gbdub

March 13th, 2013 at 8:22 AM ^

See, this is precisely the road that the Duke Lacrosse thing went down - players assumed to be guilty, victim assumed to be raped, because it fit the stereotype of male athletes taking advantage of women.

Is sexual assault a problem? Absolutely. Will classes help? Eh - we were all required to get an orientation lecture that basically gave the message "any sex you have where a drop of alcohol is involved is probably rape but only men can rape". Not sure that changed any minds of anyone you had to worry about.

But in any case, trying to use individual rape cases as morality plays for the larger problem, particularly before all the facts are in, leads to bad Duke-like things that not only hurt the people involved but also work to delegitimize actual rape victims. So let's hold off on the moralizing on this specific case for awhile, okay?

Blue in Yarmouth

March 13th, 2013 at 8:27 AM ^

and your post didn't say this exactly, but I believe it was implied that only males were the targets of your courses which I think would be overlooking the reality in today's society.

I want to be absolutely clear, there is no excuse whatsoever for a woman to be sexually assaulted. I am the father of 2 girls (one 18 and one 4) and I believe that when a woman says no, it means no, and that they have the right to say that at any point.If this ever happened to one of them I would want the person strung up by the balls and used as a pinata.  I also believe that a woman should be able to dress and behave in whatever manner they choose and not have to worry about those clothes or behaviors being intepreted as "asking for it".

Having said all that, It is clear that things have changed dramatically from when I was a teenager and young adult. You don't have to look far to find bars where young women are stripping on the dance floor, making out with other girls to get a rise out of guys and in general being far more liberal than any girl would have dreamt of being 20 years ago. 

When I was young, if a girl took off her clothes in front of you the message was clear. Now some do it just for the fun of it and it often means nothing at all, other than they wanted a little attention. I guess what I am saying is there was a lot less room for misinterpretation back then. 

Again, I want to be clear: I don't think any woman deserves to be sexually assaulted nor do I think dressing certain ways or acting certain ways means they "ask for it". I do, however, think it is naive to believe that those things don't play some sort of role in these situations. 

To give a crude example: if I really liked swimming and was really feeling like taking a dip and went to the ocean to satisfy that in an area known to be occupied with sharks and then  got bit, how surprising would it be? I didn't ask for it...I had every right to swim there as well but I knew a danger existed and did it anyway so I couldn't really say it was surprising. 

I guess what I'm saying is maybe women need these classes too so they can be aware of the dangers out there and what types of behaviour could increase a persons chances of becoming a victim (and I don't mean just how people dress or act at a club, but other things like never walking alone at night etc). 

Again, this isn't in any way intended to defend any douche nozzle that chooses to sexually assault a woman, just to say that I think in today's society women are in just as much need of education on this issue as men if we hope to decrease the prevalence of these types of crimes.

In relation to this story specifically, I can only say that I hope justice is served and if an assault occured that the perpetrators pay the appropriate price and the victim is somehow able to come to terms with this awful event and in some way move forward.

gbdub

March 13th, 2013 at 8:48 AM ^

Girls went to the orientation too. The main message for them was, and I'm truly exaggerating only a little, "if you had a drink, even if you don't think you were raped you probably got raped".

It was so hyperbolic as to be ridiculous, basically it was abstinence-only rape prevention education. It seemed designed to make normal people paranoid of their healthy sexual relationships while having no effect on the shady jerk offs that like to take advantage of truly out of it women. In any case, that's what I remember of it 8 years later, so that shows how effective it was.

I think we do need to do a better job of educating people of any gender on both respect for others and themselves and being responsible with your own sexuality.

See now I'm getting into it too. No politics, especially not using this case as a bludgeon.

SituationSoap

March 13th, 2013 at 1:09 PM ^

I believe that all Americans should be required to take courses on personal finance and courses on sexuality that emphasize gender issues. It's far, far more widespread than just atheletes who have problems with finances and mistreating women. We could do so much good just by spending a little more time.

flysociety3

March 12th, 2013 at 6:52 PM ^

Additionally, Offensive Tackle, Kyle Dodson's name can be easily seen on the documents in the new video...

