Will Hoke coach a Heisman winner?
Carr and Moeller both did it relatively early in their careers. Hell, RR had Denard on track to do it in September 2010...
Do you think it will happen under Hoke? At what position?
Just wanted to start some speculation with this topic, its not like we're impatiently tapping our feet here.
I doubt there will be another defensive winner like Woodson, but I think we can have an RB be a finalist (D. Smith maybe?)
Tate was on track in Sept '09!
April 23rd, 2012 at 10:04 AM ^
2012: Denard
2013: Fitz
2014: Devin (yes, he gets his medical-redshirt)
2015: Shane
2016: Ty Isaac and Treadwell have to share it.
April 23rd, 2012 at 10:24 AM ^
April 23rd, 2012 at 10:31 AM ^
The Fridge did it in the NFL.
Erm. Wrong picture.
As College football goes the only recent two-way player I can think of off the top of my head is Owen Marecic from Stanford.
April 23rd, 2012 at 10:39 AM ^
April 23rd, 2012 at 10:45 AM ^
I don't know what you are talking about. I know of many fullbacks who are in heisman contention every year. I'm fairly certain Sione Houma will win the Heisman. At least, that's what THE_KNOWLEDGE told me.
April 23rd, 2012 at 10:53 AM ^
April 23rd, 2012 at 11:11 AM ^
Michigan's own Will Carr.
April 23rd, 2012 at 11:12 AM ^
Since it's almost a "given" that the Heisman winner will either be a QB or an RB, Shane Morris looks like the most likely candidate. Denard won't get enough carries to be a serious candidate this year, and he isn't quite tall enough to win it as a "pocket passer."
I don't see any RB's who are Heisman caliber yet, either. Maybe someone can grow into one by 2015 or so, when the OL recruits become fully-grown and ready to really push people around. Shane Morris behind a great line with even reasonable skill position players might be able to win it.
Ultimately, though, it's still "the team, the team, the team" at Michigan. And I would imagine that any player on the team would take a National Championship over a Heisman Trophy.
April 23rd, 2012 at 11:21 AM ^
Unless we start getting better receivers, Morris isn't going to be able to pull in the Heisman.
April 23rd, 2012 at 11:18 AM ^
I've mentioned this before but every Heismen winner at Michigan did not win the trophy under the coach who recruited him.
Tom Harmon was recruited by Harry Kipke, won the trophy with Fritz Crisler.
Desmond Howard was recruited by Bo, won the trophy with Gary Moeller.
Charles Woodson was recruited by Gary Moeller, won the trophy with Lloyd Carr.
Denard Robinson was recruited by RichRod, can he win the trophy with Hoke?
This would certainly follow the pattern. The trophy has always been won in either year 2 or year 3 of the new coach. This is Brady's second year.
April 23rd, 2012 at 11:32 AM ^
If Denard puts up a big game and Michigan beats Alabama, it will be his trophy to lose the rest of the way.
April 23rd, 2012 at 11:20 AM ^
I don't think it's far-fetched that Denard could win it this year. He's already on the radar and has the star appeal. I think a few (realistic) things need to happen:
1. Beat Alabama OR play great in a reasonable loss
2. Win Legends Division
3. Get completion percentage up around 60%
4. Keep interceptions in the single digits
5. Do everything he's been doing the past two years
April 23rd, 2012 at 11:27 AM ^
Denard doesn't have the receivers to have a realistic shot at the Heisman. He will almost surely put up good rushing numbers, but it won't really matter if his receivers can't get open and can't make big plays.
April 23rd, 2012 at 11:32 AM ^
If Denard can learn to take off more often on designed pass plays, that would do a lot to get receivers open. I really hope we can see that from him this year.
April 23rd, 2012 at 11:50 AM ^
You heard Borges talk about it in the BTN film room or whatever if you watched it, but Denard really needs to learn to step into the pocket to scramble. His comfort in the pocket has made it much more difficult for him to threaten the run and the pass on pass plays without giving himself up, and it's somethign Tate was actually better at (probably because he was coached up on it for multiple years before even coming to Michigan). Even then it still becomes difficult, as even in breakdown situations, Michigan just doesn't possess great athletes at WR, so they are a bit easier to cover even in those situations.
