OT- Austin Jackson loses out on AL Rookie of the Year
Wire came across that the relief pitcher for the Rangers, who played 59 innings, beats out A-Jax for Rookie of the Year. Complete and utter bullshit. The grind of 162 games and impressively consistent production is far more valuable. Shit. When does spring training start?
November 15th, 2010 at 11:45 PM ^
It could've gone either way, but to say it's "bullshit" that Feliz won is wrong. Feliz had a fantastic season and is well deserving of the ROY.
November 15th, 2010 at 11:56 PM ^
I will plus-1 you even though I disagree. Feliz did have an amazing season. I just think Jackson as an everyday player was more deserving.
November 16th, 2010 at 8:33 AM ^
I think the fact that Jackson took a mid-late season dive really hurt him. And come on, really? While he sucks he lost, it's an award. He is a young player with a ton of talent and upside.
November 16th, 2010 at 11:29 AM ^
was bulletproof.
I think (hope?) we've all reached the point where we recognize the importance of on-base percentage and Jackson's is not great despite the high average, which means he better keep that average up. And he had a ton of strike outs for a guy without much HR power.
The steals were very good, the average was pretty good. As a package on the year, he was good, not great.
I think Jackson appears to be overperforming what some prospect analysts expected, and the doubles power works well at CoPa combined with his speed, so he should be a solid player going forward. But his year was not particularly noteworthy as a position player, thus it seems as good a year as any to allow voters to look to relief pitchers as another option. Compare vs. non-ROY-winner in the NL Jason Heyward:
Jackson - .293/.345/.400, 4 HR, 34 2B, 27 SB, 170 Strike outs
Heyward - .277/.393/.456, 18 HR, 29 2B, 11 SB, 128 Strike outs
(yes, I know AJax's vote is completely independent of Heyward, just pointing out how far off he was from a "great" rookie year, and suggesting he was not a slam dunk option in the abstract)
November 16th, 2010 at 11:59 AM ^
dude had 40 saves
thats a lot of saves
November 15th, 2010 at 11:51 PM ^
... Just like Inge got screwed on the gold glove and Miggy will get screwed by Hamilton who didn't play at all the final month. Yet his team still made the playoffs. Think what kind of record the Tigers would have had if Miggy didn't play for an entire month, That's why he should be your MVP.
November 16th, 2010 at 12:24 AM ^
For the love of god tell me you're kidding about Inge winning a gold glove
November 16th, 2010 at 1:35 AM ^
Best player in the MLB.
November 16th, 2010 at 3:38 AM ^
the yanks are going to try and steal him from us
November 16th, 2010 at 5:25 AM ^
In case Jeter leaves. Just move ARod back to SS.
November 16th, 2010 at 10:25 AM ^
Inge is a very good defensive player, why wouldn't he be able to win a gold glove? It's the bat that sucks with him.
November 16th, 2010 at 1:40 PM ^
Inge had an American League best fielding percentage of .977 while winner Evan Longoria's percentage was .966 so who is the better fielder ? Inge, the gold glove is allegedly for fielding only, so he's the obvious choice.
November 16th, 2010 at 1:49 PM ^
is a glamour contest voted on by the players. It means next to nothing.
November 16th, 2010 at 2:11 PM ^
Fielding percentage is a flawed statistic. It doesn't take range into account.
For example, a player who gets to 35 balls and makes 1 error has a higher fielding percentage (.971) than a player who gets to 50 balls and makes 3 errors (.940)
Quote from B-R blog
Citing fielding percentage as evidence of the best fielder is like saying the best quarterback is the one with the lowest interception rate, or the best basketball defender is the one with the fewest fouls.
Not making errors has value, but its far from the most important thing you can do as a defender.
November 16th, 2010 at 9:53 AM ^
http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=8&season=2010&month=0
Josh Hamilton 8.0 WAR
Miguel Cabrera 6.2 WAR
November 16th, 2010 at 12:11 AM ^
the AL champion, Texas Rangers. That's why.
November 16th, 2010 at 12:14 AM ^
The Tigers are constantly overlooked by the media. It's really irritating. See also: Trammell, Alan, Hall of Fame bid.
November 16th, 2010 at 12:33 AM ^
Just about every team not named the Yankees or Red Sox gets overlooked. When you win you get recognized. That's just the way it goes.
November 16th, 2010 at 12:38 AM ^
Morris, Jack.
November 16th, 2010 at 9:52 AM ^
Jack Morris shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame. As Tiger fans, we should be talking about Whitaker and Trammell, who actually have legitimate cases. His ERA+ is 105.
November 16th, 2010 at 12:01 PM ^
tram lost to george bell, and he was probably more deserving
November 16th, 2010 at 1:20 AM ^
Everybody knows its because they win or they're more media savvy. That doesn't mean we like it or that it isn't stupid or retarded. It's a popularity contest not an actual designation of talent.
(see Jeter's gold glove 2010)
November 16th, 2010 at 1:23 AM ^
Austin Jackson would have been a great choice, but while it's true that Feliz only pitched 59 innings, he was also fucking amazing for that 59 innings. He pitched in a pennant race, and his peripheral statistics were great.
I'm a nominal Tiger fan, but it's hard to be upset about this. Of course, that could be because I'm an enormous Giants fan, and Buster Posey is the Denard Robinson of Baseball. Except with smaller dreads. And slightly slower. But just slightly.
