Question about basketball's vacated wins
Was working on my basketball records today and noticed a strange change in the Michigan record books on MGoBlue.
Before, the only things taken away were wins. There were *s next to the losses, but the NCAA-adjusted season record was 0-5 instead of 31-5 for 1992-93.
Now, the 1992-93 season as well as other vacated statistics are completely ignored. The 1992-93 record is listed as 0-0.
Has there been a rule change in the way the NCAA goes about vacating games?
February 9th, 2014 at 7:25 PM ^
Maybe the wins are vacationing
February 9th, 2014 at 7:29 PM ^
February 9th, 2014 at 7:29 PM ^
February 9th, 2014 at 7:30 PM ^
Are you sure there was a change? This came up before and was discussed in this thread. See this post of mine, where I indicate I checked the record book, and it had Michigan's record for 1992-93 as 0-0. Basically, the NCAA vacates wins, but Michigan in this case has vacated the entire season.
February 9th, 2014 at 7:38 PM ^
Both U-M b-ball and OSU football self-imposed and vacated the entire season --- thereby taking losses and wins off the board.
Compare that to the recent PSU sanctions (imposed by the NCAA vs. self-imposed) --- those losses are still on the books.
February 10th, 2014 at 10:37 AM ^
Well, then I propose that we voluntarily vacate the 2008 FB season based upon the allegations and "major" violations associated with stretching-gate. We can even be generous and throw in 2009, so that our bowl streak remains intact,
February 9th, 2014 at 7:46 PM ^
February 9th, 2014 at 9:07 PM ^
I guess we must have imagined all those wins while I was at school...
February 9th, 2014 at 9:43 PM ^
How dare you bring up something negative about The University of Michigan. You must be a troll and need to be banned
- MGoBlog users
February 9th, 2014 at 10:20 PM ^
To be absolutely fair, there is a vast difference between being critical but providing evidence and otherwise being reasonable, which is welcomed here, and being mindlessly negative and simply posting gut reactions to events. The latter typically does not end well except when one is obviously blasted and it is funny. Actually, that rarely ends well too.
February 10th, 2014 at 9:55 AM ^
February 10th, 2014 at 10:07 AM ^
February 9th, 2014 at 10:12 PM ^
Wolverine Devotee I am convinced that if they quietly changed who got credit for an assist in a Michigan basketball game from 1982 you would know it. I don't know how you would know it....but you'd know it.
And you'd know if it was the correct call or not.
February 9th, 2014 at 11:28 PM ^
This has to be new, or a mistake. The records were always 0-however many regular season losses there were. Tournament berths were vacated in their entirety, and I think some of the in-season tournaments were treated differently, too.
February 10th, 2014 at 8:25 AM ^
See my post above, with links to a July 2011 thread when this was discussed before. Michigan has always treated this differently than the NCAA does. The NCAA record book (see page 49) does have only regular season losses vacated, along with most tournament games, wins or losses. But the Michigan record book has always had the seasons in question as 0-0.
It is possible that Michigan has made a mistake with the way they have (always) listed those seasons in their record book. The mgoblue.com page titled History of Michigan Men's Basketball Infractions Case says that the sanctions self-imposed in November 2002 include "Forfeiting all games won while four players were ineligible." Instead, the record book essentially shows entire seasons vacated.
February 10th, 2014 at 12:56 AM ^
Whenever I think about the fab 5 I always get disgusted with the NCAA and how the arbitraly pick who they punish and how hard they punish them.
February 10th, 2014 at 9:29 AM ^
If you're going to create alts, don't pick another rapper.
February 10th, 2014 at 6:27 AM ^
February 10th, 2014 at 10:16 AM ^
February 11th, 2014 at 4:50 AM ^
is will UM self discipline or NCAA imposed violations actually outweigh the nation's infatuation with their accomplishments? This conversation with my son occured on "Super Bowl" Sunday as we were "realtively speaking," watching the game in tremendous comfort down here in Mexico in a bar that has a 1/2 open ceiling, allowing us the luxury of not having to run outside for a smoke break. As the Seahawks were entering the stadium the coach in me came out and I said, "I hate that mfer,Pete) Tressell and all others like him who allow their ego to completely ignore the possible ramifications to the university if their quest for "ultimate performance" at the collegiate level comes to light. And we all have to face the fact that Fisher was as guilty as the two fb coaches, one of whom is going to get a fat pay raise and then other whom the Colts actually gave a non-existent job because he just might see something they could benefit from on the field, not so much "instant replay." I told my son, and this is my belief, that no one should benefit from cheating, and that USC's former AD was an asshole for stating, "Let's be honest, how many schools would not trade places with us and the ten year run we've had no matter the penalties?" ^This was all football talk until he mentioned the "Fab Five." He stated, and this is a young man who 15 years after he played organized ball, "C'mon Dad, taking away what Carrol and Tressel actually accomplished is like trying to wipe out what the Fab Five did as freshmen and sophomores." Further he stated, "Despite the sanctions or the black eye to UM, the nation will never forget the excitement those kids caused in college bb." Damn, that got me thinking. I instantly remembered a quote from a former no.1 draft choice from UM by the name of Jake Long who said, when speaking after a Rose Bowl, "They threw stuff at us we had never seen. We we're completelty unprepared." Further, and this really hurt, I recalled vividly how Tressel, like a chess master,would outcoach Carr, especially his first two years when we had a decided talent advantage, and then after that was gone would walk the sidelines, calculating in his mind how many points his defense would give us and immediately call for his FG kicker on 4th and short in the red zone because he knew, after watching our offense and correctly calculating our game plan just how many points he needed And he was correct every time except the game in which he simply had no chance. So, despite any record keeping problems it might cause the AD in question, I reluctantly concluded some achievements, and probably none moreso than 18 AND 19 year old kids outplaying, sometimes shamelessly, men far more experienced can never truly be taken away.