December 8th, 2019 at 6:20 AM ^
He'll do well there. They'll be back to challenging Clemson in 2 years.
December 8th, 2019 at 9:25 AM ^
That's why coaches get fired so quickly these days.
Norvell is a good coach, but Clemson has a great staff, a far superior roster, a far superior recruiting class and it will take a miracle for FSU to be challenging them in two years.
December 8th, 2019 at 9:35 AM ^
Norvell is a good coach, but Clemson has a great staff, a far superior roster, a far superior recruiting class and it will take a miracle for FSU to be challenging them in two years.
I think FSU's roster is not that far away. With the right coach and QB I think they can do well fairly quickly and this is early enough to have an impact on the 2020 class. They'll obviously have to back to top 10 classes, but a new HC usually gives hope and FSU won't have any trouble recruiting with a new coach in year one. If they have a decent year in 2020, they'll be just fine. Here are the rankings of their last 4 recruiting classes:
2017: #6
2018: #11
2019: #19
2020: #22
Team Talent Composite: #6
December 8th, 2019 at 10:41 AM ^
But fine, as the first poster made clear and all the dumb commercials remind, doesn't beat Clemson. I live in Tallahassee and want a good football team to keep the economy humming, but if FSU is beating Clemson in two years I will eat my hat.
December 8th, 2019 at 11:07 AM ^
"this is early enough." Isn't the early signing day in a week or so? He'll also need to hire assistant coaches before recruits will commit. Most of the top rated prospects have already committed, at least verbally, and the tendency so far has been for most teams to sign most of their class during the early signing period.
EDIT: Since no one responded with the actual dates I looked it up. The early signing period is December 18-20. Ten days isn't much time to persuade a kid to change his mind about something he has considered for several years.
December 8th, 2019 at 12:05 PM ^
The problem for FSU is that they've had ,massive issues on the offensive line and at QB, and they have something like 3 4* linemen over those 4 years. They have oodles of highly-rated secondary players and WRs/RBs but if you can't stop the other guy from smashing you to bits it doesn't help a ton.
December 8th, 2019 at 10:29 AM ^
Yep. There is a reason you want to work to build a program instead of constantly cycling through coaches.
December 8th, 2019 at 6:49 AM ^
Good hire. Up and comer who has proven he can compete with less talent
December 8th, 2019 at 7:37 AM ^
Thanks for the link.
December 8th, 2019 at 7:37 AM ^
Thanks for the link.
December 8th, 2019 at 7:02 AM ^
Did he do well at Memphis because Justin Fuente kind of built that program up (19-6 last two seasons)?
Not trying to be a jerk, I don't know much about the guy but he didn't necessarily rebuild Memphis, they were already decent. Looks like they averaged 9 wins a year with 12 wins this season so his stock won't be higher.
The rest of the ACC sucks so maybe by default he'll be top 3 if ND is being counted.
December 8th, 2019 at 9:11 AM ^
You never know about who was most responsible for his Memphis success, but he had a pretty potent offense when he was OC at Arizona State, and he's pretty well respected in coaching circles.
December 8th, 2019 at 9:20 AM ^
Agree here, I’m often surprised at the amount of knowledge some of our posters have respectful to coaches and their tenures. Also, the comment on the ACC is spot on
December 8th, 2019 at 10:34 AM ^
Justin Fuente built it but Norvell elevated it. That's why this is a good hire IMO.
December 8th, 2019 at 8:02 AM ^
Surprised he didn’t hold out for the MSU job.
December 8th, 2019 at 9:22 AM ^
That was never a committable offer as staee is deciding between urbz and satan coming home.
December 8th, 2019 at 8:12 AM ^
My only question is can he recruit well enough to compete with Clemson
December 8th, 2019 at 8:17 AM ^
He's a good head coach...but so was Willie Taggart. I'm sure he'll be fine at FSU, but history is littered with guys who come from smaller programs with advantages into situations where the competition jumps up and they struggle. And while FSU has a lot of built-in advantages and the ACC is sorta trash, it also seems like FSU isn't particularly patient and he's still going to have to deal with a bad offensive line situation and question marks at QB.
December 8th, 2019 at 8:28 AM ^
My thoughts, too. Taggart was also an 'up and coming' coach, and will have success somewhere else as the top guy. I'm not sure Norvell has done anything different than Taggart. At least Taggart had actually built a program himself (USF). Norvell inherited a really good team and structure from Fuentes (who is failing at VT).
The difference might be seen with patience. Taggart quit Oregon to go home, and was expected to just roll on with Jimbo Fisher's train. Forget the fact that Fisher's last couple of teams tanked, and his OL recruiting was non-existant. Taggart followed a NC winning coach that very recently had championship caliber teams. Norvell gets to replace a tire fire - he'll get a few years to sort it out.
