What level of faith do you have in Warde Manuel to not screw this up?
Will he open up the checkbook and hire a Tier 1 coach or will he go cheap and cite ethics as the reason. I'm tired of hearing about "culture fit" quite frankly because Michigan's basketball culture is winning, not having a nice guy as a head coach. I have a bad feeling this is going to be similar to the lacrosse search which may have ended with a decent coach but by all accounts was a disaster throughout according to those inside the lacrosse world. The fact that Porter Moser's name is anywhere near this search is a sick joke in and of itself. According to Sam Webb Warde is not even showing interest in Billy Donovan even though Webb has a source that says they would have a legit shot at him if they did. This is trending towards being a massive disappointment. We don't pay recruits so we better pony up and pay for a coach otherwise what the hell is a the point in operating an AD with a $185 million dollar revenue stream.
Sam is saying that his sources are telling him that Donovan is interested, but that he would be surprised if Michigan showed interest. It’s probably Porter Moser, ugh.
My faith level is about the same as when David Brandon was hiring Hoke and passing on Harbaugh. This looks like it is heading in that direction.
Can you please explain why it looks like it's heading in this direction? It's been 24 hours. and almost no information has been shared other than articles of what options might be on the table. Unfortunately, we don't have enough information but this will be where Warde either earns his salary, or proves himself unworthy.
Because BPONE.
Sam said Warde isn't even calling Billy Donovan? Are you sure?
He said "I'll state again that I'd be very surprised if interest was shown."
Do you practice lying??? If Sam said what you just quoted idiot, then your brain is either dead or needs to be resuscitated. “I’d be surprised if, interest was shown.” That could simply mean that,”Donovan himself isn’t interested!” NOT THAT WARDE HAS NOT CALLED HIM!
Hold this L.
Re Billy Donovan --- Got this from a friend of Billy Schmidt's today -- (for those that don't know who Billy is, he is a former Michigan basketball assistant who has been the director quality control for he Oklahoma City Thunder for the last four years. He was with also with Donovan during his last year at Florida).
"Michigan would have a legit shot at Billy (Donovan) if they showed interest. Coaching Russell Westbrook has its challenges, and if they don't win this year there's a good chance they'd get fired anyway. I think he'd listen. The things standing in the way... Billy (Donovan) has said he doesn't miss recruiting, and I don't know that Michigan sees him as a fit."
I'll state again that I'd be very surprised if interest was shown, but Warde & staff do have a connect if they decide to explore it. Warde was an administrator in Ann Arbor during Schmidt's stint as an assistant.
For the record just because you quoted someone it doesn’t mean that Warde has NOT shown interest! Again you have ZERO first hand knowledge, and why would someone trust you with anyone else’s words! You’re still a liar!
Sam literally wrote that on 247. You can't call him a liar for claiming that's what Sam said, and then call him a liar for posting proof of exactly what he claimed.
He himself is a liar or would you just prefer the word dishonest? Where does it say that Warde has not contacted him?
I can see the spittle flying off your rage-filled fingertips as they hit the keyboard...
You'll probably break that keyboard by the end of the day. LOL!!
Attempt by sam to misdirect to make negotiations easier.
For those adults that are reading this and believe this guy I have some land in my backyard that has oil. I’ll sell you a lot for a million dollars up front. I guarantee your money will be used in a positive manner but I will supply my disclosure after your money posts to my account!
Someone posted a screen shot of the MichiganInsider forum post where Sam says it on Twitter. Maizen is right in this situation
Hey NJ he hasn’t actually called anyone. So that does make him correct. Thus, he’s right by default. He hasn’t had a list formulated and handed to him on his desk yet. What a wonderful world.
Sam said his source told him that Michigan would have a shot at Donovan if they showed interest, but also that he would be surprised if Michigan showed that interest.
Also, Warde apparently has a connection to Sam’s source, so the opportunity is there.
Who are you and why do you get to question anyone’s level of faith in our AD? Bullshit after bullshit after bullshit thread! What level of faith did you have in yourself that you would not recreate another piece of BULLSHIT thread titles today?
If he doesn't at least reach out to Billy Donovan, then he should be the next to go
Yup, it would suck if Billy doesn't come here, but you have to at least ask. Failure to contact the home-run candidates should be a fireable offense. It's one phone call, just do it.
Fairly low but I was pleasantly surprised with the hockey hire so I'm going to wait and see how this goes. I'm not going to believe anything until something actually happens though.
I mean I live here in Cleveland and NOBODY saw the Beilein hiring coming. I mean NOBODY.
The hockey hire was the right hire.
It was also a pretty cut-and-dried slam dunk. I thought Warde did just fine with the hockey transition, and a lot of the criticism of him has been unwarranted.
But this is a lot trickier than the hockey hire and a lot more pivotal. He doesn't have a former long-time Michigan-loving assistant who has turned a moribund program into a contender to pluck here. The big names appear beyond reach and the assistants and former assistants haven't proven their ability to HC on the big stage yet the way Mel did.
