Are the bans of certain writers and publications becoming counterproductive on this site?
I logged on to comment on the content posted by another user regarding Coach Harbaugh's podcast interview and suddenly the thread was gone. The OP posted a disclaimer about the content coming from some forbidden writer or publication.
However, it was good content. Now if it happens to be a hit piece, then I understand deleting it. But, shouldn't we welcome good content that can be discussed... on a message board. Maybe we should relax, and loosen up our sometimes vengeful posture.
February 18th, 2022 at 11:58 AM ^
Henson is annoying and often very wrong, but I can vouch for his sources sometimes. His problem is he doesn't have the critical thinking abilities to know when he's fed bullshit, so he reports things that people send out to all of us.
He doesn't deserve to be mentioned with the professional trolls like Yoder and Sabin.
February 18th, 2022 at 4:14 PM ^
I'll stand corrected about Henson, though as you noted his lack of an internal filter to identify the BS vs. reality leads to him posting some absolutely gawd awful stuff.
February 18th, 2022 at 11:57 AM ^
Hi Rainer.
The question is about quality of information that people get on this site. I love good faith arguments and I love it when someone debates me because that's a chance to learn and make what I'm saying better.
We have to recognize that some people out there--and I'm talking about just a bare handful whose names everybody knows by now--are not putting out information in good faith. Out of them, there are some who make their living by creating sensationalist lies or hateful framing. In these cases, they're not trying to have good faith about Michigan--their whole business model is to appear like they are and leech off of credible outlets' message boards. That's why we come down hard on people who post Chat Sports, or Rainer Sabin, or Steve Deace. These are parasites trying to use our reach to spread bullshit.
It's important for my business to control them because part of their business model is to bring everyone else down. Sabin has zero credibility, so nobody goes to the Freep for information anymore. The only way they can get readers then is to get posted in places that do have credibility. That damages us immensely. People will say "I read such and such on MGoBlog" and not differentiate between the message board and the site. That turns people off, and when it proves to be false it undermines years and years of busting our asses to build up trust.
I acknowledge that these days, especially for people who aren't trained at critical thinking, or people awash in anti-factual ideologies, there's a lot of touchiness about how much speech should be regulated by internet communities. But here's where I stand: Everyone deserves a shot, and many shots to get better. But if you are constantly arguing in bad faith, or I think you're liable to damage my business, you're not welcome here.
Rainer Sabin isn't just someone who's not to be trusted; he is an unethical, serial liar, and Michigan-hating troll who poses as a reporter to damage Michigan for clicks. When that spills over to my site, he damages our ability to provided trusted, ethical, and factual information for Michigan fans. I'm not going to start gatekeeping every day just in case he stumbles on something informational; if the Free Press has something guaranteed the News has it too and you can just post Angelique. I can guarantee you there will never be a time when Rainer Sabin's contributions to Michigan coverage are needed.
February 18th, 2022 at 12:17 PM ^
There it is. Anyone who doesn’t agree with me isn’t “trained at critical thinking” or is awash in “anti-factual ideologies.”
February 18th, 2022 at 12:22 PM ^
Does the irony hurt you that that was your take away from all of what Seth said?
February 18th, 2022 at 12:26 PM ^
I don’t get hurt by blog comments, but I do smile at the argument that “everyone who disagrees with me is dumb.”
February 18th, 2022 at 1:11 PM ^
and another thing: im not mad. please dont put in the newspaper that i got mad.
— wint (@dril) December 29, 2014
February 18th, 2022 at 2:51 PM ^
And I laugh out loud at hilarious strawman arguments like yours.
February 18th, 2022 at 12:25 PM ^
There it is. Absolutely ignoring everything he said and jumping to your own conclusions without actually engaging in the debate. Congrats on your hawt take, you sure showed him.
February 18th, 2022 at 12:29 PM ^
As expected, "The Oracle" with more childish petulance.