We'll see what happens, I think there will be some pretty decent improvement in the pass game this year with out much showing up statistics wise only because Denard won't have a playmaker like Junior to throw to. Even then, as always with Heisman winners, a lot would have to go Denard's way. He won't get as many carries this year and I don't see Michigan having an extremely powerful passing attach either, so it's likely MNC or bust for any shot at it, and I don't see that happening unfortunately.
April 23rd, 2012 at 11:39 AM ^
You're probably right, but it seems like Michigan always has a way of putting a couple of capable WRs out there. Who knows where that will come from this year: maybe Gallon steps up big time (already has good rapport with Denard); maybe DG is actually featured there on a regular basis and provides that jump-ball target; maybe the freshmen come in and are ready to contribute; maybe Jerald Robinson gets it together. Lots of maybes, but we always seem to do alright at that position.
I think Denard has the pedigree at this point that if he can be a game-manager type and still make a bunch of highlight-reel runs and--most importantly--win, then he'll be in the conversation. Especially if the coaches get creative and feature him as a WR a little bit (which I think they should do this year to give him a chance to show the NFL that he can contribute there). Winning will be the biggest thing.
April 23rd, 2012 at 11:52 AM ^
Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think the coaches are going to put Denard at wideout, at least not for standard plays. They might do some tricky things like last year (the "Deuce" package), but Hoke is a traditional football coach. It's about the team, not getting one guy ready for the NFL.
Additionally, I disagree that Michigan has consistently sent out good receivers, at least not in recent years. 2008 was poor. 2009 was poor. 2010 saw the rise of Roy Roundtree and Junior Hemingway. 2011 was a good year for Hemingway, but nobody else stood out. It's been hit-and-miss over the last four years.
April 23rd, 2012 at 12:05 PM ^
I think "put out good WRs" went away when Coach Campbell wasn't brought back to the staff under RR. Now it will be interesting to see how Coach Heck can coach up the players. I think it's unfair to lump in what Coach Dews did with what Coach Heck may do. As you said yourself, I think the case is still to be made in that regard. We'll see if Michigan can get back to being able to put out good WRs pretty much no matter what.
As is pretty obvious, I'm still a really big Coach Campbell fan. Sense being at Iowa (the last four years) he's developed McNutt, Johnson-Koulianos (both eventually first team Big Ten), Moekaki (he coached TEs and WRs his first two years there). He has consistently been able to successfully produce good college WRs, and I'm surprised his name isn't brought up more.
April 23rd, 2012 at 12:23 PM ^
I think Campbell was Michigan's best position coach of the last 20 years. I definitely agree that we would be better off with him. Rodriguez made a mistake by letting him go. Dews never did anything special.
If Hoke ever coaches a heisman winner, it will be a running back. All of you who are naming defensive players need to realize that only one person in the history of college sports has ever one the heisman as a primarily defensive player and we all know who that was...Sir Charles! The amount of running plays will increase to the running back after Denard departs. Saying that Fitz had over 1,000 yards last season, while only receiving about 75% of the carries. Not to mention all the runs by Denard, Fitz will surely break 1,000 yds. this year and in his senior season he will shatter it (barring injury). I'm not saying Fitz will win it, but a running back with his skills or better could easily win the heisman in Hokes scheme.
Woodson did more than play defense. While that is mostly how he ruled the NCAA...his punt returns, his limited offensive plays made him all the more versitile and you can guarantee the offensive appearances were there to remove any doubt. Though having coached against him while he was at Freemont Ross, personally I thought he was a better tailback than DB. And that's a scary thought because he's still the best DB I've seen in a number of years.
Running backs are old news. Quarterback is the Heisman magnet these days. If you look at the last decade, quarterbacks are dominating the award.
Fitz's numbers last year were very good. He was gaining 135(?) yards per game against big 10 competition once he became the feature back. I think our O-line may take a small step back, but there were positive reports of him improving his vision and catching this spring. If he plays well against basically a brand new Alabama defense and stays healthy the entire season, I think he could be considered for it. I don't think he'll win it because Denard will obviously get his carries, and Rawls and Smith should get some reps as well, but I wouldn't be shocked if he was heavily considered for the Heisman. On a related note, I think we're going to run the ball a LOT this season unless we see considerable improvement from our recieving corps.
with the talent he seems to be recruiting and the coaches he's surrounded himself with, the opportunity seems pretty likely. Denard isn't out of the picture yet either wiht the new offense making strides, who knows. We put out the first primarily defensive winner ever.