Are scholarship limits still relevant?
Sorry if this has been addressed in other posts. This site has broadly hinted that NIL makes the 85 limit irrelevant. However, on other sites they still are counting scholarships, as we always have in the past, to get to the magic 85.
As I understand it, the 85 limit was devised so that big wealthy schools would not have an advantage over less affluent ones. NIL has unleashed the Big Dogs, so the policy underpinning the scholly limit is no longer relevant. Is there any official source that confirms this?
December 20th, 2022 at 5:46 PM ^
Theres no “official” source confirming this because it’s not a practice any “official” source wants to encourage. It’s a loophole around the current rules structure that they really can’t do anything about in the current landscape.
But yes. The 85 “limit” is still in place. Michigan isn’t going to carry more than 85 scholarship players. But some players who would normally be on scholarship are going to be paying their own way as “walk-ons” with NIL deals.
Technically speaking, this has always been allowed. There are just not many instances prior to NIL where a player is going to dish out the $40k+ in tuition money to help the program out.
December 20th, 2022 at 5:48 PM ^
BYU had a NIL deal for some walkons, so yeah, scholarship limits don't mean a thing. The 85 scholarship limit is still in place, but it doesn't make a difference.
* Just looked it up. It was a NIL deal for all players, including paying the tuition for all walk-ons.*
December 20th, 2022 at 5:48 PM ^
lol, did it ever matter?
December 20th, 2022 at 7:17 PM ^
It made sense, and it was supposed to create more balance, but somehow the opposite happened. Follow the money.
December 20th, 2022 at 10:16 PM ^
Not sure the opposite happened. It just didn't change much. Early to mid 70s were dominated by a few team - Oklahoma, Nebraska, Alabama and SC. In the Big 10, it was the Bo and Woody years, aka the Big 2 and Little 8. Limit to 95 scholarship players went into effect in 1978 and was lowered to 85 in 1992.
December 22nd, 2022 at 8:54 AM ^
Back in the 80's-90's, going into most years there were pretty wide open discussions about who could win the title. Usually, 3 teams from FL were relevant, Nebraska with their shit schedule and shit conference would often go 11-0, a stronger Pac 12, a stronger Penn State. Lots of surprise National Champions: UM, ND, Washington, Tennessee, Colorado, Georgia Tech, BYU (holds nose). By the time the of 2000-teens, there were essentially 4-5 teams completely dominating the talent pool, something backed up by aggregate recruiting rankings. This is what the scholarship limit was supposed to unwind, and it clearly didn't .
Now, in fairness, you could blame most of that on Alabama and whatever deal with the devil Nick Satan signed in his blood or bile. Maybe this was the perfect storm of a great coach, who was/is morally compromised, going to a Univ. with all the bagmen you could ever want, right in the middle of a talent-rich region. In truth, if you pull Alabama out of the calculus for the last 15 years, things do look a lot different. But the talent, per rating services, is highly concentrated among about 5 teams. This is why, apparently according to experts, all UM beatdowns of OSU are flukes- there's just such a talent disparity.
December 21st, 2022 at 12:38 AM ^
I believe it was mostly to help the group of 5 type schools. If all the power 5 type schools hoarded large numbers of plyers it would have left little for the CMUs and Westerns.
December 21st, 2022 at 6:29 AM ^
It was about Title IX most of all, since there is no women’s football.
December 20th, 2022 at 5:50 PM ^
Aren’t walk-ons not allowed to partake in certain privileges? I don’t think it’s completely meaningless.
December 20th, 2022 at 5:56 PM ^
They’re allowed everything a scholarship athlete is with the exception of financial aid.
December 20th, 2022 at 5:59 PM ^
It's not meaningless, and players don't see it as meaningless. They see it as their level of priority for a program.
December 20th, 2022 at 6:17 PM ^
Training dinner table (meals) are not for walk-ons last I heard but Bo told me that one.
December 21st, 2022 at 12:44 AM ^
You'd think that they'd find a way to get the walk-ons access to the training table and dieticians. Good for the team and for the health of the walk-ons going through the physical strain/damage of college football.
December 21st, 2022 at 5:07 AM ^
Tickets for games are for scholarship players only. This isn't a big deal, but it's a benefit.
December 20th, 2022 at 6:17 PM ^
There is no NCAA rule limiting walk-on athletes' privileges. The only limitations are set by the team/school themselves.
December 22nd, 2022 at 8:56 AM ^
Not true, walk-ons can't grab free condoms from the fish-bowl in the atrium. They have to go to the health center like all the other students, or pull out, like OSU players.