February 18th, 2022 at 4:41 PM ^
Water is wet, the sky is blue, and the Oracle misses the point and complains - time is a flat circle
February 18th, 2022 at 12:44 PM ^
or spreading MISINFORMATION thats the latest woke catch phrase...My Information (meaning MY Opinion) is Right and if you have any other opinion you are spreading MISINFORMATION....
February 18th, 2022 at 1:04 PM ^
The idea that all information is opinion is something only the dumbest of the dumb believe.
February 18th, 2022 at 1:18 PM ^
Damn dude you fucking SUCK at reading comprehension. That is not at all what Seth said.
February 18th, 2022 at 12:35 PM ^
As the original poster, I want to offer some considerations, stipulating from the top that I am fine with my post having been removed. (I feel a little chastened about not having absorbed, after years here, that Sabin is persona non grata--I tend to associate Stretchgate with another Freep writer who has actually made his way a little, regrettably, in the sportswriting establishment.)
Shitposting, in my view, takes a lot of forms; it's a little bit of work to place something here that is truly worthy of comment. I found the article not at the Freep but at msn, where I tend to find worthier and more dependable content--curated content--than at other sources. The description of how play-calling will be handled was--IMO--absolutely worthy of comment, since (as with a lot of issues) we have gone around and around and around here about how that works, with far more heat than light.
Another poster above notes that the piece was sprinkled with links to Sabin articles, so that's an additional. . . demerit. All in all, this adds up to good reason to remove the OP.
The issue remains, however, that between one hell of a lot of throwaway posts here and the handful, weekly, that are of real value, there's a pretty big gulf. Is there some way to make it possible to more quickly and effectively post? To improve the content? I'd say it's pretty obvious that BEING ABLE TO EDIT THE DARNED THINGS, after years of same, should move to the top of the list of possible site improvements.
I'm interested that you're calling the site yours, Seth--has there been some official change of ownership? Maybe I missed that, too. No one's asking my opinion, but after several years of what felt like real decline here the place starts to have a healthy feel once more; kudos to all concerned.
EDIT: I guess that the insinuation is that the OP, here, is Sabin? Huh.
February 18th, 2022 at 12:50 PM ^
Stretchgate and Sabin are completely different issues. Sabin was a Nick Saban flunky brought over by Gannett to be a Michigan troll. That's completely different than two journalists who hated Rich Rod who did some actual journalism to write a hit piece because their jobs were under threat if they didn't produce some sort of investigative bombshell. That initiated a Freep ban from Brian when I wasn't in any way a part of the blog's decision-making process. Both writers left, and one of them does actual amazing (non journalism) work these days. With them left any reason for that initial ban, at least in my eyes.
Sabin wouldn't know where to begin with an "investigation." He doesn't even know what investigation means. He's more like what Drew Sharp was--just a troll constantly trying to whine up some shit.
February 18th, 2022 at 1:01 PM ^
Cheers.
February 18th, 2022 at 1:32 PM ^
The being able to edit posts thing is a Drupal issue. Trust me: I want it fixed too, because I have to go into an editing mode then hover my mouse in this corner for 5 seconds (an eternity on the internet) then click on the little pencil thingy and be very careful to click "edit" and not "delete" to edit an article, or go into the back end to pull it up.
.
Enabling my "Edit" button for everyone opens a big security loophole. Hopefully that gets fixed with our server and drupal version upgrade, which is coming MONDAY. But there will be a lot of things that will break when we do that so getting around to things we can now make better will have to wait
As for the site: You're right that it is still Brian's. Ever since he said "You're in charge" I've been operating it like it's mine, which I bet is a trap that a lot of CEOs fall into because when you're personally responsible for a company you start to blur the lines between yourself and the company. I shouldn't say that it is "mine" though, because that's not true.
February 18th, 2022 at 3:47 PM ^
So we can refer to you as CEO of MGoBlog?
February 18th, 2022 at 4:06 PM ^
Nobody ever got in the way of whatever title anyone here wants to claim. Ace and I came up with "Associate Editor and Business Manager" and "Managing Editor" on our own. As soon as I was setting the content, writing UFR, building a writing staff, and handling the general editorial stance and direction of the site I took the title of Editor, and that only because it was the easiest way to sign documents and deal with orgs like the Athletic Department without them asking to see the boss.
