Sounds like a great opportunity for him to continue his development. Wishing him all the best. Would not be surprised if he found another level in his game.
The "Arkansas" brand in basketball does not really compare to the "Kentucky" brand.
I bet he has some success, but his 5 star freshmen 1 and done method probably has to change.
During one of his last post-game interviews he seemed to highlight his players who got drafted as a major accomplishment for the program, but also seemed to indicate that their young lineups were susceptible to older teams in March. Reading the tea leaves here, but I feel like he and Kentucky felt stuck in a slightly outdated system that worked at one point in time, but maybe didn't work so well, now, with all the changes to the game.
You were right. He looked gassed pretty much after the first 10 minutes of the game. His shot got erratic, he was slow to react to rebounds and block opportunities, missed free throws and turnovers.
In hindsight, Painter should have tried to slow the game down and control the pace.
Do major league baseball player develop close personal relationships with their translators? In some cases I imagine they do, so maybe it is possible that he paid off his translators debts.
Starting to realize this guy is absolutely horrible at PR. For awhile he would say and do things, and I would think, "that was dumb", but I didn't necessarily think he would keep doing it.
But now I feel like the jury has a verdict. The guy will often say and do regretful things. It is what it is.
Good point. Keep in mind, coach had some medical issues he was working through, and his son was on the team, so maybe riding the wave to the end of the season, doing his due diligence, conducting inter-program interviews and letting cooler heads prevail was the smartest way to begin this new chapter.
Correct me if I am wrong, but I was under the impression that Trente graded out quite well at the combine and consequently improved his draft position considerably.
Also, this, from his draft bio:
In 2023 as a senior Jones saw action in 14 games and played a total of 336 snaps for the Wolverines. He allowed just one QB hurry, no QB hits, and no sacks while playing the majority of his snaps at tight tackle, and the rest at left tackle.
No QB hits/sacks against OSU, Iowa, Alabama and Washington. That is likely enough data/sample size, especially considering the competition.
They are comparable for having size like that at the Wing position. Duhan is about to amass the most tries in the history of the Scottish national team in just 3/4 years. Everyone else on the list played a decade or more.
Is there a bigger faster 11 in the world right now?
Relax, I was just saying, if this guy shows up at the combine at the TE position or maybe even Safety position, he would probably be the highest rated or near highest rated all time in some pretty key categories.
The USA is a very big country, and we often have great athletes, but the total sum of his international competition pool is bigger, and he is often regarded as the best at the Wing position, which is the fastest position on the field.
Here are the numbers:
Gronk ran a 4.68 40 at his pro day. Keclce ran 4.61 at the combine.
Duhan ran 10.6 100m in High School. So, if you put this in a running conversion calculator, Duhan, in theory could run a 4.42 40 at 6'4" 235 lbs.
Ha, I shared that info about Michigan alum Michael Woods winning his stage and then promptly got blasted by some board readers for being a spoiler to those recording and waiting to watch tape delayed in the evening.
Maybe a good chance to remind people to label a spoiler, especially if it involves a Michigan alum in a non-major overseas sport.
Bikes might be coming out of storage early this year guys. Go pump those lungs and heart!
So, in my own anecdotal experience occasionally shooting women's balls in gym class as a kid. Sometimes the gym teacher would roll out a mixed bin of balls, and everyone got whatever they got during a shoot around.
That being said, based on my experience, it is an 8.8% drop/gain between the two ball sizes. My data is not peer reviewed and some have questioned sample size and other testing methods.
Do schools just accept the Nike Vapor Elite as delivered, on the web it just says "official size" approved for Pros, which I assume to mean NFL. So I assume that is the biggest ball possible.
Why would you make your QB throw the biggest ball? Can a school order a custom range of dimensions of the Vapor Elite and see what ball the starting QB throws best?
I would probably have them custom trim that thing down to the margins. Most everyone will throw the ball missing an inch or so better right?
Ok, thank you. My next question would be, how often do visiting teams bring their own balls?
Anyways, if these are the rules, I am sure everything has been done and attempted. There are probably some really funny backstories behind this rule though.
San Diego St.? I suppose he was trying to use Purdue and Wisconsin as conference examples. But the model of getting players who can give you a couple of years and development seems to be gaining traction throughout college basketball.
I hate to say it, but college basketball is quickly becoming something akin to AA baseball. Correct me if I am wrong.
Unless they are obviously still growing physically, like Franz was. Here is how I see it as AA: You get a future AAA=NBDL/NBA player for one year, whether or not they actually produced on the court. That is their path and journey.
To win AA basketball, you very likely need a really good AA team, but not the team everybody stole players from. The good news is, some of those great AA players for 3 and 4 years of college will still make the league, so not all is lost, it is just a different path.