December 8th, 2019 at 9:07 AM ^
Can somebody explain the Willie love to me. He didn’t really rebuild anything. He’s had 1 double digit win season as a head coach. I remember the Oregon fanbase being happy when he walked and Florida state regretting the hiring almost immediately. He’s very Hoke-ish to me
December 8th, 2019 at 9:13 AM ^
I dunno. I felt like Taggart had a lot of buzz until he had that rhabdo issue at Oregon, which made people question how hard he was being on players. Ever since then I feel like public opinion of him changed, as if people were just looking for reasons to get mad at him or run him out of town.
December 8th, 2019 at 9:45 AM ^
I'm just looking at what he's done as a coach. How his teams look. How Florida St looked. The coaches he chose on his staff.
Can't candy coat it.
December 8th, 2019 at 10:04 AM ^
Taggart built really good teams at USF from nothing. That's where it comes from. He tried to make Oregon a little tougher, and it was working before he left. I don't think what Oregon did this year is much different form what they would have done had he stayed. Cristobal was an assistant that didn't change a lot. He wasn't some guy off the street that cleaned house.
At FSU, Taggart had to clean up the discipline issues Fisher left behind, and he didn't have any OL or QBs with which to do it. His discipline wore very thin with that crowd, quite quickly. He also changed the program culture from traditional SEC pro-style to a more open spread attack - largely without the personnel to do so.
Personally, I think he changed too much, too quickly, to have any success at FSU. If he had been more reasonable about how much change he could accomplish so quickly, I don't think he'd have lost the confidence of the team or fanbase in that flash of time. The program sucked and needed change, but he drove himself out of a job.
December 8th, 2019 at 11:00 AM ^
Good post. You obviously know a little about the situation. But from my vantage here in Tallahassee the program was in such a hole that a wholesale housecleaning looked like the right way to go--and was what he was CHARGED with. But there wasn't the patience to see the thing through.
I don't know if Taggart would have succeeded. And there was a curious disconnect between his persona and the feeling that he wouldn't. Sitting and watching a perfectly pleasant person smile uncomfortably through loss after loss is no picnic, for fans, an administration, and--least of all--an alumni association that was calling most of the shots. In the end it was the peril to a lot of recent investment that brought about Taggart's demise.
The question now is whether Norvell brings more of the same. I think that a newly-chastened admin and higher-ups have realized that challenging for NCs isn't immediately in the cards; I assume his agent is smart enough to demand some kind of half-realistic window of time to work in. A reasonable hope would be that he's beating most everybody but Clemson a couple of years in.
December 8th, 2019 at 12:19 PM ^
He took WKU from 0-12 to back-to-back 7-5 seasons in 3 years; Jeff Brohm certainly owes some of his success to Taggart bringing in the #2 class in CUSA that ultimately formed the backbone of some of his best teams. And then he took USF from 3-9 to 11-2 in 4 years. And he's been blamed way too much for Oregon, which had fallen under Helfrich and Taggart certainly helped them right the ship. Cristobal has been great there, but that's not a diss on Taggart. And FSU was a tire fire when Jimbo slipped away; people forget they only kept their bowl streak alive because they rescheduled some tomato can that was previously cancelled because of a major storm system.
He's not one of the best coaches in the country or anything but FSU seems to regret a ton of things with their coaching searches that aren't a reflection of the coach himself.
December 8th, 2019 at 9:43 AM ^
Who's Mike Norvell?
December 8th, 2019 at 11:50 AM ^
I had the same question until reading through the comments. I was surprised the OP wasn't taken to task, as other OPs about well known recruits to this board have been for providing too little information in the post.
Quirky place this Mgoblog.
December 8th, 2019 at 10:06 AM ^
Never heard of him but whatever keeps Clemson in the playoffs is fine
December 8th, 2019 at 10:22 AM ^
They’re not missing out on the playoffs anytime soon. Their recruiting is as good as it gets now, the ACC is still a dumpster fire, and while FSU certainly has the ability as a program to compete with and beat Clemson, I imagine it’ll take a year or two, optimistically, for Norvell to get things up and running.
December 8th, 2019 at 10:07 AM ^
Franklin got a contract extension at PSU to 2025 by putting rumors out that he could bolt to FSU.
It worked.
December 8th, 2019 at 10:48 AM ^
Whoever was taking over for Fisher was going to be in a rough spot due to Fisher’s questionable recruiting and roster composition. I’m sure Taggert could have made better decisions, but I do feel bad for him as a year and a half isn’t fair. If the coach is getting fired that soon, the AD should be fired as well.
I feel like Norvell could benefit from Taggert getting the roster in a better spot. I don’t know enough about Norvell to know if he’s going to be a good fit or not.
December 9th, 2019 at 1:03 PM ^
Great hire but he’s inheriting a barren landscape on the offensive line that we can empathize with. They will need to dig themselves out for years with how bad it’s become in the trenches for them.