[Updated] Starters on OL and injuries (Dileo), Michigan State week

Submitted by dnak438 on October 28th, 2013 at 12:15 PM

Michigan OL for MSU game (per depth chart): Lewan LT, Bosch at LG, Glasgow C, Magnuson RG and Schofield RT

— angelique (@chengelis) October 28, 2013

UPDATE: This is apparently subject to change:

Hoke anticipates same OL that finished w vs IU. He said that could change after Tuesday -- Kalis and Bryant ready to go

— angelique (@chengelis) October 28, 2013

UPDATE #2: Drew Dileo may or may not play:

Hoke: Drew Dileo is a 'we'll see' vs. Michigan State -- will know more on Wednesday. — Michigan Football (@umichfootball) October 28, 2013

 

 

Comments

BILG

October 28th, 2013 at 12:26 PM ^

Kalis has trouble at guard and is much more effective at tackle.  If this is true, I dont understand why they haven't ried Schofield at right guard and Kalis at right tackle. 

mgobaran

October 28th, 2013 at 1:04 PM ^

That is not on Funk. All players mature on their own. You cannot speed up the process some times. That is why you don't want RS Freshman playing on the line. 

One day it will click in Kalis' head. It might be this week, it might be next week, it might be the offseason. Hell, it might take till week four next season. When that light switch flips from thinking to reacting, he will be a hell of a football player. 

GoBlueInNYC

October 28th, 2013 at 1:39 PM ^

Has any OLineman developed under Funk, though?

Two years of pretty absymal OLine play with two NFL-caliber tackles is not really a positive sign. And as someone else in the thread pointed out, 7 games and 2 byes in, the OLine is still being shuffled around.

Are they young? Sure. But plenty of teams have young OLines that they get figured out eventually (look at MSU's line last season). This unit has been really underperforming and it's severely hampering the entire offense.

EZMIKEP

October 28th, 2013 at 1:49 PM ^

And as one of the posters pointed out and many keep asking.. WHERE the hell is Braden. I heard on here that he has problems pulling and can't play the interior as good as tackle.. Ok fair enough, but why is he not seeing and playing time at all as a tackle like when Lewan went down if they are trying to squeeze short yardage? I mean hes the biggest linemen we have and he's had an entire year and a half in the system. If he is just not good i'll be a disappointed fan for sure. The expectations were sky high.

WolvinLA2

October 28th, 2013 at 2:30 PM ^

Exactly. And Magnuson was the higher rated recruit. If Braden was playing in his place, people would blame Funk for that too.

Who exactly has Funk not developed? We all agree that Lewan and Schofield are very good players, probably at or near their college ceilings. Outside of them, the only non-frosh he has are perpetually-injured Bryant and Miller. Are we expecting those guys to be good right now? The fact that guys like Magnuson, Glasgow and Kalis are all beyond where they should be right now should be somewhat credited to Funk.

GoBlueInNYC

October 28th, 2013 at 2:37 PM ^

As a unit, they have been pretty terrible for a couple of years now. Let's not forget the performance of three 5th year seniors last season.

I would expect at least average performance from them, especially at this point in the season. Instead, they're still shuffling the starting line-up. There are serious problems at that position.

Bodogblog

October 28th, 2013 at 2:56 PM ^

in fact one is All-American, another is some level of All-B1G (probably second team), and Glasgow is solid.

They're shuffling Kalis and Bryant for others at the guard positions. Probably because those players are stronger right now, but missing too many assignments. They're putting a premium on getting a body on people, rather than driving them. At this point that makes sense.

And again I'm surprised at the attention put on Funk/Borges vs. Mattison, probably due to Brian's influence on the board. People are concerned with shuffling on the OL, but Mattison's rotating in everyone but the softball team and no one cares. Despite dubious results at times, and I'm talking about more than just the last drive vs. PSU.

GoBlueInNYC

October 28th, 2013 at 3:15 PM ^

I am more likely to give Mattison the benefit of the doubt, because I've seen more good on the defensive side of the ball. I haven't caught up with the Indiana game yet, but the previous 2 1/2 seasons have generally looked good to me. Especially considering the turn around from the 2010 defense. Not lights out every game, but that side of the ball has been reliably good since Mattison got here.

