Realistic expectations for firing timing

Submitted by vablue on September 30th, 2014 at 8:03 AM
A thought on realistic expectations for the firings to begin. With Penn State, a far worse situation, it took until Thursday for the firing and in retrospect most consider that lightning quick. So while many may want firings now, don't expect them to happen that quickly. I understand the football team has been bad for awhile now, but that is an end of the season friable offense normally. I suspect that unless there is a massive boycott or other such impetus, you will see no movement on the coaching front for some time. I suspect the same is true of the AD position, as I am not confident the current President fully understands the role of athletics at the university just yet. Hope I am wrong on that last point.

Comments

evenyoubrutus

September 30th, 2014 at 8:05 AM ^

Given what Brian is strongly implying, if I were on the medical staff I would go right into Schlissel's office, tell him what Brandon did, and demand "either he goes or I go (to the press)." That would make it happen pretty quickly.

1464

September 30th, 2014 at 10:22 AM ^

HIPAA is only for covered entities.  Athletics are not covered.  The hospital or physician would need consent to release the information to the AD.  Once the AD has that information, they are free to do with it what they wish.

If Brandon wanted the concussion thing obfuscated, then he has no right working anywhere put one of the pizza ovens at his old stomping grounds.  That is a huge problem. If this is true, then fuck him.  Seriously, I hope his helicopter crashes, and the pilot survives without a scratch.

I dumped the Dope

September 30th, 2014 at 10:23 AM ^

I consider it a journalistic fail to report on a blog with a major following that internal pressure to outright lie as the reason for the delay.  Sure a jump of logic can be made but its a bit slanderous and unprofessional to just put this out there....unless there are sources to be revealed or who self-reveal.  Its one thing to say "its my opinion that" or "i think that" but to put it out as a fact is not right and I have to call it as anger-driven and not logically sound.

A similar jump of logic would be that Brandon wanted to meet and interview every person involved to have a full understanding of what everyone's involvement, opinion, and statement would be, before making a statement.  Don't parlay this into support for Brandon but removing all names and insert the structure into a similar undesirable situation, a leader should take appropriate time to make a full investigation.

quiverfull

September 30th, 2014 at 11:54 AM ^

talking about an obvious ankle injury takes no access to medical records - watch the tape and see the ankle get sprained.   you/me/brandon are not prohibited from saying the word 'sprain' when we can plainly see what happened.  

but the concussion injury can only be properly diagnosed by a doctor or other medical health professional.  they are prohibited from disclosing that unless consent has been given.  i assume there is some type of consent from player to team physicians and likely coaches so the team can function and plan for injury issues, but that is different than a waiver that says, in effect, 'anything the doc tells you, you can put it on twitter, facebook and TV.' 

 

1484 - your otter comment yesterday was hysterical.  good one.

edit: this was in response to duloc and 1484, but for some reason posted farther south about 5 comments.  oh well.

MIMark

September 30th, 2014 at 9:34 AM ^

It is too late for Hoke to salvage the season but not too late for the team to salvage the season.The only viable step after Saturday's Morris concussion incident and the press conferences / releases of the past 24 hours is to fire Hoke and advance an assistant to interim head coach.  The interim has got to be somebody who can light a fire under the whole team and get them to play to their potential and also somebody who is respected by the whole community.

Paging Greg Mattison.

Hannibal.

September 30th, 2014 at 9:48 AM ^

If salvaging the season means going 5-7 with non blowout losses in our remaining games versus going 2-10 with a six touchdown loss to Michigan State because the team has quit, then it is not too late to salvage the season at all.  And it needs to be done.  This program desperately needs good news and some wins.  We desperately need to look palatable for the next coach too.  We have about two months to audition ourselves to the likes of David Shaw, Todd Graham, Bret Bielema, etc etc etc.  This embarrassing, dysfunctional shit has got to stop now.  This program is losing pints of blood by the minute.  Firing Hoke won't bring immediately competence but it might bring back some desire and morale, and there just might be enough competence on the team and incompetence on the schedule to win a few games. 