So Pittman and Dodson, plus another? 

Sad that these kids could (allegedly) get involved in something like this...

 

StephenRKass

March 12th, 2013 at 7:04 PM ^

I will not speculate on the additional two players' identity.

However, should 2 additional players seek transfers from OSU or be kicked off the team, does that just mean Ohio will be down two more players to a count of 80 (2 below the mandated scholarship number of 82 for this cycle.) This story will sort itself out soon enough, but losing depth could affect Ohio a little. It is interesting that this is coming out now, 4 1/2 months after the alleged rape occurred. I think this is probably typical, but it hurts Ohio more. Had this come out a month and a half ago, Ohio could and would have signed more players in the class of 2013.

EDIT:  Given comments made elsewhere, this situation, if verified, could have a significant effect on Ohio's depth on the line. This puts more pressure on them to stay healthy on the lines, and also sets their priorities in recruiting for the next few cycles.

Section 1

March 12th, 2013 at 9:13 PM ^

First time I've ever seen a bad and/or inappropriate CJK5H joke.

Good things about this thread; remarkable restraint and good sense displayed by all but a few MGoBloggers.

Bad things about this thread; virtually no information post-OP.

IndyBlue90

March 12th, 2013 at 7:28 PM ^

it did happen at ND and their investigation was an even bigger cover up than the Teo thing was. I know a couple people here in Indianapolis who went to school with the victim in that case (who committed suicide) and the scars of that are very much still alive for people who were near it.

bluesouth

March 12th, 2013 at 7:01 PM ^

point fingers at who is guilty or innocent.

The end of the report implicates who might be a perpetrator by mentioning.

Oh by the way an OSU football player just left the team. but they won't tell us why.  What kind of shitty journalism is that? Why mention the outgoing football player leaving if nobody knows why he left? Or the OSU will not tell why he left?

MGoRossGrad

March 12th, 2013 at 8:10 PM ^

That was my only huge takeaway from the story.

Yes there is an alleged rape and let's hope it's not true.

But my god, putting Dodson's name in the newscast?  For him, it doesn't really matter if the charge is true or not.  He's pretty much cast as a villian now.

Sad stuff.

My name ... is Tim

March 12th, 2013 at 9:42 PM ^

Why do they have to hide the names of the accused? These guys - though they may be young - are adults in the eyes of the law. There's nothing that prevents the station - terrible though the reporting may be - ethically or otherwise from printing information from a no longer confidential document. If you want to argue that people shouldn't have their information disclosed until charges are officially pressed and arrest is made, that is fine, but this information is made public all the time. If these guys committed rape, I don't care if they're 18 years old, they know that is wrong and deserve whatever shame comes with this.

gbdub

March 13th, 2013 at 9:06 AM ^

I really think we ought to consider some protections for the accused in cases like this, particularly since charges have not and may not be filed.

Sexual crimes are so heinous that even being accused of one is a serious black mark on a person with real, negative consequences on their life. So we should try to mitigate that until (if) they are proven guilty. Save the (entirely justified) shaming until then.

Brown Bear

March 12th, 2013 at 7:04 PM ^

I'm a little disappointed that people up voted this thread. Anything rape wise shouldn't be looked at in a positive way even when it's the enemy.

Coastal Elite

March 12th, 2013 at 7:17 PM ^

This is a mature, relevant, newsworthy post, ergo deserving of upvotes.

If you can't understand the difference between the substantive content of a story and the procedure of posting it, please refrain from upvoting/downvoting at all. Nothing is more irritating than seeing dozens of downvotes on a thread that shares (relevant and newsworthy) negative information about a recruiting battle, player injuries, etc.

A Lot of Milk

March 12th, 2013 at 7:11 PM ^

A serious crime like this isn't fun to make fun of. Acceting free tattoos? Yes. A felony commited by three players? Not so much. Unfortunate situation if it's true, but I have a feeling it might be.

Sione's Flow

March 12th, 2013 at 7:12 PM ^

Thoughts are with the victim. This isn't the type of thing any UM fan should be pleased with even if it does involve OSU. This is a bad situation on every front.