My broader concern about the offense stems from not seeing any development. Three seasons in, and things don't seem to be trending upwards. Things just seem highly, highly erratic. Capable of doing good things, but you can't count on it. Especially the QB play; the best quarterbacking we've seen since Borges got here was Gardner after practicing at WR.

As far as the OLine, it's two good tackles, a serviceable center, and a mess at both guard spots. And that comes after a mid-season switch at center. That's, at best, 2.5 spots out of 5. I'm not expecting the slew of 2nd and 3rd year players to be dominant, but that interior has been underperforming even modest expectations.

bluesalt

October 28th, 2013 at 5:08 PM ^

Is a year younger. It would be pretty natural for him to be behind others on the depth chart initially. And one would hope that even as an early enrollee he'd be enough behind others in spring practice that he couldn't catch up after only spring, as otherwise what have the other OLs been doing all year. That he's been able to pass about 5 guys ahead of him on the depth chart speaks highly of him, but says very little about coaching, except that coaches are willing to keep evaluating the depth chart.

MGoStrength

October 28th, 2013 at 10:09 PM ^

FWIW this is ESPN's scouting report of Bosch coming out of high school.

 

"With his size and raw tools, he shows some upside, but we feel will need a redshirt year to keep develop his skills and allow him to maximize his ability."

 

So, this is a guy that although has good size and physicality and was also highly ranked out of high school, was thought by scouts to need a RS to develop his strength and push in run blocking.

alum96

October 28th, 2013 at 2:01 PM ^

Well on a typical UM team none of these guys (ex Glasgow I guess) would be sniffing the field other than to get some reps vs CMU due to age.  UM usually would roll out a RS sophomore that is uber talented (Long Lewan etc) and in rare exceptions 2 (Hutchinson Backus) but usually you throw 1 out there and surround him with a bevy of juniors and seniors.  Like what OSU is doing this year with 1 very young starter.   Rolling through RS freshman and now a true freshman?  Not ideal.

All that said you'd expect out of the 2012 class if Funk was the answer, one of these guys - just by chance would be hitting big.  Maybe its going to be a 2013 kid (Bosch), which would be strange - but who knows.  Just from probability you'd expect someone to pop up out of so many candidates.  It really is going to set up an interesting 2014 when multiple of these guys have to "hit it big" together just to be competent. 

Last point about the OL - it is the one unit on the team that is truly a unit.  Your safeties are somewhat separate from your corners.  Your LBs are more out in space and DL are much more about 1 on 1 battles.  The OL is so much about communication and being on the same page - it really is difficult to figure out who is doing what and who has what skill.  Lewan has looked down at times this year from even last year; I assume some is the constant injuries but I have to believe part of that is the turnstile that has set up next to him all year.

GoBlueInNYC

October 28th, 2013 at 4:12 PM ^

Lewan and Long both started as RS freshman, not sophomores (well, they did as sophomores, too, but you know what I mean). And I'm not just comparing this line to vintage UM lines; that'd be a crazy standard. Other schools have been able to cobble together functional lines out of less. Will they get better? Sure. Doesn't mean I don't think they shouldn't be playing better now.

To your last point, the OL can't develop as a unit when they're still shuffling players and positions 9 weeks into the season.

Bodogblog

October 28th, 2013 at 2:20 PM ^

you have the ultimate 0* player being developed into an average-to-good B1G lineman in his RS sophomore season. At two positions.

Personally I think too much is made of coaching at times - Kalis hasn't looked like a dominant talent at any point yet in his time here, even going back to practice videos - but if you're going to play that game, you can't ignore Glasgow. Miller is also a fine technician who was in the right spot and made the right calls for the most part (coaching), he's just too small and was overpowered too often.

With 3 of 5 OL spots doing just fine, I think it's premature to blame Funk for not finding two above-average guards from among a bevy of redshirt or true freshman

mgobaran

October 28th, 2013 at 2:46 PM ^

Our Depth goes 

2 - 5th year seniors
3 - 3rd year sophmores (1 too small, 1 too injured, & 1 amazing ex-walk-on)
1 Billion - True Freshman and RS Freshman who should never be forced to see the field this early under normal Michigan circumstances.

