I know it is cliche but I thought I had heard the staff cooled on him.
Yes. This was just reported yesterday since we got Mario.
I don’t think that is too far fetched. He and the Pollard kid (the other one) were widely considered to be on commit watch when they took their early June visits. Neither did.
This was the staff’s first time to see them in person, and as we now know from the Finkley situation different measurables can shift where a prospect fits in this defensive scheme and thus where they slot in the pecking order of priority. If both Pollard and Schwartz came in looking more like an EDGE than a LB or DL respectively this would affect how hard the staff would look to close on them.
At this point, I am much more concerned with landing a proven LB prospect and actually closing one of the 4* safety “leans” than DL.
FWIW... some think Pollard is a silent commit ready to announce. If that happens then, yes...we're out of room in that spot Aidan Hutchinson is playing.
All of these guys ARE LBs.
I refuse to count edge players as LBs no matter what they are called.
M is looking for WDE sized players for the position - do you consider Hutchinson a LB? He will be playing edge / “OLB” in this system based on everything I have seen.
I don't care what you call them...but if they're playing OLB, you can't add them to the DL recruiting, lol.
So you're saying we play a 5-2 instead of a 3-4? That's fine...but if that's what you're going with the DL recruit still sucks at the moment because you have 3 DTs in your formation and we have one guy committed and he's the 3rd lowest ranked player in the class.
Either way, DL recruiting needs to get better. Sign Nolan and that obviously changes.
MY PROJECTED DEPTH CHART
QB: Cade McNamara
2. J.J. McCarthy / Alan Bowman
4. Dan Villari
RB: Hassan Haskins
2. Blake Corum
3. Donovan Edwards
4. Tavierre Dunlap
5. Lucas Andrighetto
WR: Ronnie Bell
2. Roman Wilson / Andrel Anthony
WR: Cornelius Johnson
2. Daylen Baldwin
3. Cristian Dixon
SLOT: Mike Sainristil
2. A.J. Henning
TE: Erick All
2. Luke Schoonmaker / Louis Hansen
4. Matthew Hibner
5. Carter Selzer
LT: Ryan Hayes
2. Karsen Barnhart
*3. Trevor Keegan
3. Jeffrey Persi
4. Tristan Bounds
LG: Trevor Keegan
2. Chuck Filiaga
3. Nolan Rumler
4. Raheem Anderson
C: Zak Zinter
2. Andrew Vastardis
3. Reece Atteberry
4. Greg Crippen
5. Raheem Anderson
RG: Andrew Stueber
*2. Zak Zinter
2. Joel Honigford / Nolan Rumler
4. Greg Crippen
5. Griffin Korican
RT: Karsen Barnhart
*2. Andrew Stueber
2. Trente Jones
3. Joel Honigford
4. Giovanni El-Hadi
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
DT: Donovan Jeter
2. Jess Speight
3. Kris Jenkins
4. Rayshaun Benny
NT: Mazi Smith
*2. Donovan Jeter
2. Jordan Whittley / Joey George
4. Jack Stewart
5. Ike Iwunnah
DT: Christopher Hinton
2. Julius Welschof
3. Gabe Newburg
4. George Rooks
5. Dominick Guidice
EDGE: Aidan Hutchinson
2. Taylor Upshaw
3. Mike Morris / Braiden McGregor
5. TJ Guy
ILB: Josh Ross
2. Nikhai Hill-Green / Junior Colson
4. Kalel Mullings
5. Anthony Solomon / Joey Velasquez
ILB: Michael Barrett
2. Nikhai Hill-Green / Junior Colson
4. Kalel Mullings
5. Anthony Solomon / Joey Velasquez
OLB: David Ojabo
2. Taylor Upshaw
3. Jaylen Harrell
4. Kechaun Bennett / Tyler McLaurin
CB: Gemon Green
2. DJ Turner
3. Jalen Perry
4. Andre Seldon
5. Darion Green-Warren
6. Ja'Den McBurrows / German Green
CB: Vincent Gray
2. DJ Turner
3. Jalen Perry
4. Andre Seldon
5. Darion Green-Warren
6. Ja'Den McBurrows / German Green
*NB: Andre Seldon / Daxton Hill
*3. DJ Turner
*4. Eamonn Dennis
*5. George Johnson
FS: Daxton Hill
2. RJ Moten
3. Rod Moore
4. Sammy Faustin
SS: Brad Hawkins
2. Makari Paige
3. Quinten Johnson
4. Jordan Morant
K: Jake Moody
P: Brad Robbins
2. Tommy Doman
We completely whiffed at NG/DT this offseason. We should have 2 more guys outside of Whittley (who may not play much).
