Regime Change and Defections

Submitted by natesezgoblue on November 29th, 2010 at 6:04 PM

A large concern of mine is if and when Harbaugh comes to town is the possibility of more defections and transfers.  One particular player named Denard Robinson.  What happens with him?  Stanford has runs the closest thing to "old timey" football.  In that O Drob doesnt fit in very well..   Not to say that he couldnt but I believe he came here so he could play QB.  I think Drob could go down in the history books as the greatest or one  of the greatest wolverines ever and I dont want to see him anywhere else but at the corner of Stadium and Main.



November 29th, 2010 at 8:06 PM ^

I don't think coaches bring a "solid portion" of their recruiting classes with them at all.  That said, I also don't know what you mean by "Martin is the name I'd worry about."  Rodriguez means offense at Michigan.  If he goes, there assumedly goes the spread offense.  I'm much, much more worried about Denard leaving than Mike Martin (assuming that's the "Martin" you were refering to).  Maybe I'm just not smart this evening . . .


November 29th, 2010 at 6:09 PM ^

First of all, I think DRob has stated that he wants to play QB in the NFL, right? If that's true, he might as well get acquainted with some pro style offense in college. Second of all, I don't think Harbaugh would instantly name Tate the starter. For at least next season, I imagine that JH would rotate a little bit, perhaps even running some wild cat or whatever. Denard would still get his share of snaps, but probably less than this year.

Finally, I think Denard is a competitor who loves Michigan. I imagine he'd be "All in for Harbaugh" and stick around to compete at the QB position (any may even compete at other positions).

I have no doubts that Denard is the type of kid who is All In for Michigan regardless of the coach or the offense, but if he's not All In, then ... well... we only talk about kids who play for Michigan!


November 29th, 2010 at 6:10 PM ^

No matter who coaches this team next year, it will be much improved.  More upperclassmen, the practices and a bowl game, good recruits coming in.  Didn't the guy down the road just take basically the same 6-7 team and go 11-1?  I think it's to much of a gamble to switch coaches now, IMHO.


November 29th, 2010 at 6:10 PM ^

As much I as love Denard and want him to stay no matter what.  The progress of the program is more important that any one person, even a Heisman front runner and even a better person. 

If Brandon wants change, do it right and get the best.  None of this Harbaugh or bust. 


November 29th, 2010 at 6:11 PM ^

...for Denard to leave.

First, he is comfortable here.  Second, despite what changes occur, Harbaugh would probably run a variation of the spread.  He doesn't have a perfect drop back passer, the OL is built on the spread...and it is sort of working.  

Second, if Denard wanted to leave...where would he go?  Everyone is assuming that RRod would have a certain job somewhere...I don't see that happening. Assuming RRod doesn't get a quick job, is there another offense that runs the spread like we do, where Denard could just 'plug in' and succeed?  I am not so sure. 

I am sure we will have a lot of defections, especially at RB and slot.  

Frankly, t hough, all of these discussions are short term thinking.  We have to look at long term.  And if Denard is the price of that, so be it. 


November 29th, 2010 at 6:26 PM ^

grabbing RR.  Kinda scary thinking what he could do as a HC in Flordia.  Do you think the local media would trash him upon arrival?  Do you think factions at Miami would not support him and try to ruin him because he isn't a Miami Man?  Do the think the fans would give him a fair shake and enough time to win?  Makes you wonder what his real problem is here.  Don't think he is the problem.


November 29th, 2010 at 6:49 PM ^

Criticism is valid.  However, I hear too much " I don't like RR".  Do they know him personally? No.  So how can such a lame statement be made.  Oh,  their ego is hurt at the pub 'cause the coach and team aren't winning like in the past.  Many factors linked together created a devisive image of current UM football.  No, they don't win games ... obviously.  But demeaning the coach surely isn't the definition of being a representative of Michigan as a fan. 


November 29th, 2010 at 8:00 PM ^

He isn't the only problem...we have too many petulant fans who called for LC's head every year, complaining that we'll never be an 'elite' program and should throw the ball more, run the spread, tired of the 'three yards and a cloud of dust', etc, etc.  Now we go in a different direction with the end goal to become a modern program that competes every year for the MNC, and these same bitches want it now. 

magnus_caerulus (not verified)

November 29th, 2010 at 8:09 PM ^

RR to UM was the first thing that crossed my mine.  Might be a perfect fit.  Less intense media coverage, ability to recruit that kind of speed in FL.  They/his style could run over the state of FL, then the south, then perhaps the MNC.  Is that what we want in this situation?  Turn him away, then get headed pay-back in a bowl or worse, BCS game...