December 21st, 2022 at 8:53 AM ^
Walk-ons don’t get coffee
December 20th, 2022 at 5:51 PM ^
I think the point is that you could walk on and get a $1M NIL deal and just "pay your own" tuition. So scholarships are no longer meaningful in the way they were pre-NIL.
December 20th, 2022 at 8:51 PM ^
Hasn't Harbaugh been saying the players who prove themselves get NIL money? At least that's what I think I've been hearing here. That doesn't jive with upfront money.
I'm not so sure the number of scholarships doesn't matter anymore.
I don't pay as much attention as a lot of you do here so I may be wrong.
December 20th, 2022 at 9:30 PM ^
It’s not “up front” money though. Athletic scholarships are year by year. Everyone on scholarship has to re-sign for their scholarship every year, so we’re talking someone like Blake Corum giving up his scholarship this season and using his huge NIL income to pay his tuition with “walk-on” status.
December 20th, 2022 at 5:51 PM ^
No 85 scholarship limits were put in place because the NCAA's job is to make money for their member schools and limiting scholarships puts a cap on how much the schools need to spend for the "talent".
December 20th, 2022 at 9:19 PM ^
Scholarship limits were put in place to prevent wealthier programs from stockpiling players (many of whom would never see the field) just to keep them away from their rivals.
Of course tuition was a lot cheaper in the old days, but the numbers were staggering. As an example, the Texas A&M program Bear Bryant took over (in 1954) had a Freshman team of 150 of many of the best talent money could buy, so he could afford to run off a few players his first year.
December 20th, 2022 at 5:53 PM ^
There used to be rules on what benefits schools could provide for walk-ons. Those rules created problems of their own so I think they were largely eliminated so if the walk-on is getting NIL for tuition and school expenses then there probably isn't a difference and the scholarship limits have less meaning than they used to.
December 20th, 2022 at 5:55 PM ^
Nope. It’s Thunderdome out here… anything goes.
December 20th, 2022 at 6:20 PM ^
The walk-on who can pay his or her own tuition has been allowed for decades. This is why fans speculate that Jace and Jett Howard could have their parents pay their tuition and open up two scholarships
December 20th, 2022 at 6:25 PM ^
NIL only makes the scholarship limit irrelevant if a player is comfortable enough with his financial situation (including NIL) to attend Michigan and spend that tuition out of pocket. If a star player has to pay $30,000 to attend Michigan but is only making $10,000 in NIL money, the scholarship still means a whole hell of a lot.
If a player is making $2 million in NIL, spending $30,000 to go to school might not be that big of a deal.
So I think it's relevant. But it's not as important as what it used to be.
December 21st, 2022 at 12:44 AM ^
I think my line of thinking is that now an outside party could just foot the bill for the scholarship with the agreement that it’s part of an NIL package.
lets say Insanely rich booster wants to donate like $250k a year and turn it into 4-5 extra scholarships, could he just write the tuition check?
December 20th, 2022 at 6:29 PM ^
Obviously, scholarship limits are no longer in play with NIL. So the next question is are overall roster limits still relevant? IIRC, the NCAA relaxed some limits through next year due to COVID. I think the limit is 125 now.
December 20th, 2022 at 6:38 PM ^
unpopular opinion:
Of course the 85 limit matters
it would only not matter if a player got enough money to cover the full value of a scholarship
Does anyone have proof of a player not taking a scholarship and getting paid via NIL to cover the cost?
December 20th, 2022 at 9:37 PM ^
I don’t think anyone has “proof” of that because that’s not something that gets publicized. I believe of the main page writers on the blog wrote a few days ago that Michigan carried 88 “scholarship” players this year for example and the depth chart by class located in the “useful stuff” tab shows 88 as well.
December 20th, 2022 at 6:43 PM ^
The NCAA is only limiting two things these days: stretching and cream cheese.
December 20th, 2022 at 8:15 PM ^
Stretching the truth
December 20th, 2022 at 9:40 PM ^
About as relevant as the 5 second rule, saying bless you after someone sneezes, the Easter Bunny, or the NCAA rule book..
December 20th, 2022 at 10:14 PM ^
No NCAA rules are relevant. They are arbitrary. No more penalties. Major networks will decide team schedules. No Bowls just playoffs with games decided on style alone as points are unfair. The activity will evolve to just an hour of remote viewing only; no fan attendance. Immediate gratification will be assured. People will become invertebrates.
Just a thought.