So everyone who isn't a 5th year senior & who isn't named Graham Glasgow are usually not 100% developed under any program. Let's see how the new line performs against MSU this week before you say Funk can't develop. Who knows, maybe Mags & Bosch (who is a true freshman, which is amazing) are the answer. And your whole lack of development thing goes out the window. 

GoBlueInNYC

October 28th, 2013 at 2:52 PM ^

What about the line last year? There were two 4th year players and three 5th year players that Funk had for two seasons.

And plenty of teams can field functional, sometimes pretty good, OLines out of two 5th year players, some 3rd players, and some 2nd year players. As a unit, they have been underperforming for two straight seasons. Yes young, but still playing worse than they should.

mgobaran

October 28th, 2013 at 3:27 PM ^

We have zone read lineman trying to play a power run game. Add in the fact that our bread and butter (QB zone read) didn't option off the extra defender like it is designed to do, and you become less effective. 

I completely disagree with you that the young lineman are playing worse than they should. 

I am just asking you to wait and see. Funks guys are 1st & 2nd year guys. Let them develop (or underdevelop) before you jump down his throat. Kalis would look a lot better playing on the line if juniors & seniors were at the G and C spots. 

GoBlueInNYC

October 28th, 2013 at 3:35 PM ^

They aren't 1st and 2nd year guys, they are 2nd and 3rd year guys. Those redshirt seasons are there specifically to aid development. And running an offense ill-suited to your personnel might give Funk a bit of a pass, but is still a mark against the coaches (I guess, in this case, Borges's play calling).

Lucky for you, for some reason Hoke and the AD don't seem to want to listen to my opinions of their coaching staff.

blue in dc

October 28th, 2013 at 8:24 PM ^

Miller - not bigstrong enough - that's not really on Funk
Bryant - oft injured - hard to blame Funk
Glasgow - doing well

Everyone else on the interior is 1st or 2nd year player. Unfortunately, depth actually matters, because even when you recruit top tier talent there is still some luck involved both in whether and how quickly they pan out.

To my count, there are 5 non freshman, non-walkon offensive lineman greater than 291 lbs on the team. Its not surprising that our coaches were hopeful that with those 5, Glasgow and a 291 lb Miller, we could field a good line. Unfortunately, it doesn't appear that Miller is strong enough, with his injuries, Bryant has progressed enough and red-shirt freshmen Kalis and Braden were ready.

Thus, we're now going with smaller but maybe more mentally prepared Magnuson and the true freshman Bosch. It doesn't seem to be a totally illogical plan.

Last year was not much different. We had five uperclass scholarship lineman, an injured redshirt sophomore, a too small redshirt freshman, a bunch of freshman and a bunch of walkons. To pull together 5 solid guys, we needed hits on every uperclassman scholarship player and/or a phenomobal freshman or some real luck with a walkon.

I doubt there are many offensive line coaches who would have done well with those numbers.

Swazi

October 28th, 2013 at 12:27 PM ^

Magnuson is going to get yanked by the end of the first quarter. It's ine thing playing an undersized tackle at guard against Indiana. It's a whole different game against State.

Bocheezu

October 28th, 2013 at 12:32 PM ^

Bosch did look decent against IU, for what that's worth.  Hopefully him and Glasgow don't have any miscommunications like last game; they had a play on the goal line where they both bumped the DT and went to the 2nd level, while said DT was just left alone to roam around in the backfield.  Blocking mishaps like that will get somebody killed against MSU.

I'm sure Narduzzi took one look at our interior Oline and said "Double A-gap blitz. Every play."  As long as the Oline picks that up well, we have a chance.  Gardner running for his life in the backfield is a recipe for disaster.

AriGold

October 28th, 2013 at 12:33 PM ^

we will see a healthy dose of Kalis so long as he isn't injured...I don't mind this line-up since we won't be able to run much power runs against Sparty's tough defense