MGoOpinion: Harbaugh recruiting and early commits in the 2017 class

Submitted by Gentleman Squirrels on

So in the last two weeks, we've all discussed Harbaugh's recruiting strategies and we've all developed some opinion on Harbaugh pushing away lower rated recruits for more higher caliber ones. I believe most of the questionable attrition is over in the 2016 class.

I wanted to move attention to the 2017 class, where we have 5 commits so far - JaRaymond Hall, Kurt Taylor, Carter Dunaway, Jeremiah Holloman, and Benjamin St-Juste. I think Hall, Taylor and Hollomon are unlikely to be removed, mostly because they are national caliber recruits with (or with potential to get) P5 offers. However, I wanted to get the board's opinion on Dunaway and St-Juste. I remember both of them being questionable offers, with Dunaway having played little and St-Juste having little scouting due to Canada. Would we be comfortable if either of them were pushed out? St-Juste already reclassified to 2017 to make sure he would be ready to play at Michigan. And Dunaway is a son of a Craig Dunaway, a former player under Bo. 

***NOTE: I don't want any commits to leave and hope that all 5 of these recruits sign come signing day in 2017***

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wayneandgarth

January 26th, 2016 at 11:34 AM ^

I wouldn't call it "tactics".  I view it more as a strategy and approach.  He has limited scholorships and is looking in the end to have the best set of players to fill those limited slots.  Yes, he wants to approach filling those in an fair manner.  I wouldn't doubt that if any communication approach can be enhanced for '17, he'll do that. 

But, to this point, I don't know how anyone can say he's done anything unethical (not saying you are) as few understand the full story.

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CalifExile

January 26th, 2016 at 2:40 PM ^

Strategy looks at your overall goal, e.g., "almost all our starting DBs graduate after next year, we need to get some DBs in this class". Tactics are the moves you make to achieve your strategic goals. You might throw out a couple of hundred offers and accept commitments as they come in or you might start by offering only your dream recruits and extending additional offers as it becomes clear that you won't be signing everyone you want.

Pro tip: the best solution lies between those extremes.

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somewittyname

January 26th, 2016 at 11:51 AM ^

On this board Harbaugh is a deified to an uncomfortable extent. Now of course losing one major recruit wouldn't be big deal, but clearly he's not the only kid out there cocking an eyebrow at what's going on.

Hopefully, going forward, cases like Weaver will help low ranked kids keep a more skeptical eye toward what an offer from Harbaugh means for their own sake.

Joined: 05/15/2009

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Maison Bleue

January 26th, 2016 at 12:09 PM ^

If he doesn't go to Michigan, he will go to a school that does the same things, if not worse. So if he doesn't see that and only cocks an eyebrow at Michigan, then maybe he didn't want to be at UM in the first place. 

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DetroitBlue

January 26th, 2016 at 12:24 PM ^

If you're so uncomfortable with the Harbaugh adoration, and so sick of the way people justify things, then go away. Why constantly bitch about something that bothers you so much but will never change?



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Dawggoblue

January 26th, 2016 at 12:24 PM ^

It's not baseless.  As long as schools offer more scholarships than they have available (which every school does), they are doing this.  This had already been pointed out.

Most schools offer 100+ kids.  What would they do if 50 of them wanted to go there?  Exactly what Michigan did.  That is the way it works.  If you don't like it, you should stop following recruiting or college football all together.

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CraigB

January 26th, 2016 at 12:25 PM ^

Recruiting analysts from 247, SB Nation, Scout, etc have all said this happens everywhere. While most fans want Michigan to be above all that, the fact is it is just an unfortunate part of recruiting now.

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Maison Bleue

January 26th, 2016 at 12:32 PM ^

This has nothing to do with making me feel better. My point was that if the kid only cocks an eyebrow at what Michigan is doing, while his other top schools (OSU, FLA, BAMA, MSU) are doing the same thing or worse (OSU, BAMA) maybe he wasn't going to UM in the first place.

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Gr1mlock

January 26th, 2016 at 12:21 PM ^

Or, you know, they'll know they've got a shot a michigan if they kick ass their senior year and develop.  Kids aren't dumb, they know what they're ranked.  If you're a generic 3 star who gets an early offer, you have two choices: carry on assuming Harbaugh thinks you're good enough now, or use it as motivation to get better and PROVE to Harbaugh and everyone that you belong.  I know which of that group I'd rather have.  

 

I'm not saying that Weaver or any of the other decommits weren't  trying their damndest or anything, but if you're a commit and look at this year, see this happen, and don't think "this offer's only really good if I ball out this year", then you're clearly not paying attention.  Hell, I wouldn't be shocked if Harbaugh's conversation with some of these low rated camp recruits was along the lines of "I think you're a great kid and have a lot of potential, and I'd love to have you at Michigan.  I'm going to offer you, but know that if you don't build to and reach that potential this year, there might not be space for you next February."  

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DetroitBlue

January 26th, 2016 at 11:47 AM ^

You can't expect Harbaugh to change his entire recruiting philosophy/tactics because it might piss off people. I hope he comes here too, but if he doesn't I'm pretty sure life will still go on



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somewittyname

January 26th, 2016 at 12:09 PM ^

To be clear, my concerns are not with scaring off other desired recruits. That's a distant second to conducting the program with dignity, which he is failing as of late.