The only other way is to somehow replicate the fab five, one year, all the money, all 5 star freshmen, for all the marbles. But then, after that, you just have a huge void and it probably isn't a sustainable model anyways, but maybe you won something.
I think Craig was spot on regarding "building like Purdue and not Calipari"
In just a few short years, the Calipari model, once plausible/practical/sound, seems to be completely unworkable in the latest iteration of the modern era of college basketball.
What are Creighton, Dayton, San Diego State, Saint Marys, Washington State, and Colorado State doing? Even BYU is in the top 25. I have never seen a top 25 like this before.
Just go to 16 and get rid of conference championships in the major conferences.
It seems likely to me that teams that have already locked up a spot in the playoffs are going to sit their players for the conference championship.
I would declare the conference champion the team that goes farthest in the playoff with some logical tie breakers if needed.
Think about this likely scenario, Michigan beats Oregon to win the BIG Championship, and then Oregon beats Michigan to win the National Championship. Do you really even care about that BIG TEN trophy anymore? I would just give it to Oregon. We are going to see scenarios like this over and over with all of the conference champions.
And even dumber, the games will only be a couple weeks apart.
One way in which they are different (Juwan/Harbaugh), the NBA plucks players much faster than the NFL. So, Juwan has to deal with the pandemic, portal, NIL AND! the NBA draft to build a roster.
It is almost a fatal combination for all of college basketball.
Jim, for the most part, got to develop his players to their college potential.
Yeah, same, I won an NFL regulation football (the maximum size) at a silent auction a long time ago and I remember playing catch with it and being surprised by the feel, velocity and spiral.
You hear stories about great college players that couldn't throw an NFL ball. So, that 3/4 inch circumference variability, as well as all the other adjustments, I suspect are more important for some than people realize.
Regarding, "The big names he gets leave after 1 year to go ride pine in the NBA."
I agree, just one addition, the big names he has gotten aren't even good enough to play winning ball in the BIG.
So, in my opinion, player scouting/recruiting/identification/program fit has been far and away the biggest problem.
Since getting those recruits to the aftermath, everything has been total program erosion as a result. And the NBA still drafted them? Just a total opposite day situation. How on Earth can you field a team working under that paradigm?
Start recruiting the right program players and slowly turn the ship around.
I have fond memories driving around Ann Arbor, as a teenager in the 90s, listening to Parker and Stone / Stoney and Wojo.
There weren't anywhere near as many media channels and distractions back then, and they delivered an authentic common narrative thread for a ton of kids growing up in SE Michigan. Good stuff Stoney.
Another stat I would like to see, someone should take that list of QBs and look at the percentage of snaps that the QB played relative to their entire season of offensive snaps. If you don't count injuries, you will see that JJ's offense was so far ahead of opponents most of the season that he simply got to sit out a significant percentage of the season.
Although atypical, that clearly has to be a metric of success, how much did you get to not play because you already won the game. And then, take it another step further, what would your numbers have been if you played full games. Probably Heisman at that point.
What I find interesting is that not only did his big recruits not pan out, Jace/Diabate/Houstan, but his near misses also didn't pan out, Todd/Christopher, and all of these guys still ended up in the NBA system and still haven't panned out.
You can blame Howard, but it seems like the entire basketball system miscalculated in a way that would lead to a coach like Howard giving these players way to much playing time/opportunity.
Haven't really ever seen anything like this before.
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Sounds like a great opportunity for him to continue his development. Wishing him all the best. Would not be surprised if he found another level in his game.
The 2022 Illinois win with the Moody kick was actually a really huge for the program. Not saying it was the best, but it probably deserves a mention.
Reading these quotes, I got "big time" Earl Bruce vibes.
The "Arkansas" brand in basketball does not really compare to the "Kentucky" brand.
I bet he has some success, but his 5 star freshmen 1 and done method probably has to change.
During one of his last post-game interviews he seemed to highlight his players who got drafted as a major accomplishment for the program, but also seemed to indicate that their young lineups were susceptible to older teams in March. Reading the tea leaves here, but I feel like he and Kentucky felt stuck in a slightly outdated system that worked at one point in time, but maybe didn't work so well, now, with all the changes to the game.
You were right. He looked gassed pretty much after the first 10 minutes of the game. His shot got erratic, he was slow to react to rebounds and block opportunities, missed free throws and turnovers.
In hindsight, Painter should have tried to slow the game down and control the pace.
2000 days is such a great goal.
What if "born on 3rd base" is actually a better analogy to their recruiting?
I hear you. People could be more detailed in their announcements.
Posters should take a second, reread it, make the title make sense. Make the links works and so forth.