February 19th, 2022 at 5:49 AM ^
It's a Drupal issue, so we're hoping a new version of Drupal will fix it.
Why, oh why do you folks insist on keeping that albatross around your neck?
February 18th, 2022 at 12:08 PM ^
No, the internet provides a near infinite number of resources. If a banned source has information you deem board worthy it is almost certain you can find it from an approved source. If that is too much work the information must not be worth posting.
February 18th, 2022 at 12:14 PM ^
I’ve always thought it was stupid. Of course a site or writer someone doesn’t like or which/who has featured bad info in the past could also post good or interesting content. Ideas should rise and fall on their own merit. Unfortunately, the idea that certain sources should be banned is becoming more and more popular everywhere in society. I have no idea why it’s necessary here.
February 18th, 2022 at 1:28 PM ^
Seth explained in an impressively clear manner in an earlier post exactly why it's necessary. You decided to not read it them post some inane comment that had nothing to do with what he posted.
You seem to be arguing from the standpoint of "all information and opinions are valid and should be judged equally" and that's simply ignorant.
Opinion and information stating the earth is flat is not valid, nor should it be judged as equally as the opinion and information stating the earth is round. Not all opinions, ideas, and information should be held in the same regard or even respected.
February 18th, 2022 at 12:15 PM ^
This is the Cancel Culture we live in if you dont like what someone thinks or says ban them..
February 18th, 2022 at 1:33 PM ^
This comment is the ignorance we (unfortunately) have to live with.
February 18th, 2022 at 12:31 PM ^
Censorship is always counterproductive, and yes it is here as well, but Seth and LSA are in charge, so let it be. Still overall best Michigan sports discussion site out there.
February 18th, 2022 at 12:36 PM ^
This is just such a stupid stance. Would this place really be better off with dick pic spam on every thread? Would prohibiting such things really be "counterproductive?"
February 18th, 2022 at 12:45 PM ^
You don’t see any difference between dick pics and information that comes from disapproved sources?
February 18th, 2022 at 12:54 PM ^
Im not talking about Dick-pics or pornography, dude. Talking about general football content as true or not, as well as the occasional idea that isn’t popular around here, or calling people racist just because you don’t like their political affiliation. Common sense is also a good virtue.
Straw men and red herrings bereft of common sense solve nothing. Thank you for insinuating that I’m in favor of dick-pics.
Idiot
February 18th, 2022 at 1:59 PM ^
How is he the idiot. You said censorship is ALWAYS counterproductive. He gave you an excellent example for why censorship is necessary.
February 18th, 2022 at 3:06 PM ^
You make a stupid claim ("Censorship is always counterproductive"). walk it back when it is shown to be stupid, and then claim that the person who forced you to walk back your claim is the idiot?
It is clear who the idiot is, here. Maybe you should invest some of that "common sense" in your own posts before you hit "save."
February 18th, 2022 at 4:49 PM ^
You said ‘censorship is always counterproductive’, and were then immediately given an example of how it isn’t necessarily so. Rather than acknowledge that your overly broad statement was wrong, you resort to name calling. How sadly on brand for you and your ilk.
February 18th, 2022 at 12:43 PM ^
The writing and analysis here is excellent and I don’t dispute their right to run the site however they choose.
February 18th, 2022 at 1:37 PM ^
The take that "censorship is always counterproductive" is just ridiculous.
On top of that, you made it doubly ridiculous by insinuating what is going on here is actually censorship.
You're free to read that idiots column all you want. Just not through MGoBlog. Brian/Seth aren't censoring anyone. They're simply choosing not to allow their useless crap on their website. Which isn't censorship.
It's incredible these things have to be explained to adults
February 18th, 2022 at 12:55 PM ^
I think OP’s question was valid, and Seth’s answer was appropriate.
It’s up to the proprietors of the site to determine what is allowed. We may think some of the restrictions are silly or petty, but that doesn’t mean that you can’t give those folks all the clicks you’d like on your own.
