories. For example, who’s more like to be happy on campus? The confident Computer Science student with $10K summer internship offers, or the Sociology or Sports Management major with a 2.9 GPA? And don’t overlook certain departments and professors stoking the “opportunity gap” (read: class warfare) flames during their lectures. I’ve seen fresh minds get radicalized by the end of sophomore year.

Sorry if my posts lack the PC grace you desire. I’m not auditioning for an MSNBC job. This is a topic I care deeply about as I have family who face these challenges everyday.

Wisconsin Wolverine

January 30th, 2015 at 9:37 AM ^

Yeah well I have my own set of life experiences on this matter and they don't match up with yours at all, so why should I put any stock into your anecdotes?  I'm happy to believe you if you make an argument based on scientific study, but your own personal observations and speculation mean nothing.



EDIT: I guess they don't mean "nothing", but they certainly aren't the authoritative bottom line that you're laying them out to be.

Everyone Murders

January 30th, 2015 at 9:54 AM ^

When you write bilge like "they're OBVIOUSLY products of their ethos" you (in addition to begging the question - petitio principii style) still paint an entire economic class with a single broad brush.  That has nothing to do with a lack of PC grace.  It has to do with a stunning combination of ignorance and arrogance.

oriental andrew

January 30th, 2015 at 11:34 AM ^

It's not that your posts lack political correctness. I don't care much for political correctness. In fact, your posts and worldview demonstrate a stunning amount of defensiveness. There is a tool which is widely used in the world if diversity & inclusion called the Intercultural Development Inventory, and it basically identifies a continuum on which you are placed based on your worldview. Based on what I've witnessed here, you would very easily be placed in the "Polarization - Defense" category

A strong commitment to one’s own thoughts and feelings about culture and cultural difference. Aware of other cultures around you, but with a relatively incomplete understanding of them and probably fairly strong negative feelings or stereotypes about some of them. This may lead to some distrust of, and a tendency to be judgmental about, cultural behavior or ideas that differ from one’s own.

Denial and Polarization are considered “ethnocentric” or monocultural in that one’s own culture is seen as the only culture or to varying extents the “better” culture.

You're not a bad person, but seem to have a very limited worldview. 

pescadero

January 30th, 2015 at 11:34 AM ^

Another overlooked factor is that many of these first-gen students struggle to compete in the most competitive majors, which tend to have to most optimistic career trajectories.

 

As someone who attended the university (Computer Engineering) and works in the engineering college... I don't see that.

 

First-gen students are much more likely to go into more "trade" oriented degree programs (like engineering) - and much less likely to get Sociology/English Literature/Womens Studies/Archaeology type degree.

 

notYOURmom

January 30th, 2015 at 2:45 PM ^

But you do lack the facts.  A wealthy kid can afford to screw around in a major where a bootstrap kid cannot.  You won't find so many art history majors with mechanics dads, but if your folks can pop for grad school someplace maybe you can swing art history.

And really  what is meant by a "competitive" major - have you got anything other than your own prejudices to show that working class kids are not working as hard as you?

And you think sociology is easy? Not if you do it right.

Toad

January 29th, 2015 at 10:37 PM ^

Huh? I'm a little confused about what your message here is.  It's not like people walk around with a sign displaying their financial status.

Wolv1984

January 29th, 2015 at 11:04 PM ^

I would direct you to the book 'Paying for the Party' by Dr Elizabeth Armstrong, who also happens to be a tenured professor at Michigan.

In summary it shows that the first gens and lower income leave large schools such as IU or Michigan with social networks that are weaker. You can tell the wealth of someone by the clothes they wear, the car they drive, the fact they can put up a 150 dollar tab at the bar every Fridaly, etc. While people are not so gauche as to check your bank account at the door to a paty, you will also fail to make it into certain circles if you cannot display certain markers of wealth and status.

With that you being the typical result. Some will overachieve just as others underachieve.

My name ... is Tim

January 29th, 2015 at 11:12 PM ^

True, though how is thats problem at Michigan? That is true across American (and most other) society. If anything, I'd honestly presume that Michigan is less focused on this issue and showy about status/wealth than other colleges (the Harvards, Hobarts, etc. in the Northeast are MUCH more focused on that).

Wolv1984

January 29th, 2015 at 11:22 PM ^

Actually less at Harvard. When you first arrive the divide is clear. Because Harvard is more success at encouraging networking via societies, dining clubs, and also provides large stipends to low income students so they can participate, come graduation fewer members of the senior class have weak ties.

Thus their graduates place well (this being one of multiple factors) and the institution's rank benefits from it.

Plus it reduces drop outs which harms the rank.

diag squirrel

January 29th, 2015 at 11:40 PM ^

I tutored low-middle class minority students, and some went on to Harvard and Harvard caliber schools. Honestly, 10 maybe even 11 of 12 squandered the opportunity. The opportunity was there, they weren't groomed to realize it or strike. To be able to recognize the opportunity ethos you're steeping in and take advantage of everything around you takes a lifetime of grooming. Prep school kids have been groomed for 13+ years. A "regular" kid can't learn the intangibles in a summer, or get up to speed once at college. The rich gunners hit the ground running, they're not slowing down so the middle class kids can catch up.

