Dhani tackles the globe season 2
Don't forget about Dhani tackles the globe season 2 starting Monday. He is one of my favorite Michigan players and I really enjoyed watching season 1. http://www.travelchannel.com//TV_Shows/Dhani_Jones/Video/Dhani_Jones_Re…
His criticism of the program does nothing to help us. He could have phrased his comments differently and still have gotten his point across.
April 18th, 2010 at 12:53 PM ^
If a guy speaks out and SAYS something bad about Rodriguez/the football program, our response is "Fuck him"...
...but if a coach comes in and incurs MAJOR VIOLATIONS while going 8-16, a former Michigan player can't say "I have a problem with this guy."
Some of you (and you're not the only one, Buccaneer_9) are hilariously moronic sometimes.
A traffic jam when you're already late
A no-smoking sign on your cigarette break
It's like ten thousand spoons when all you need is a knife
It's meeting the man of my dreams
And then meeting his beautiful wife
And isn't it ironic...don't you think
A little too ironic...and, yeah, I really do think...
Sorry, but I think that by using MAJOR VIOLATIONS in that way you're lowering yourself to the level of Pat Caputo, Drew Sharp, numerous Sparties, and all the other people who are either unwilling or unable to do any deep analysis of the transgressions.
Certainly there's no doubt that some rules were broken. At best RichRod is looking like someone who's in a bit over his head. (I think that's a possibility.) Is it not true, though, that a bunch of other places practically admitted to doing the same thing or at least refused to make a big deal out of it? (I'm thinking of Tressel here.)
MAJOR, on the part of the NCAA, is somewhat arbitrary here. I don't think what UM did was "major" in spirit.
---
Anyway, of course Dhani can air his views on Michigan football. My expectations of him are pretty high, though, based on his body of work. He's the type of person who should be able to see the elephant(s) in the living room (specifically, Threet, Sheridan, and a substandard upperclass talent pool). *YES*, maybe Lloyd would have coaxed a few more wins out of that team. Fine. To hear some (including Dhani) tell it, though, a failure to get to 8/9 in '08 was, yes, UNACCEPTABLE!!!
One of Brian's posts on the allegations outlined them as "major violations." Regardless of whether you think it was a big deal or not, "major violations" is an accurate description. I'm not being a Drew Sharp or Pat Caputo at all.
You can poo poo the allegations all you want; that doesn't change the fact that the NCAA could drop the hammer on us before the 2010 season.
...the series and watching it. It's an entertaining show: Dhani displays a winning personality, you actually learn something about other countries, sports and cultures (especially the food and drink), and it's fun to see how he ends up doing at these sports.
Besides, it features a Michigan athlete in a flattering light and that reflects well on the school and program, his comments on Rome is Burning notwithstanding.
I would watch if he just didn't bash the program this last week.
April 18th, 2010 at 11:22 AM ^
He has a clever, engaging personality, and is usually a walkiing advertisement for how attending the University of Michigan can help one succeed both on and off the field. But his criticism of RR was grossly inappropriate.
I guess I'll just have to take the good with the bad.
lol -
what's even funnier is that people that claim to have such a vast amount of knowledge about Michigan football in general are too ignorant to see that going public with negative opinions of the head coach hurts the PLAYERS and the PROGRAM. can you honestly disagree with that? honestly. for example, tell me how talking shit about Michigan's head coach whether you're right or wrong helps recruiting.
if you have an issue with Michigan's head coach you take it up at the source. go talk to the AD if you want, but do not hurt the program by furthering the negative publicity Michigan is receiving.
I never said it helps the program. I'm not applauding him (or Morgan Trent, or Braylon Edwards, or whoever else) for speaking out in the media.
But who's hurt the program more?
Person A: incurred major violations, lost a shit-ton of games
Person B: spoke out in public and said "I don't like what Person A is doing"
Yet our response to Person A is "I hope he gets it turned around! Who says he doesn't recruit character?!?!"
Our response to person B is "Fuck him."
tell me how talking shit about Michigan's head coach whether you're right or wrong helps recruiting.
Because if Dhani thinks he's a shitty coach, who's a cheater (I'm not saying he does, it's an "if"), then speaking out about it DOES help the program - it would rid the program of a guy Jones thinks is BAD for the program. See how completely fucking simple it is?