If we had a true top 10 QB, two more DTs that would be honorable B1G or better...and Ambry Thomas.
This team could challenge for a NY6 Bowl. Maybe even an upset in late November and a birth to Indy.
Put upperclassman Chad Henne, Mike Martin, Gabe Watson and Ambry Thomas on this team and it goes from 7 wins to 10 of 11 wins.
The combination of recruiting Rayshaun Benny, George Rooks, Ikechukwu Iwunnah plus Whittley in the portal is a complete whiff? Come on.
Yup, was confirmed by Steve Lorenz last week that the staff cooled on him after in person evaluations. Concerns about fit within the scheme. A little differently from Finkley since he was still an absolute take but shows you that the target board is continuing to move as more in person workouts happen.
Could be another Finkley situation. Not sure how accurate his weight is at 244. Still seems odd because DL recruiting was/is, by all accounts, going well.
Honestly, I am much more concerned about the OL at this point but Moore has proven his recruiting chops.
yeah agreed, the OL still has some work to do this cycle. It looks pretty much a done deal we'll lose our top tackle prospect Fitzpatrick to OSU. Another CB came in today for OSU with a confidence level of 9 (100% balled to OSU).
Like you said, Moore is an excellent recruiter and we're still in play for Conerly (not betting on it, but punchers chance), and the interior kid from Seattle as well. Outside of that, it doesn't look like we've got much going on with the prospects that are holding a UM offer.
If I'm a '22 kid, I will say the depth chart looks pretty daunting. But still, I think in general you want to pick up at minimum 4 OL in every cycle. As we've seen how quickly depth charts can deteriorate in modern college football.
The 247 guys on the Michigan Recruiting Insider this week were saying that Deone Walker is likely another Rayshaun Benny type who can play DL or OL and may actually project better long term as an OL, so if we get him, there's some flexibility
That's it, he was shorter and lighter when he showed up for his workout.
So you're saying the staff found him too Schwart to be an edge guy?
DL recruit is pretty awful right now.
You're calling guys DEs, but they'll be LBs at Michigan.
All of these Edge guys are stand up, Matt Judon, OLB types.
Including Schwartz.
I was always under the impression that Schwartz was more of a build a bear DT.
This is going to be a weird year as guys get re-evaluated. I assume Deone Walker and another large human we don’t even know yet will nail it all down.
Use the Schwartz!
Yogurt!
How bout ya don't, ladies and gentlemen Scotty don't.
It sounds like he may no longer be a take for Michigan. Best of luck to him
Sucks... I liked him and thought he was gonna grow into a monster like his father.
Oooooh please don’t tell me his dad is teen wolf!
Sucks... I liked him and thought he was gonna grow into a monster like his father.
I don't know I would say recruiting is having a "rough patch" - we just landed 4 prospects in the last 10 days, two of which at least had legit Bama offers. We've offered what, like 300 prospects and change? So things like this are going to happen every cycle.
I think Schwartz was definitely a take for the staff, and he was very high on Michigan. It is kind of becoming a noticeable trend, I will say that defensive line recruiting has had some peculiar hiccups as of late (Phillips, Finkley, now Shwartz, not to mentioned the Benny saga in the 2021 class).
I'm definitely not trying to pile on Nua, but (this is going to come off as piling on Nua) it seems like at pretty much every other position group the recruiting board is pretty well defined and we have a pretty successful close rate. Defensive line, on the other hand is all over the place. We're leading for guys for months and then out of the blue they commit to another program or we don't make a final list ,etc, etc.
It could be just a weird aberration, or it could have entirely nothing to do with Coach Nua. It does make you wonder though why one specific position group is an outlier from the rest in terms of recruiting coherence.
As stated above, pretty sure it has been reported (others in thread seem to confirm) the staff cooled on him. Finkley had a disagreement over position. Phillips was a disappointment no doubt but the Benny saga? You mean winning a critical recruitment? It sounds exactly like you are trying to pile on Nua.
