Mich-OSU Common Opponent #3: MSU

Submitted by BuckeyeChuck on November 1st, 2022 at 12:37 PM

Let’s talk rivalry. No, not the rivalry in which Defeated with Dignity = Assault with Battery. I’m talking about the rivalry where the shenanigans happen entering the tunnel or exiting the tunnel instead of deep in the shadows of the tunnel.

MSU is the third common opponent Michigan & Ohio State have played this year, Iowa and Penn State being the previous two.

(FancyStats boxscore for Michigan vs Mich St per Bill Connelly)

(FancyStats boxscore for Ohio St vs Mich St per Bill Connelly)

Both Ohio St and Michigan dominated Sparty in total plays (OSU 74-48, Mich 78-53), total yards (OSU 614-202, Mich 443-252), and yards per play (OSU 8.3-4.2, Mich 5.7-4.8).

Michigan had a 49% Success Rate and 14% Explosive play rate against MSU (both very slightly above average). OSU had 61% Success Rate and 19% Explosive Play Rate against MSU (both well above average).

MSU’s Success Rate & Explosive Play Rate were about the same against both OSU & Michigan. Their Explosive Play Rate was just about average both times (12.5% vs OSU, 13.2% vs Mich) but their Success Rate was below average both times (33% vs OSU, 34% vs Mich).

When viewing the overall, the biggest difference between OSU’s & Michigan’s performance against MSU was (sigh, you’re thinking, not this again) red zone offense. Seven of OSU’s 10 offensive plays in the red zone were a “successful” play to Michigan’s 4 of 16 plays. OSU scored a TD in 4 of 4 red zone trips to Michigan’s 2 of 5 trips.

RUN OFFENSE

Both OSU & Michigan ran the ball well on MSU. Michigan ran for 276 yards @ 5.3 per rush; OSU ran for 241 yards @ 5.4  per rush. Neither got stuffed much (both under 10%, deep in the green) and both got 5+ yards nearly half their rushes (Mich 44%, OSU 49%).

To pick it apart any more would be unnecessarily splitting hairs.

Let’s call it a draw.

Run offense against Mich St: Both were equally productive

PASS OFFENSE

Ohio St had 373 passing yards (including sacks) against MSU to Michigan’s 167 last Saturday. Ordinarily, a difference like that is due to frequency; however, McCarthy threw only one fewer pass attempt against MSU than Stroud did (25 to 26).

The obvious reasons are completion rate (OSU 82%, Mich 58%) and yards per pass attempt (OSU 12.9, Mich 6.4). What most surprises me is that it was not due to OSU passing downfield more:

  • Air yards/pass: OSU 9.5, Mich 8.6
  • Passes at/behind LOS: OSU 14.3%, Mich 15.4%
  • Passes 20+ air yards: OSU 7.1%, Mich 11.5% !!! (in raw numbers that comes out to twice for OSU and three times for Mich, so not that big a deal, but still a bit surprising)

OSU did suffer a sack and an INT, which Michigan suffered neither, but the productivity is still way in OSU’s favor.

Pass offense against Mich St: Very strong advantage for Ohio St

RUN DEFENSE

Virtually all of MSU’s rushing numbers against both teams are deep in the red on the box scores. 38 yards for 2.4 vs 47 yards for 2.2. Let’s slab an ‘Inspected by 12’ sticker on this one and move along.

Run defense against Mich St: Both were equally effective

PASS DEFENSE

MSU had 32 pass attempts (including sacks) against both OSU & Michigan, resulting in 5.1 ypa (vs OSU) and 6.4 ypa (vs Mich).

Michigan had two sacks and a pick, OSU had 4 sacks and a pick; although Michigan applied more pressure (46% to 27%).

MSU was a bit more productive against OSU after Thorne was removed when the game was out of hand. When Thorne was playing his average yards per dropback vs OSU was 3.6, vs Michigan it was 6.6. I’m going to give a slight edge to Ohio St.

Pass defense against Mich St: Slight advantage to Ohio St

 

THE TALLY THUS FAR:

  • Run offense against Iowa: Very strong advantage to Michigan
  • Run offense against Penn St: Humongous, tremendous, epic, downright embarrassingly glorious advantage to Michigan
  • Run offense against Mich St: Both were equally productive

 

  • Pass offense against Iowa: Somewhat strong advantage to Ohio St
  • Pass offense against Penn St: Somewhat strong advantage to Ohio St
  • Pass offense against Mich St: Very strong advantage for Ohio St

 

  • Run defense against Iowa: Both were about equally effective
  • Run defense against Penn St: Both were about equally effective
  • Run defense against Mich St: Both were equally effective

 

  • Pass defense against Iowa: Strong advantage to Ohio St
  • Pass defense against Penn St: Strong advantage to Michigan
  • Pass defense against Mich St: Slight advantage to Ohio St