Whether I agree with it or not, Jones is entitled to his opinion, and I think it's absurd that people who have never once been associated to the program can question his loyalty, intentions, or knowledge of it.
"See how completely fucking simple it is?"
ha, i thought Dave Brandon makes the choices at Michigan. if i was a former player i damn sure wouldnt allow my personal negative opinions of a coach be spun in the media.
i would go to Dave Brandon, i would talk to Lloyd Carr, etc, etc. you solve problems at their source. its just my opinion that its best to keep things like that in house. why would we give free reign to Rome and other various media outlets to spin negative stories about Michigan?
youll notice i didnt mention Dhani's name in any of my posts. ive not read his comments yet. for all i know he could have been respectful of RR in the process. im speaking in general terms.
also, you will not find in any of my posts saying a former player isnt entitled to an opinion. im just questioning the way in which certain people go about making their opinions. ill tell you what, if i truly have a problem with Michigan's head coach im talking to someone affiliated with UofM, not Skip Bayless.
He did not go on Rome to bash Rodriguez, he went on Rome to promote his television show. People are reacting to two sentences of a 15 minutes intervew. He answered a question he was asked - he didn't run to the media to voice his displeasure.
Seriously, what's wrong with this:
Rome asked Jones, “What do you think about the program and the job Rodriguez is doing?”
“Up to this point it really hasn’t been that good of a job at all,” Jones said. “But then you have to look at the perspective of how long it takes for a class to change over to be his class. There’s a lot of different things, but as a Michigan man you expect things to be changed in an instant. Sometimes you have to have a little bit more patience.
“Two years, my patience are running a bit thin. So next year it’s going to be really a qualifying or disqualifying year for his ability as a coach to get the program in the right direction. And I don’t think many people will stand for it if he doesn’t do a good job next year.”
i was speaking in general terms when i referenced Jim Rome. Dhani's remarks were just fine imo.
my issue is not whether former players have the right to speak out regarding the program, my issue is the process in which they go about it.
i dont deny that you make good points. RR IS deserving of criticism. what i do believe is that RR is doing the best he can whether Michigan is having success or not, and he better get things turned around or he's gone. on the other hand former players are not doing the best they can by calling the head coach out publicly.
"what i do believe is that RR is doing the best he can whether Michigan is having success or not"
If those extra efforts result in a loss of scholarships, forfeited games, a ban from postseason play, etc., is that really doing "the best he can"?
Now you are dealing in silly hypotheticals. These alleged violations are not a big deal. This is not a USC situation. The idea that we could end up vacating games or being banned from the postseason over guys practing too much over the summer is more than a little farfetched.
a) You have no idea what the NCAA might do to USC or Michigan.
b) I noticed that you left out "losing scholarships", since that is likely the most realistic sanction of the list that I proposed.
So I'll ask again, since you're choosing to avoid the point:
Is losing scholarhips due to sanctions "the best Rodriguez can do"?
Actually, I can tell you with a high degree of confidence that the only possible penalty we could receive from that list is a lost scholarship or two, but I don't even think that's likely. More likely, we'll be docked a couple of recruiting visits. This is not a huge deal to the NCAA.
Yes, it's entirely possible to do your best and still get in trouble with the NCAA. RR isn't the first. On at least two occasions, Lloyd Carr played an ineligible player (Marcus Ray in 1998 and Artis Chambers in 2007). The Chambers case probably was just a paperwork error, but Ray took money from an agent. We were fortunate that we opened the 1998 season with back-to-back losses, or else we probably would have vacated them as Ray was ruled ineligible.
And of course, Charles Woodson most likely forfeited his eligibility in December 1997, when he accepted gifts from an agent, but Carr played him in the Rose Bowl anyway. How we avoided an NCAA investigation over that - coming just a few months after the Ed Martin investigation, no less - I've never understood. We dodged a bullet there. The NCAA's selective enforcement of its own rules worked to Lloyd's advantage. Not so much with RR, unfortunately. None of it changes my view of Carr and Rodriguez; I think they're both excellent people. You run a big-time program, you're going to break the rules sometimes.