Interested what other ideas are out there to discourage transferring?
His team is way better than ours. Just saying
Do you really think a team with a bunch of highly recruited freshmen works in 2024?
Calipari's strategy isn't really working as far as I can tell and bringing it to Michigan won't work either.
Do major league baseball player develop close personal relationships with their translators? In some cases I imagine they do, so maybe it is possible that he paid off his translators debts.
Starting to realize this guy is absolutely horrible at PR. For awhile he would say and do things, and I would think, "that was dumb", but I didn't necessarily think he would keep doing it.
But now I feel like the jury has a verdict. The guy will often say and do regretful things. It is what it is.
This is kind of the most "anti-sport" thing I have heard in awhile.
Sounds like he is openly endorsing the complete opposite of a meritocracy.
Agreed. I can't speak from experience, but it has to be hard to maintain body control and catch when moving that fast.
Just going to remind people that Smart is from Wisconsin and Marquette is a good job. Would he even leave? I am not so sure.
In some ways no, as aspects of college basketball have turned the sport even more towards player development, his wheelhouse.
Thus ends the J.H. era of Michigan athletics.
Good point. Keep in mind, coach had some medical issues he was working through, and his son was on the team, so maybe riding the wave to the end of the season, doing his due diligence, conducting inter-program interviews and letting cooler heads prevail was the smartest way to begin this new chapter.
This probably didn't need to be rushed.
What if the NIL and Transfer Portal work for Michigan football but at the same time don't work for Michigan basketball?
Sounds like he is preparing Alabama fans for a world in which the Tide aren't winning.
Correct me if I am wrong, but I was under the impression that Trente graded out quite well at the combine and consequently improved his draft position considerably.
Also, this, from his draft bio:
In 2023 as a senior Jones saw action in 14 games and played a total of 336 snaps for the Wolverines. He allowed just one QB hurry, no QB hits, and no sacks while playing the majority of his snaps at tight tackle, and the rest at left tackle.
No QB hits/sacks against OSU, Iowa, Alabama and Washington. That is likely enough data/sample size, especially considering the competition.
JJ:…
Steve Young: 6'2" 216
JJ: 6'3" 206
Young had wheels. Both can sling the rock and both are good with the media.
probably
They are comparable for having size like that at the Wing position. Duhan is about to amass the most tries in the history of the Scottish national team in just 3/4 years. Everyone else on the list played a decade or more.
Time will tell.
Is the M abacus still a thing? If not, bring it back. If it is still there, get rid of it.
Lomu was 6'4" 265. So, another 30 lbs.
He was big in HS, but I think he has gotten stronger since.
But he does play the fastest position on the field, wing and/or 11.
Watch his long runs when he accesses his sprinting speed, and I swear it jumps off the screen in terms of "freak" athlete.
Look at the first run on this tape
He has olympic speed in the 100, but is a lot smaller.
Is there a bigger faster 11 in the world right now?
Relax, I was just saying, if this guy shows up at the combine at the TE position or maybe even Safety position, he would probably be the highest rated or near highest rated all time in some pretty key categories.
Whatever, watch some Six Nations y'all.
The USA is a very big country, and we often have great athletes, but the total sum of his international competition pool is bigger, and he is often regarded as the best at the Wing position, which is the fastest position on the field.
Here are the numbers:
Gronk ran a 4.68 40 at his pro day. Keclce ran 4.61 at the combine.
Duhan ran 10.6 100m in High School. So, if you put this in a running conversion calculator, Duhan, in theory could run a 4.42 40 at 6'4" 235 lbs.
That is super elite comps only. Vernon Davis.
Gronk and Kelce have better reach.
Ha, I shared that info about Michigan alum Michael Woods winning his stage and then promptly got blasted by some board readers for being a spoiler to those recording and waiting to watch tape delayed in the evening.
Maybe a good chance to remind people to label a spoiler, especially if it involves a Michigan alum in a non-major overseas sport.
Bikes might be coming out of storage early this year guys. Go pump those lungs and heart!
I am a Tadej guy myself. Go Pogi!
Saw him do stand up once, a buddy had extra tickets and I tagged along, not knowing what to expect.
He was absolutely hilarious. Had the entire audience rolling.
So, in my own anecdotal experience occasionally shooting women's balls in gym class as a kid. Sometimes the gym teacher would roll out a mixed bin of balls, and everyone got whatever they got during a shoot around.
That being said, based on my experience, it is an 8.8% drop/gain between the two ball sizes. My data is not peer reviewed and some have questioned sample size and other testing methods.
Do schools just accept the Nike Vapor Elite as delivered, on the web it just says "official size" approved for Pros, which I assume to mean NFL. So I assume that is the biggest ball possible.