It's also amazing how the narrative on this board shifts throughout the recruiting cycle. First it's, I don't get why we're offering these kids so early, but I guess you can't doubt Harbaugh's eye for talent. Then it's, well it's okay if we tell them early it might not work out--they can find other opportunities. Then it's, well we don't really know what actually happened. Then it's, well as long as it's by the rules I don't care how cynical and Machiavellian it is. What's next?

 

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kalamazoo

January 26th, 2016 at 1:19 PM ^

As the old phrase goes:

"Dignity wins etiquette competitions, defense wins championships."

As to the board's progression, we are understanding the situation better today than yesterday, and we'll understand it better tomorrow than today.

Harbaugh may be succeeding on the dignity metric at 95%, not failing in my point of view, since most recruits and current players are quite happy. They know what they have to do to play = compete and improve. The 5% remaining can be where it is currently "unclear" what is going on.

Harbaugh is updating his processes, too, with great enthusiasm, so expect changes. Entertainment at its best.

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AA2Denver

January 26th, 2016 at 12:06 PM ^

Apparently he is an OSU lean, if he doesn't like these recruiting tactics then he should look at top programs that don't do this. Like....  <crickets>

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APBlue

January 26th, 2016 at 11:59 AM ^

I'm not sure I agree with this.  Wouldn't an early signing period just push the timetable on the nudge out the door/out of the class?  

I think what would fix this is letting coaches talk about recruits.  

If JH could have said - hey we asked Swensen to come camp with us so we could evaluate him, but he didn't want to come.  His Sr. year tape was not as good as his Jr. year tape - he's regressing.  We pulled his offer.  People would understand.  Instead, you have the kid's point of view and nothing but rumors on the other side.  

 

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APBlue

January 26th, 2016 at 1:00 PM ^

Yeah, I get it, so the kid has more time to reset.  I'm not sure if this would've changed anything.  I'm not sure Michigan was done evaluating his Sr. season film in October.  The kid's season wouldn't have even been done yet.  

If other kids don't change their timeframe (waiting until NSD to play the "Hat Game"), does he still get the nudge in October anyway?  

 

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True Blue Grit

January 26th, 2016 at 12:52 PM ^

not solve the problem (if you want to call it that).  Schools would still make uncommittable offers and just not give them a letter to sign during the early signing period.  And I'm not sure that some of the sleazy schools wouldn't still tear up a LOI and release a kid in January if they got someone better for a position.  However, for kids who definitely know where they want to go, it would help them avoid the constant and never ending calls/visits/texts from coaches who are still after them.  

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CW97

January 26th, 2016 at 11:51 AM ^

Sometimes people need to realize it isn't always about their needs and regardless of how many people say they want or don't want "recruit A" it won't change the staff or recruits opinion. So it just ends up giving us a bad look to hypothesize and anger readers which often includes potential recruits.

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Blue Mike

January 26th, 2016 at 11:40 AM ^

Early signing isn't going to end any of this stuff.  What it will do is lock up the top players earlier, and all of the Rashard Weavers of the world won't get commitable offers until the early signing period is over, and then it will be a mad scramble to fill the class with whatever low-rated guys are left.

Do you really think Weaver's situation plays out any differently if signing day gets moved up a month or two?  For all of the reports, he knew this was happening a while ago, it isn't like Harbaugh decided yesterday to pull an offer or something.  

The whole thing would have just played out in December instead of late January. Does that make it better?

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Blue Mike

January 26th, 2016 at 12:12 PM ^

So Weaver gets "forced out" in December (or July or August or whenever people think is okay with early signing)?  It isn't going to change what happened with Weaver, just moves the timeline up.

Maybe it changes the Swenson situation, since that had more to do with evaluating his performance during the football season and not have happened until the early signing date passed.  But is that what you want?  Swenson to come here, not pan out, not see the field for 2-3 years and then transfer?  Tying up a scholarship during that time that could go to someone else who makes the team better?

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Blue Mike

January 26th, 2016 at 12:07 PM ^

Do you understand the concept?  The proposal from 2015 was to have a three day early signing period in mid-December, not in July or August.

College football's early signing period debate will go on. Conference commissioners on Wednesday delayed for one year voting on a proposal that would have created a three-day signing period in December, according to MAC commissioner Jon Steinbrecher.

Early Signing Proposal Delayed until 2016

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Goblue228

January 26th, 2016 at 11:52 AM ^

Wouldn't change a thing.  What would change things is if universities were not allowed to offer, and recruits not able to commit, until NSD.

 

But really, there is no big problem here that needs fixing.  As long as everyone views offers and commitments for what they are, non binding tentative agreements, there's really no harm here.  It's a privilege to be offered a scholarship at a university, and one that must continue to be earned.  It shouldn't ever be viewed as a right.  If the university no longer wants to offer that privilege, that's their perogative. You really don't have to worry about the kid as if Michigan ever even offers him, he's going to get a free ride at a good school somewhere no matter what.

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