For example, Aidan Hutchinson did an entertaining Barstool pizza review a couple days ago but no Barstool here so whatever. No big deal. I enjoyed it.
February 18th, 2022 at 1:05 PM ^
I've always waffled on Barstool. The "ban" isn't so hard that I'll bother to knock down something that doesn't trip our other wires. If Aidan does a thing about how much he likes bewbs, it's going to break the no bewbs rule. If he just tells a funny story that his dad might tell on The Teams podcast, like, whatever: I can't get mad.
The antagonism there goes back to before my time, when blogs were young and Brian was part of a small group trying to establish that the medium's greater freedom for writers could mean better prose, better ideas, better credibility, while Barstool was using the medium's greater freedom to engage in the things that they themselves liked: misogyny, bewbs, hawt takes.
I think what ultimately happened is most of the MGoBlog-alikes got bought up by Vox and the writers moved on, and Barstool found a niche as the everyman's outlet that still reveled in the misogyny (because more sports fans are men and most men like bewbs). So we ended up this little weird patch of the internet, and they ended up so big that their corporate side constricts what they do, and the places where we overlap we don't fight. Nobody's left who's going to confuse what we do for what Barstool does, or vice versa. So I don't really find any reason to pursue hostilities. I stay away personally because that's the opposite of my bag. I don't want our site to become a postinghouse for Barstool because that will turn off a lot of the Sethlike people who read our site.
February 18th, 2022 at 8:11 PM ^
It’s nice to get a little background and to see things from a different perspective. Very enlightening. Thanks!
February 18th, 2022 at 1:09 PM ^
This is a nice place to come and browse the threads. while I don’t agree with every thing that is on here it’s not my call. Now waiting for the sale at TMI and getting a year was my call so I have another avenue to look at information. Use the site for what it is a really nice place to see what’s going on with the university and programs
February 18th, 2022 at 3:55 PM ^
It's not about whether it's a "positive" or "negative" piece. The moms don't ban writers who publish negative, but true, things about Michigan.
It's about credibility and journalistic integrity. Some of the banned writers steal other people's work. Others are trolls (trolling Michigan fans is a tried and true business plan: viewership/engagement tapering off? Say something inflammatory about Michigan and watch your numbers soar...). At least one that I can think of did actual damage to the program - on purpose - by publishing inaccurate information - on purpose - in order to further his own career.
And some of the banned writers were the equivalent of opinion columnists who made no contribution to any conversation because they weren't actually breaking news or making any new statements. Remember the "play the best 9!" columns that came out every Monday when Jim Leyland was the skipper of the Tigers? That's worthless journalism. That's banned here. That's a good thing.
February 18th, 2022 at 4:01 PM ^
It is pretentious
February 18th, 2022 at 4:03 PM ^
In Soviet Russia, news bans you!
February 18th, 2022 at 5:48 PM ^
My Dad used to tell a (Dad) joke, when too many questions were asked by children:
"You know what they say in RRRRUSSSIA, . . .
Tuffy Shitski"
Probably not politically correct, but in the '60s no one knew.
February 18th, 2022 at 4:40 PM ^
cuz this is the cool kid table at lunch, that's why
February 18th, 2022 at 6:46 PM ^
Seth, I assume that you were referencing me when you opened with "HI Rainier". For the record, I'm unfamiliar with Rainier or his work. I know of 2 Metro Detroit sports journalists, Mitch Album because he's quite famous, and Terry Foster because we met at a Super Bowl party in the 90's.
I'm also unacquainted with the various board beefs,, and hate lists that have been accumulated over the years. My inquiry here was only to prod discussion when I encountered a thread, that seemingly had no objectionable content, deleted. Mission accomplished. But, just because someone doesn't agree with you, it doesn't mean they ally with your sworn enemy.
The OP on that thread posted some good content, all I was trying to do was discuss it.
February 19th, 2022 at 12:25 AM ^
It's America in 2022, ban everything that you don't agree with. Viva classical liberalism
February 20th, 2022 at 2:35 AM ^
If the content is available on another site that isn't banned then who cares?