Why would you make your QB throw the biggest ball? Can a school order a custom range of dimensions of the Vapor Elite and see what ball the starting QB throws best?
I would probably have them custom trim that thing down to the margins. Most everyone will throw the ball missing an inch or so better right?
Ok, thank you. My next question would be, how often do visiting teams bring their own balls?
Anyways, if these are the rules, I am sure everything has been done and attempted. There are probably some really funny backstories behind this rule though.
San Diego St.? I suppose he was trying to use Purdue and Wisconsin as conference examples. But the model of getting players who can give you a couple of years and development seems to be gaining traction throughout college basketball.
I hate to say it, but college basketball is quickly becoming something akin to AA baseball. Correct me if I am wrong.
Unless they are obviously still growing physically, like Franz was. Here is how I see it as AA: You get a future AAA=NBDL/NBA player for one year, whether or not they actually produced on the court. That is their path and journey.
To win AA basketball, you very likely need a really good AA team, but not the team everybody stole players from. The good news is, some of those great AA players for 3 and 4 years of college will still make the league, so not all is lost, it is just a different path.
The only other way is to somehow replicate the fab five, one year, all the money, all 5 star freshmen, for all the marbles. But then, after that, you just have a huge void and it probably isn't a sustainable model anyways, but maybe you won something.
I think Craig was spot on regarding "building like Purdue and not Calipari"
In just a few short years, the Calipari model, once plausible/practical/sound, seems to be completely unworkable in the latest iteration of the modern era of college basketball.
What are Creighton, Dayton, San Diego State, Saint Marys, Washington State, and Colorado State doing? Even BYU is in the top 25. I have never seen a top 25 like this before.
Just go to 16 and get rid of conference championships in the major conferences.
It seems likely to me that teams that have already locked up a spot in the playoffs are going to sit their players for the conference championship.
I would declare the conference champion the team that goes farthest in the playoff with some logical tie breakers if needed.
Think about this likely scenario, Michigan beats Oregon to win the BIG Championship, and then Oregon beats Michigan to win the National Championship. Do you really even care about that BIG TEN trophy anymore? I would just give it to Oregon. We are going to see scenarios like this over and over with all of the conference champions.
And even dumber, the games will only be a couple weeks apart.
One way in which they are different (Juwan/Harbaugh), the NBA plucks players much faster than the NFL. So, Juwan has to deal with the pandemic, portal, NIL AND! the NBA draft to build a roster.
It is almost a fatal combination for all of college basketball.
Jim, for the most part, got to develop his players to their college potential.
My reading of it was similar to yours, but then the idea of the dimensions of the game ball changing on every possession seemed kind of bizarre to me.
Yeah, same, I won an NFL regulation football (the maximum size) at a silent auction a long time ago and I remember playing catch with it and being surprised by the feel, velocity and spiral.
You hear stories about great college players that couldn't throw an NFL ball. So, that 3/4 inch circumference variability, as well as all the other adjustments, I suspect are more important for some than people realize.
That is also true.
To be totally honest, there really wasn't any drop off in production when JJ left a game and we gave Tuttle the ball.
Regarding, "The big names he gets leave after 1 year to go ride pine in the NBA."
I agree, just one addition, the big names he has gotten aren't even good enough to play winning ball in the BIG.
So, in my opinion, player scouting/recruiting/identification/program fit has been far and away the biggest problem.
Since getting those recruits to the aftermath, everything has been total program erosion as a result. And the NBA still drafted them? Just a total opposite day situation. How on Earth can you field a team working under that paradigm?
Start recruiting the right program players and slowly turn the ship around.
I have fond memories driving around Ann Arbor, as a teenager in the 90s, listening to Parker and Stone / Stoney and Wojo.
There weren't anywhere near as many media channels and distractions back then, and they delivered an authentic common narrative thread for a ton of kids growing up in SE Michigan. Good stuff Stoney.
Another stat I would like to see, someone should take that list of QBs and look at the percentage of snaps that the QB played relative to their entire season of offensive snaps. If you don't count injuries, you will see that JJ's offense was so far ahead of opponents most of the season that he simply got to sit out a significant percentage of the season.
Although atypical, that clearly has to be a metric of success, how much did you get to not play because you already won the game. And then, take it another step further, what would your numbers have been if you played full games. Probably Heisman at that point.
What I find interesting is that not only did his big recruits not pan out, Jace/Diabate/Houstan, but his near misses also didn't pan out, Todd/Christopher, and all of these guys still ended up in the NBA system and still haven't panned out.
You can blame Howard, but it seems like the entire basketball system miscalculated in a way that would lead to a coach like Howard giving these players way to much playing time/opportunity.
Haven't really ever seen anything like this before.