No, I really am not trying to pile on him. I don't think he's been given enough time or recruiting autonomy to fairly evaluate his impact on recruiting I mentioned Benny's recruitment simply because he was considered a heavy Michigan lean up until the point he committed to MSU.. the staff had to put in a lot of work to change his mind, and kudos to them they did.
I read about the Finkley disagreement, as it was reported, but some analysts (i.e. Sam Webb) were also curious why a guy like Finkley wouldn't just be a take regardless of where he wants to play and you sort it out later once he's on campus.
The Schwartz situation is more understandable after reading the comments above, which makes complete sense and doesn't really apply at all to my comment given the context. So that would be a bad example on my part.
Again, these examples could all be things unrelated to Nua so I don't want to make an unfair assertion that he is the crux of any recruiting breakdowns.. at the same time, as best as I can recall, he hasn't necessarily won any major recruiting battles, gotten much praise in prospect interviews, or made in roads with any specific HS programs or prospects.
That's not to say he is a recruiting headwind, just that the jury is still out on what his impact is on the recruiting trail, and he should be given another cycle or two to demonstrate it.
I also think the new defensive scheme has caused more re-shuffling of the board than usual. Nua and staff are having to build new relationships to fit the new scheme, while also having to give the firm handshake to those like Schwartz that may no longer be a fit. Having said that, it does seem the Coach Osborne’s name gets mentioned a whole lot more than Nua by d-line recruits, so Nua’s eventual replacement may already be on staff.
Benny was always a M lean but MSU was a close second. He apparently was close to committing to Michigan until he saw MSU embarrass Michigan in AA - an emotional decision?.. maybe, but a surprise? Not really.
“I read about the Finkley disagreement, as it was reported, but some analysts (i.e. Sam Webb) were also curious why a guy like Finkley wouldn't just be a take regardless of where he wants to play and you sort it out later once he's on campus.”
Unless you are exclusively against the “another transfer…ugh” crowd then I don’t know how you say this. We can’t waste two years of a scholarship on a kid that is just going to leave when he is disappointed about his role. The coaches were honest. That’s NOT a miss.
We can’t waste two years of a scholarship on a kid that is just going to leave when he is disappointed about his role.
That's also complete conjecture. It's impossible to know who is going to transfer and why two years from now. What was implied based on Sam's comments was that the coaches let Finkley know they don't want him as an Edge, and that is the position he wants to play so Michigan was subsequently dropped from his list.
There is nuance in how you present your projection for a prospect's fit on your roster: "we are not recruiting you to play Edge here, but we like you at DE" can effectively mean the same thing as "we'll give you the opportunity to play whatever position you want along the defensive line, if Edge doesn't work out would you consider moving over to SDE?" Based purely on interpreting the 24/7 staff's comments, it sounds like the former was the conversation the staff had with Finkley.
Really though, my point was that the last two cycles of defensive line recruiting have been a little head scratching. That may have entirely nothing to do with Nua as I've said all along, but I also don't think it's irrational to point out the fact he hasn't really produced any recruiting buzz during his time here at the position group he coaches; aside from flipping Iwunnah, which by all accounts was his doing. I'm not writing the guy off, just simply stating recruiting at his position group has been less coherent than the other groups in my opinion.
While it's true we haven't landed any top DL targets yet this cycle, the previous era of Nua Criticism should have ended when he finished last year's class with a truly impressive bang, flipping *three* much-needed defensive linemen who all appeared ticketed for other programs. Not saying the guy is above criticism, but his performance last cycle should close the book on the questions we had about him during Don Brown's tenure, a period during which the entire defense got weirder and weirder about its approach to the line
I guess maybe the Schwartz will be with Nebraska?
Until he hits the transfer portal at least ...
One has to think that this is a good sign for us going after some higher priority targets... or at least that's my optimistic take
I think you're correct on this one. His stock has been plummeting for months now.
If a guy is choosing a trash program like Nebraska I’m not too worried about missing out.
We are with Texas, like one tier above Nebraska right now. We have no room to talk.
Oh c’mon don’t be ridiculous. We can absolutely still talk shit about Nebraska.
"DL recruiting having a rough patch."
My favorite line of the day.
Wile E. had a rough patch. We are in a full on drought.
Nua unleashed?