November 16th, 2010 at 1:34 AM ^
his 40 saves were really good, but honestly what else was so amazing? He had a pretty good WHIP, but he averaged 1 strikeout an inning and had a pretty marginal ERA.
November 16th, 2010 at 10:04 AM ^
Neftali Feliz struck out 9.2 per 9 innings. That's really good. Here is a list of American League pitchers who did this in 2010:
Joakim Soria (9.7)
Jonathona Papelbon (10.2)
Bobby Jenks (10.4)
Jon Lester (9.7)
Francisco Liriano (9.4)
Jered Weaver (9.4)
Feliz also walked only 2.3 per 9. The 10th best AL pitcher in this (Zach Greinke) walked 2.25 per 9.
Feliz gave up 0.6 HR/9. This would place him 5th on the AL leaderboard ahead of Felix Hernandez, David Price, CC Sabathia, Jered Weaver, Zach Greinke, John Danks, Cliff Lee, Trevor Cahill, Gio Gonzalez etc
Feliz is really, really good
November 16th, 2010 at 10:10 AM ^
Didn't you get the memo BillyShears? He isn't a everyday positional player and hence the Tigers got screwed. Never mind facts, logic, or truth...
November 16th, 2010 at 10:22 AM ^
Whoops. It was in my spam folder. Sorry guys!
November 16th, 2010 at 11:37 AM ^
You are comparing a reliever to mostly starters. Besides Papelbon and Soria everyone you named was a starting pitcher. I'm not seem going to go into it because you to know your stuff, but I think you are making a HUGE mistake comparing guys to starting pitchers. If you included relievers in your search you would get much different results.
Speaking of guys above 9.2 K per 9 in the AL.
Henry Rodriguez (10.73)
Koji Uehara (11.25)
Tony Sipp (9.86)
Darren Oliver (9.49)
Jason Bulger (9.38)
And yes all of these guys are relievers.
2.3 BB per 9 is very good, but unfortunately he couldn't even beat out his own teammate.
Darren O'Day (1.7 per 9)
.6 HR per 9 would place him 5 if you are comparing only him to the starters in the AL. He is actually 78th if you add all the relievers, but since not all of the relievers qualify he would probably by around 50th.
Guys he didn't beat out
Dontrelle Willis! (.6 per 9, beat him out by percentage points)
Brad Thomas (.5)
Dusty Hughes (.5)
Trevor Bell (.3)
Like I said in my first post Neftali Feliz is a very, very good pitcher. I just don't think they should be included in the discussion of Rookie of the Year because they do not go out there and play as much as position players do. If this was a starting pitcher I wouldn't have as much of a problem with that because at least they are out there throwing 6 - 7 innings a time and racking up twice as many innings as relievers. That is why I said there should be a Rookie of the Year and Rookie Pitcher of the Year.
November 16th, 2010 at 12:08 PM ^
Of course you are right. The comparision isn't supposed to be straight between relievers and starters. I didn't mean to imply that. I was responding to this
He had a pretty good WHIP, but he averaged 1 strikeout an inning and had a pretty marginal ERA.
When phrased how it is, that sentence implies that averaging 1 strikout per inning is somehow a bad thing. I was just pointing out that this is not at all true. Guys who strike out a batter per inning have great stuff. His other peripherals were very good too.
I personally would have voted for Jackson because I think he added more value than Feliz (which almost all position players do compared to relievers). I just don't think this is something to get righteously angry about, as some people in this thread have (such as the original poster).
November 16th, 2010 at 3:08 PM ^
I think Feliz had a really good year. And ya I definitely didn't phrase my comments correctly. I just get upset about voting for relievers over position players, especially with how much each of them dominated their respective positions as rookies. But maybe that's just because I was a position player lol
November 16th, 2010 at 1:29 AM ^
I will preface this by saying Feliz did have a terrific year and he is very deserving of recognition. But I 100% agree with Yoss Tree on this. Feliz winning this award was complete and utter bullshit. To compare a relief pitcher to an everyday position player just isn't fair. They should split it up with a rookie pitcher of the year and rookie player of the year. I hate when the writers vote because honestly they don't know shit. They are glorified fans who get to write articles about the games we all watch.
November 16th, 2010 at 1:33 AM ^
...save the bit about the writers voting. IME, they're better than the fans (See All Star Game voting) and the players (See Derek Jeter winning his fifth Gold Glove) at getting it generally correct. Obviously they're not perfect, but it's better than the alternatives.
That said, I'm totall with you when it comes to the split between ROY position players and pitchers.
November 16th, 2010 at 1:36 AM ^
They split it up with the Cy Young and there are plenty of rookies who qualify each year, it just makes sense to allow players to be recognized even if they aren't on a very good team.
November 16th, 2010 at 5:37 AM ^
And of course it's crap. But, as many people have said, so it goes for the Tigers (see Armando Galarraga's non-perfect game).
November 16th, 2010 at 7:07 AM ^
Austin Jackson player great last year and thought he should have won. But not being a Yankee or on a playoff team took away his chances.
November 16th, 2010 at 7:36 AM ^
I'm not surprised that Feliz won because he pitched very well on a playoff team, but it always seems weird when a reliever wins the award over an every-day player. Bailey from Oakland won it last year and he had a great season, but I still think the award should be weighted toward a starter or a position player unless the reliever has a truly amazing season.
November 16th, 2010 at 1:13 PM ^
feliz did something no rookie ever has done so hes very deserving. Miggy deserves the MVP though