Prince Lover

January 30th, 2015 at 1:15 AM ^

Harvard and Harvard caliber schools? 10 maybe 11 out of 12 blew it?
Where are you working where you have sent 12 low income kids to Ivy league schools? I didn't know anybody in my whole home town who went to any Ivy league school. And you've tutored 12?
Either you are pushing some agenda or you must tutor with an enthusiasm unknown to mankind!

canzior

January 30th, 2015 at 11:00 AM ^

There are certain things that are inherent, for example higher income genereally equals college graduates.  Staistically you are more likely to go/complete college if your parents are college graduates.  

There are other reasons for this.  Low income areas have poorly funded educational systems, so it can be difficult to overcome, while learning good test-taking and study skills.  "Poor" schools in Washington DC, or Detroit...are different than "poor" schools in suburbia. There isn't a culture of success.  It's the same as a football team, part of succeeding and exceling is shedding the culture of failure.  

I can see how there could be some resentment for college kids who are going to school with rich kids.  At University of Richmond, the student parking ot has better cars than the faculty lot.  It CAN (not necessarily does) cause a divide.  If you have to work to have extra money while in school, or work during the breaks, you don't have the same experiences as those who don't have to. And people tend to gravitate towards those who share their experiences.

notYOURmom

February 5th, 2015 at 1:10 PM ^

Let me tell you what it takes for a kid to get involved in, say, robotics, in local suburban schools: you show up to the robotics club meeting at lunch or after school.  Done.

Let me tell you what it takes for one kid to get involved in robotics in Detroit:  every Saturday he has to get on one bus to downtown, then another to Midtown, where the only robotics team in town operates.  This is the DETROIT bus system we are talking about.  Then he has to make the return trip.  He has to do this around any opportunity for employment, homework time, the needs of his family, etc.

Or what about this kid:  she's in foster care, has been in three different schools in five years, has got herself a job and gets herself there and back every week, college counsellor literally once in ten years sent a kid past community college, has 500 kids on her roster, and has no earthly idea what the Common App even IS?  

How can we attribute this to "no culture of success? rather than NO RESOURCES FOR SUCCESS.  You're right that the system are poorly funded, but how we can attribute this to having, well, the wrong "culture", I dunno man that seems pretty mean.  I don't think you meant it that way but it does.

PS These kids are real not theoretical - the first one got admitted to Harvard but chose Stanford.  The second one is applying to schools this year.

diag squirrel

January 29th, 2015 at 11:32 PM ^

Correct. No real need to explain what your parents do. Obvious high-SES markers in 2015: 

- Wear a Canada Goose winter coat ($850)

- Belong to a social frat or sorority (especially top or near top tier house) 

- Be a non-resident paying $55K per year

- Don't have a part time campus job

- Facebook, tweet, instagram, snapchat photos of your Euro AND/or Caribbean winter break trip

That said, maybe no fault of their own, first-gen kids are extremely close minded. Most of them assume rich kids despise them, refuse to try new things, blow innocuous things out of proportion (e.g. "micro-aggressions"), don't even make serious attempts to make "rich" friends.

HouseThatYostBuilt

January 30th, 2015 at 12:23 AM ^

This frat kids = rich meme needs to die. Destructive, inconsiderate, binge-drinkers? Yes, sometimes.

But these days, fraternities are generally way cheaper to live in than any other form of housing. Why is that? Because costs are greatly subsidized by wealthy alums. There are tons of low income kids in fraternities. And mostly very average kids.

EGD

January 30th, 2015 at 3:12 PM ^

This is very true.  At UM in the '90s, I lived in my frat house for 3 years because whenever I looked at other off-campus options, the cost would have been much higher.  Plus in the frat house I only had to pay for the months I actually lived there, so if I was going to be out of town for a summer or something I didn't have to worry about finding a sub-tenant (or what might happen if that sub-tenant didn't pay, which quite frequently happened to friends of mine).

Prince Lover

January 30th, 2015 at 1:26 AM ^

 "first-gen kids are extremely close minded. Most of them assume rich kids despise them, refuse to try new things, blow innocuous things out of proportion (e.g. "micro-aggressions"), don't even make serious attempts to make "rich" friends"

Please, stop, just stop. This is as close minded of a statement as any "first-gen" kid could make.

oriental andrew

January 30th, 2015 at 9:34 AM ^

After reading some of this person's other posts, I'm convinced belle du jour is a troll, with exactly ZERO posts on actual Michigan sports topics, and the vast majority of comments on things like the frat scandal, rich/poor divide, opinions on the Grosse Point thread, etc. Basically, ignore him/her.