November 29th, 2010 at 6:11 PM ^

I wonder if Dave Brandon is considering the implications of pissing away his #1 most marketable, household-name product in Denard Robinson by firing Rodriguez.


Denard will follow him wherever he goes, and we will be left to win "with cruelty", as Harbaugh likes to say.

I will probably never be able to follow college football again, as watching Denard go on to win the Heisman at another school would essentially mean that Michigan Football is dead.


November 29th, 2010 at 7:15 PM ^

His most marketable product is his coach, not Denard.  Sure some players come to a school to play with a certain player, but way more come to play for a coach.  I think Denard would leave, especially since he did not redshirt.  It would be a tragedy, but I won't blame him for wanting to play in a spread offense.  As painful as that departure would be, we can't base a decision on one player, especially when Harbaugh would have no problem developing the remaing QBs and continuing the great QB tradition. 

Your post is a good example of posts that refer to Brandon's CEO background and then conclude that he will keep Rrod for whatever business reason.  But keep in mind that he is also an athletic director and ADs have their own tendancies.  Specifically,  they often like to pick their own guy to lead the program.  I haven't seen any convicning evidence that DB will approach this as a typical CEO rather than as a typical AD.


November 29th, 2010 at 6:13 PM ^

- Denard seems to love Michigan and his teammates.  Players don't often leave when they're happy.

- Denard was given a chance to play QB, and in the process broke the NCAA rushing record for a QB and has a good shot at the overall rushing crown this fall.

- For any upperclassmen QB, there are two main goals: winning and preparing for the next level.  I honestly don't know which coach has a better chance at winning over the next two years, so I won't touch on that.  However, no one will prepate Denard for the NFL better than Harbaugh.  Either Denard will stay at QB where Harbaugh will coach him into the best QB he can be (high ceiling here) or Harbaugh and Denard will decide that it's in his best interest to play WR or RB at the next level, and Denard will get acclimated at a new position in a pro-style offense and be ready for the draft where he'll make millions.  Very few other coaches will prepare him for the NFL better than Harbaugh.

The only instance where Denard leaves is if he says he'll only play QB and Harbaugh says no, you can't.  JH is a good coach and DR is a smart guy and great player so I'm sure they'd come to a compromise.


November 29th, 2010 at 6:41 PM ^

i think its interesting that you thin harbaugh will prepare denard better for the nfl better than rich rod.. If i remember coach rod has had a good run of players going to the league. I know he has had two qbs in the nfl and many other players. I cant think of another harbaugh player in the nfl beside tobey garhart, if im wrong please correct me. so for you to say that harbaugh will better prepare him for the nfl is not true. also why all this talk about denard changing positions this pisses me off more than anything and makes me think there is some kind of agenda or sterotype about a black quarterback always having to change positions.. would you be asking for tate to change positions if the situation was reversed.


November 29th, 2010 at 6:50 PM ^

FIrst of all, you have to go back a long ways to find a RR QB who was successful in the NFL.  But I'm not basing this on what these coaches have done in the past, but on the style they coach and Harbaugh's experience in the NFL and with other NFL coaches.  Harbaugh's style is much more similar to what the NFL runs than RR's, especially for a QB. 

Talking about the possibility of Denard switching positions has nothing to do with his skin tone and everything to do with his skill set and body type.  People didn't talk about Vince Young or Donovan McNabb switching positions, but they did about Eric Crouch (OMG he's white!).  Denard Robinson is a QB much more similar to Crouch or Randle El than he is to Young or McNabb.  I'm not saying he should switch, but he might decide that he can make more money as a Randle El or Percy Harvin type player than trying to break into the NFL as an undersized dual-threat QB. 

I'm not saying this will certainly happen.  If Denard can continue to improve his accuracy and his ability to read defenses, he will be an even better college QB and will have a shot playing QB in the pros.  However, if he decides to play a role more similar to Reggie Bush or Harvin, he will almost certainly be a 1st or 2nd round pick. 


November 29th, 2010 at 7:08 PM ^

no you're basing this on who will better prepare you for the nfl. I still think rrod has done this better in the past.. pat white was a second round pick at qb.. although it did not work out for him he got drafted playing this system.. I think coach rod has a pretty good list of players making it to the nfl. with all of harbaugh experience in the nfl i still can think of any of his qb being in the nfl.. For the record luck wanted to go to wvu but pat white was there and rrod passed on him.


November 29th, 2010 at 7:18 PM ^

Where did race enter into this analysis except from you Fab5. No one brought it up except for you. There are some very good black quarterbacks in the nfl. Guess what there are allso a lot of black wide recievers and running backs. Why does everyone have to go to the damn race card thats that pisses me off!!