I got blasted for saying this but still stand by it...Warde should have pulled the trigger a year earlier on the hockey hire. It was the obvious choice and it still took a wasted year to make the call.
That was all revisionist history. Red had come off a really good year and while a move needed to be made at some point, the idea that you kick out a legend on a high note sounds poetic but isn't a reality. Plus, Warde had been on the job all of a couple of weeks when that season ended; it's absolutely reasonable that the new AD wasn't up to replacing him in that short of a timeframe. If anything, Hackett should have been to blame because he was there when Red was really faltering and had built up some capital with the Harbaugh hire.
I don't like you, too much. You post like shit - crapping all over players simply because they're not 5-stars you happen to like. But I can also admit goodness when I see it. And most of your posts (of the ones I've seen) about this search have been pretty good - including this one.
To your point, Manual worries me because he has no track record of making excellent coaching decisions under pressure situations like this. Ad we have no idea - absolutely zero - about how he handles pressure, because he never says a thing. Whether it's speaking out about misfortune, backing up coaches, whatever. Crickets...
What I like about him is he seems to be quite well organized as an administrator. If he is, then he's done his homework on successors.
But then, if he's not calling Donovan and continues to regard Porter in high esteem... If that is true, we're doomed.
Since you’re not quite sure how to spell his name you’re worrisome for nothing! Don’t worry he’ll read the Manual on how not to spell Manuel, like VA expounds daily on how he trusts no “Manual that he can’t fire or read!”
Maizen's problem isn't being informed--he follows things closely. And it's not even that he's a pessimist. It's his self control and dishonesty.
His actual content varies but he is capable of valid contributions. He is simply unable to control himself when he loses his temper, and his insistence on perpetuating dishonesty heavily undercuts his arguments, particularly when he pretends he hasn't made them before. It's unfortunate, because his position that Michigan should get a big-time coach is a good one and it is an important perspective on the board.
He's also a pessimist, or at least someone that almost always frames things in a negative light or highlights those traits. Even here, his title is "to not screw up" instead of "get it right". Almost all his posts are in that way.
I agree with you, some of his insight is actually worthwhile, even the negative stuff. There is benefit in being more neutral and presenting the negative aspects. That's not why people dislike him though. There is no balance to the things he rights. Even his compliments often seem backhanded or just means of setting up either: a) a segue to his standard negative talking points; b) just enough boilerplate to say "see, I wasn't negative here".
The other thing that is annoying is that his constant pessimism is teamed with this immature idealist ideology that Michigan should automatically be/get the best at everything because... reasons. Nothing but 4/5 star recruits, nothing less than successful NBA head coaches with National Title games in their past, etc. And he does that with the refrain that he's keeping it real or something.
this explains his uncertainty of Warde's ability to handle things with this hire given there is no current rating system for Athletic Directors.
this, right here.
the problem with maizen (and others of his ilk) is that he confuses bitching about everything with "honesty," or "telling it like it is," or (worst) "demanding excellence." he apparently doesn't realize that being unrelentingly negative doesn't make you "honest," it makes you a "dick."
Straight up Maizen is right a lot of the time. It's just up until 1201 he was too big of a prick to ever elaborate on why he was right and would go into personal insults. Star gazed a little too heavily for my liking because sometimes there are reasons recruits are underscouted and under recruited, but now that he's just a tad pessimistic I love him. He sends some of the board absolutely insane and it's great. People are becoming the person they hated the most, and for that I'll love Maizen.
You act like Warde staying in the background is a bad thing. ADs should stay in the background. It's not about them. It's never about them. Being in the foreground instead of handling your business is almost always a negative with ADs. When has an AD been outspoken and you've ended up thinking "oh, that's good"? It's hardly ever. Because when they are in the foreground it's for damage control or because they want to be the face of the program, instead of the focus being on the coaches and players.
I appreciate Warde staying in the background. I can assure you the coaches appreciate it as well.
I agree that staying in the background is best - for all administrators. But there are times when the bully pulpit of the Michigan AD should be used. Maybe he hasn't had a valuable enough reason to use it? Could be... Clearly, my reasons are different from yours are different from his, etc, and his are the ones that matter. But all I sad was that we have nothing to go on in understanding how he'll handle this search.
If you have more insight than that, please share. My tendency is to feel confident in a search performed well. I just have nothing to base a feeling of confidence on, other than his seemingly good organizational skills and a string of good hires for non-pressure programs.
**(Not an edit: By non-pressure, I mean the non-revenue sports that don't get national attention whenever some player sneezes. There is pressure in dealing with every team his department fields - those players deserve respect and thoughtful consideration, as well.)
He is a very good AD and he will make a great hire to fit what Michigan needs. The job is a big time job and he knows it. Would you rather it was Brandon making the hire? He made a good one with Brady remember?????
This is a strawman argument. No, no one would rather Brandon make the hire, but that has zero to do with this AD making this hire.