 

There are 12 total games against common opponents; 9 have already been played. The remaining 3:

  • Michigan @ Rutgers Nov. 5
  • Ohio St vs. Indiana Nov 12
  • Ohio St @ Maryland Nov 19

bronxblue

November 1st, 2022 at 1:22 PM ^

I would add that OSU's redzone TD rate the past 2 games is 50% and that includes drives starting at the following spots:

  • Iowa's 29 (didn't reach redzone) - FG
  • Iowa's 27 - FG
  • Iowa's 34 - FG
  • Iowa's 32 - FG
  • Iowa's 25 - TD
  • Iowa's 40 - TD
  • PSU's 39 (didn't reach redzone) - missed FG
  • PSU's 41 - TD
  • PSU's 24 - TD

That's a lot of trips starting in opponent territory, with a bunch of them happening because of turnovers.  Credit to OSU for doing so but they're +8 in TO margin over the past 2 games, which feels a bit unsustainable.

bdneely4

November 1st, 2022 at 6:35 PM ^

It's an interesting observation because their last two opponents are the best two defenses (besides Notre Dame in which OSU also struggled on O) that OSU has faced.  I would think this bodes well for Michigan's chances.  OSU is elite and I am not sure anyone can deny that.  The difference this year may be that Michigan has figured out how to be elite with the talent they have as well.  The Game will come down to can Michigan slow down OSU's passing offense (OSU cannot run the ball and I expect that not to change come Nov. 26) and can OSU slow down Michigan's rushing offense.  Regarding OSU's running game, it almost feels like when they run the ball, it messes up their offensive rhythm.  Henderson is a phenomenal back but honestly has maybe even taken a step back this year on the eye test.  I realize he has been dinged up, but OSU's running game almost seems forced.  I like our chances to keep this game close.

Bo Glue

November 1st, 2022 at 12:48 PM ^

I am very surprised to see your comparisons only slightly favor OSU's passing attack over ours so far. I was expecting a big advantage against every common foe.

I'mTheStig

November 1st, 2022 at 3:37 PM ^

Came here to post this.

.

.

Also,I know what the data says but the eyeball test for me is having a hard time reconciling that.

I think from games I've seen this season, but not analyzed, is I like M's front 7 better than OSU (as a unit -- I know TuiMoloau is a beast) but OSU's backfield is much better than M's.

The Game is going to be can M stop the pass and can OSU stop the run?!

bringthewood

November 1st, 2022 at 1:03 PM ^

A missing component is who was out against OSU and back against M for MSU. Does not really fit into numbers but I would expect Slade and others playing against Michigan and not against OSU should be taken into account. Also, OSU had to play at EL vs M at home. So basically really difficult to compare.

brose

November 1st, 2022 at 1:24 PM ^

Thanks for doing these...interesting stuff.  As bringthewood mentions, there were some differences, but at the macro level, this is helpful.

Blue Middle

November 1st, 2022 at 1:38 PM ^

I think the pass defense stats are a bit misleading.  MSU completely changed their pass defense for this game and played much more zone.  So it's not just about where the passes are completed or how far the ball travels in the air, but what opportunities are there after the catch.  Also, OSU had the benefit of playing the defense they had scouted and game-planned for, while Michigan was playing a very different version.

Ultimately, Michigan's second-half adjustments say more about this game.  And in that half, Michigan annihilated MSU in nearly every way (with the redzone remaining an issue).

Don't get me wrong--OSU's passing attack is much better than Michigan's.  But there are other factors here that blunt the value of that comparison.

NeverPunt

November 1st, 2022 at 1:46 PM ^

Seems like the OSU pass offense is very good, the Michigan run offense is very good, both teams have been good against the run overall, both have been decent to good against the pass overall. 

So like last year - who will score more points? Michigan's pounding ball control run offense of unstoppability or OSU's death star of laser cannon pass offense only with like 7 lasers instead of one death star laser.

Last year it seemed like we had the pass rush, corners, and offensive success to supress OSU just enough to strangle them out in the 4th quarter and pull away. Expecting this year to be a dogfight to the end.

Vasav

November 1st, 2022 at 2:16 PM ^

Ohio will throw, Michigan will run, it will be fun and closer than last year. And the real championship is the mgofriends we made along the way

Vasav

November 1st, 2022 at 3:35 PM ^

I will fully admit that i will irrationally like you a lot less in late November. And then either be somewhat understanding of your grief while sadistically delighting in it, or I will like you A LOT less in early December. It'll be all good by NYE tho.

BlueinLansing

November 1st, 2022 at 2:22 PM ^

I saw the MSU game, OSU toyed with them it was pathetic.

 

If we can run the ball against OSU we can win, but we'll need a precise passing game to do so and probably a turnover or two.

Ohio State is very good, if deeply flawed on defense.  We can win down there it will just be very hard.