I'd say losing a scholarship or two is kind of a big deal. Not only is it bad for what goes on on the field, but it's a huge negative when it comes to public perception.
So who do you think will have done more harm to the program - Dhani Jones, whose comments have probably been ignored by everyone who doesn't live and breathe Michigan football? Or Rich Rodriguez, who's dealing with a public firestorm and who, if those scholarship reductions do come to fruition, will have to deal with national media repeating over and over again that the program has suffered a loss of scholarships?
Yeah...sorry...I'm worried a wee bit more about Rodriguez's actions than Jones's.
Jones is a smart, friendly, funny guy. I had the privelege of dealing with him several times in my time at Michigan. I disagree with his assesment of Rodriguez, but that doesn't change what he contributed to the team, and the school in his time at Michigan. Whatever he says or does, his intention, no matter our opinion, is to help the school. At this point, we should all remember that Jones has contributed more to Michigan's football program than Rodriguez has, and keep that in mind when we're ready to excommunicate somone from the Michigan family.
With most of that. I'm not sure that Dhani Jones has contributed more to Michigan Football than Rodriguez has. Can you elaborate?
1. He won.
2. He didn't get us sanctioned.
Those are kind of apples/oranges points, aren't they? I mean really, put Dhani on the 2009 team and Obi Ezeh on the 1997 team, and how much better/worse does each team get? Dhani was a very good player, but he was also fortunate to play when he did. Brandon Graham and Donovan Warren were good enough to have played on the '97 team if they'd been around then, but didn't get the chance.
As for #2, well, we're kind of fortunate that the NCAA is very selective in its investigations/enforcement of rules. Who knows if Dhani did everything by the rules? One of his teammates (Woodson) may well have compromised his eligibility prior to the '98 Rose Bowl, but the NCAA chose not to pursue it. (A second teammate, Marcus Ray, also compromised his eligibility the following year, and this time the NCAA did go after him.)
I don't understand how what Woodson or Ray did reflects on Jones.
My point is this: Jones "contributed" to Michigan's football tradition by being one of the best players on our best defense, starting on teams that one at least a share of 3 Big 10 titles, and did so with high levels of community involvement and high academic performance.
Rodriguez has coached 2 of our poorest teams in history, and has put us on the doorstep of our first NCAA sanctions.
Now, I'm not dim enough to not see the extenuating circumstances in their respective situations, which is why I don't want Rodriguez fired at this point.
That being said, if this is some sort of "Michigan Man" contest, or some sort of question of "who is loyal to Michigan", I know who my money is on.
We're not sanctioned yet.
and RR answers to Dave Brandon and Michigan will have to answer to the NCAA when that time comes. nobody is denying the obvious mistakes by RR. believe me, ive been very upset with RR and staff for letting these infractions occur under their watch. RR is on an even shorter leash as a result.
what i dont like is seeing former players add fuel to the fire. lets not forget that people were calling out RR since day 1, it wasnt as if it just started after the NCAA mess. RR needs to do a much better job in obvious areas, and former players need to watch their mouths in public, end of discussion imo.
...which is why the disproportionate reactions confuse me.
Anyway, I think we're both on the same page now (as well as chitownblue2).
i think that we always were, Mag.
unfortunately, the only thing that will stop others from going back and forth on the matter is Michigan winning again. like you and everyone else on these boards i hope the wins come sooner than later.
Now John, you see that foundation? There's termites living there.
And they live there every day. And you don't see em' until you start losing a little bit.
And when you lose, they'll start crawling out. Now what we'll do is, when they crawl out,
we'll get their names, and remember their faces. And when we start winning again
we'll know who we can trust.
-Bo Schembechler
Season 1 was funt to watch and this is worth a DVR slot.
As for Dhani on Rome his appearances IMO have done more good then harm to Michigan.
As to his most recent comments regarding RR it is difficult to argue that the new system and the attrition that came along with it cost Michigan two winning seasons.
Besides, I'm not too big on his show. He comes off as a jerk and is kinda disrespectful to others' cultures at times.
April 18th, 2010 at 11:10 PM ^
I'll probably be in the background of the Iceland episode. He was a very nice guy and didn't seem to care that I fouled up one of the scenes when I recognized him walking down the street.
Is a great fucking picture.