I have no idea if Manuel a great AD, but I'm in the camp that this hire will prove it or not. And I've seen nothing to build confidence (yet) that Manuel can manage something this important. If he knew this was a possibility for nearly two weeks (per Sam Webb this morning) then his seeming lack of willingness to contact a top tier candidate is troubling.
But all that said if he hires a great coach then he'll get all credit due.
I mean, he knew this was a possibility a year ago when Beilein was talking to Detroit. And by all accounts he made a list and has a system to work through it.
What drives me crazy is this contradiction embodied in the "he better follow a good process and hire a good coach" and "OMGZZZZ HEZ NOT CALLED DONOVAN!?!?!?!". I have faith that a guy who has been successful elsewhere and helped build up solid athletic departments can do a good job here. it won't work at the speed some people want, and I'm happy because those people are irrational and should be made to suffer for their impatience.
Less than zero.
You’re negative about 100 percent of everything so this means nothing!
The last time he had the opportunity to make a hire like this, he made the internal candidate an interim, then removed the tag and gave him a 5-year contract a year later. That coach only had 2 years asst coaching experience and was replacing a legend.
Of course, this site will neg bang you to no end, but the concerns are valid.
First off, Maizen can go jump in the lake.
Second, Warde has not made ONE bad hire yet.
You bitched and moaned when he hired Kevin Conry from Maryland for MLAX and they went 10-7 his first season and the team beat #4 Notre Dame and #14 Penn State. This year the team didn't have a good season but it was ruined by injuries all year.
When we finally did have most of our players back, we beat #10 Ohio State for the first time ever.
His WLAX hire was his best one yet. I praised it at the time as he went and hired 29 year old Hannah Nielsen who was basically Michael Jordan of women's lacrosse in her playing career.
First year we go 7-10 but beat PSU on the last day of the season. This year? 16-4 and a top-10 team. As stunning of a turnaround as I've ever seen. We shouldn't be this good in just our 6th season.
Mel Pearson for Hockey was a no-brainer hire but Warde wasn't trying to be the smartest guy in the room making the hire and that's a good thing.
The Olympic sports don't get the attention they deserve but if you pay attention to them you will learn some things about Warde when he does make hires. He's proven he knows what he's doing. He also knows when it's time to pull the rip cord.
Warde also set up University at Buffalo for a lot of success by hiring Turner Gill and increasing the budget from $11M to $25M in three years.
Yea Warde increased the budget all on his own, it had nothing to do with ballooning TV network deals across college football. And Turner Gil went 20-30 at Buffalo and you think that was a good hire?
Okey dokey.
Does Warde have a boat? A cell phone?
Zero confidence in Manuel. He has done nothing to merit any confidence. I'll also invite a neg-fest by saying that the jury is still out on Pearson. This past year's team was awful. It is true that the team was not filled with top-level talent but many nights they did not show up at all e.g. losses at home to Vermont and Merrimack - two very bad teams. Also, they were often undone by making the same mistakes over and over again. Not traits of a well-coached team.
Lol I like how you breezed right over the Frozen Four team the year before
Selective memory huh?
Hiring Billy Donovan would be an upgrade over Beilein. That's one way not to screw it up.
It would be an amazing hire.
What you worry about is if Warde doesn't want a big time coach with a big time ego. Most do have the ego, that's part of what makes them winners.
Get the very best available Warde!
You'll get unfairly pooped on for this one, but I agree with you. Warde has made a few serious miscalculated errors, such as the whole Rhonda Faehn debacle, not giving John Beilein more resources a few years ago for his coaching staff while he allowed Jim Harbaugh to pay both Tim Drevno and Pep Hamilton north of a million dollars, and this may be the straw that breaks the back if he ends up flunking this hiring.
I'm going to answer with my own opinion, in addition to other comments, since the question itself merits such an answer.
My confidence? 50%. Warde has not been bad, as many would assert with no basis. He has made good hires for other sports. However, the hockey hire was the AD equivalent of a 7-footer finishing an alley-oop pass from a point guard--you need some skill to avoid screwing it up, but it is ready to go and not that difficult.
His quotes about the search COULD just be a realistic understanding that Michigan will not recruit with Duke and Kentucky and Kansas and that the coach Michigan hires will have to build a program with guys that are in the program for multiple years. That's the strategy Jay Wright and Tony Bennett and Mark Few use, even though they also recruit pretty well.
But it could also be a prelude to getting a middling guy that they hope will be a "coach them up" type with no recruiting pedigree. If he makes that kind of hire, I will be disappointed. I'll give the hire a shot, but if things aren't going well on the court or in recruiting by the middle of year 2, both Warde and the coach will hear it from everyone.
I'm not going to worry too much until we find out what really happens. There's too much fog-of-war and the rumor machine does not give an accurate picture of what's actually going on.
But the process and results matter. Warde's tenure will, in large part, be defined by this hire. And that is fair.