November 29th, 2010 at 7:49 PM ^

It bothers me too but sometimes you have to question race because all last year on this damn blog i would read denard should change position and he cant throw..  that bothers me when you dont give someone a chance and look at what denard just accomplished in his first year as the starting qb.. thats why i mention if because people are always so quick to rigt someone off what they think should be done.


November 29th, 2010 at 7:59 PM ^

Again, people weren't saying "Denard should switch positions, he can't throw" because he was black, it's because he's super athletic....and he couldn't throw.  I'm glad he didn't switch, as is everyone, but you are again making up the race part in your head. 


November 29th, 2010 at 7:33 PM ^

But you're making up the race part on your own.  Did you ever hear someone ask Byron Leftwich to move to WR?  How about Daunte Culpepper?  David Garrard?  They are all black.

It's not a coincidence that a lot of athletic QBs are black.  But not all of them are.  I used the Eric Crouch example.  Also at Nebraska, I wouldn't be surprised if Taylor Martinez decides to play wideout in the pros. 

If Ricky Stanzi can't play QB in the NFL, he probably will not get a shot to play WR.  Not because he's white, because he's slow.


November 29th, 2010 at 8:06 PM ^

you win guys I dont know what im talking about... race never plays a role in anything i must be living in bizzaro world or something... all i did was question why people want denard to switch positions all the time when he has been a successful qb and given a shot he could be mike vick in the nfl but according to many on this blog he has no chance at qb at the next level..  i wasnt playing the race card just questioning the issue of denard always being ask to switch positions


November 29th, 2010 at 7:26 PM ^

Shawn King...Woody Danztler... and Pat White lets be real about Rich and his QB's they don't transition well into the NFL.  I'm not trying to knock Rod i'm just trying to be honest.  Also does anyone know the number of WV players that Rich brought with him to Mich.  If there wasn't a mass exodus of players when he left WV why do we think there would be if he left Mich. 


November 29th, 2010 at 6:15 PM ^

Robinson seems to be more humble and team oriented than Mallett. Tate was recruited by Harbaugh. I think DG could succeed under Harbaugh.

Im sure we will see some transfers, but I think RR to Harbuagh or whoever will be more smooth than Carr to RR. Under a head coaching change, the OL is 10x better than it was under the previous change. This will help the offense be more successful than 08 (regardless of the system change).

The defense sucks we all know this, I think DB should focus on the defense in this decision if he's serious about winning championships. The last 5 Big Ten and NCAA champions have had solid defenses.


November 29th, 2010 at 6:18 PM ^

There is always some, but it can be minimized if the coach agrees to make some concessions to make the inherited players happy.  RR was reluctant to do this and we suffered an above-average level of attrition. 


November 29th, 2010 at 6:23 PM ^

I don't know who else would transfer.  Maybe some slot guys, Gallon or TRob, but I bet they would still be used.  Other than those guys, I think the only transfers would be guys who aren't going to see the field anyway.  Outside of slot ninjas, Harbaugh will use all the same guys in his offense.

November 29th, 2010 at 6:28 PM ^

Denard seems a lot more comfortable sitting in the pocket than Tate does, who scrambles out at first opportunity.  Tate is not much taller to see over linemen anyway, and don't forget about DG.

Captain Obvious

November 29th, 2010 at 6:49 PM ^

Denard and others specifically suited for the spread leave for more appropriate programs that will best utilize their skill sets.  I didn't begrudge Mallett et al. that left in a classy way when RR was hired for one second, even though it left UM in a lurch.  Mallett was a great QB who wasn't going to achieve what he has at Arkansas if he stayed here.  The players need to do what's best for them.  Coaching transitions are meant to include some turnover and it's not up to us to decide how these talented players need to spend their talents.

Wasting Denard's talents as a slot or some bullshit here at UM would be a travesty.  I very much hope he would follow RR or head to an Oregon type team.  He and many others with redshirt years would be better served by moving on and I would encourage them to do so.  It's hard not to be selfish and want them to stay, but I try not to be.


November 29th, 2010 at 6:55 PM ^

Wow, I just really disagree.  Mallett was different, his goal, like many other big time college players, was to prepare himself for the NFL as best he could.  RR isn't an offense built for that.  However, I don't think Denard's talents would be wasted under JH.  Denard can throw the ball well, and he might very well stay at QB.  Or, he could be Reggie Bush in a pro-style offense.  I don't think Reggie Bush's talents were wasted at USC, nor were Percy Harvin's wasted at UF. 

That's the role he would play with us if he moved positions, and no doubt JH would make sure he got he ball in his hands as much as possible.  And he's be better prepared for the NFL.  Win-win.