If Hoke finishes the season, it's 2-10, with blowout losses to everyone but maybe Indiana.  The fact that Michigan fans are resigned to accepting this makes me sick. 

bluestaffah

September 30th, 2014 at 9:44 AM ^

once the puppet master is eliminated, I think we may see a drastic change on the field. Brando hired a yes man with Hoke so that he could call all the shots. We all know that big time coaches would tell the pizza man to hit the road, the first time he came to sit in on a film session. The Jerry Jones, Al Davis comparisons are spot on for DB. They think they know more than anyone else and want everything to be the way the say it should be, unfortunately for us, not unlike those other two teams, it has ruined the entire environment and the results no show on the field. Thank you David Brandon for turning this football program into the laughing stock of the galaxy. Go Blue.

ESNY

September 30th, 2014 at 9:55 AM ^

His career as Michigan coach is over.  Its just a question of now or in November.  He was on the thinnest of ice before Morris got hurt and this just tightened the noose around his neck.  He could be fired today for complete incompetence as a coach.  He could be fired today for negligence on his handling of Morris.   Either or both will get him fired by end of the season.

Mabel Pines

September 30th, 2014 at 8:06 AM ^

I would say everyone is mortified about poor Shane and how it was handled and we all want change.  How in the hell were people still supporting Paterno?  It's crazy to think that he had a significant amount of support after the news came out.

markusr2007

September 30th, 2014 at 8:09 AM ^

Can be contained and controlled as within a corporation, such as a faulty product or liability issue. That's not going to work here. The motivations and environment are different. Good luck with all that Dave over the next few weeks. You are going to need it.

Mr Miggle

September 30th, 2014 at 8:13 AM ^

My guess is that he's removed before the next home game at the latest. This week seems more likely. Even if the decision has already made it could take a little time before they're ready to announce it.

redsoxaa

September 30th, 2014 at 8:16 AM ^

I encourage everyone to please take a moment and contact President Schlissel and explain your connection to the University.  Explain why you refuse to be associated with a University that would employ Dave Brandon.  A man that is being paid millions of dollars to try and get highly accomplished and respected medical personnel to lie for his own personal gain.

 

Email is [email protected]

Office phone is 734-764-6270

 

I promise Brandon won't make it a week if people do this.

k.o.k.Law

September 30th, 2014 at 8:56 AM ^

I would have said it is impossible to alienate every constituency of the university, but Mr. Brandon has done so.
Let me relate two anecdotes from before the last game.
I have not requested permission to use names, so will not.
Friday I was privileged to attend the memorial for James Schneider, 31 year loyal employee of the athletic dept.
In spite of family issues which are public knowledge, Coach Carr fulfilled his commitment to the Schneider family, and apologized for having to leave early for Chad's birthday party.
I thanked the person I assumed, correctly, who was responsible for securing the Junge Center for the memorial.
I was advised that Mr. Brandon was told that he could not charge people for this event.
Mr. Brandon chose not to attend himself, with which decision I concur.
 
Saturday morning, at the tailgate always hosted by a large contributor, he informed me that an alum athlete, who had contributed 7 figures to endow scholarships for each of two separate sports programs, had requested 8 tickets for the game.
And was SOLD two separate sets of four.
He should just have purchased 8 Coke products.
Post game, Mr. Brandon throws the head football coach under the bus, by neither speaking to him nor having him informed of the results of his investigation.
The list goes on.
The ineluctable conclusion is that Mr. Brandon is not capable of competently leading the athletic department of my alma mater.
Please do all that you can to see him relieved of his duties ASAP.

Surveillance Doe

September 30th, 2014 at 9:13 AM ^

I know it's been posted a few times already, but thanks for posting this again. I'm a three-time alum. I did my post-doc at Michigan. I'm an active donor. I am a class agent for my law school graduating class. While I don't think I am unique, especially among the crowd on MGoBlog, I do think I am a member of a population who should be heard by the administration. Anyway, I just wrote a long letter to Schlissel, and I assured him that I would be withholding future support until Brandon is removed. I hope others do the same.

FreddieMercuryHayes

September 30th, 2014 at 8:16 AM ^

Depends on how much Brandon is feeling the heat. If Brandon feels like his head is on the chopping block imminently, I can see him firing Hoke like this week or something in an attempt to save his own hide. If not, end of season. For Brandon's firing, I'll believe it when it happens.

Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad

GoBlueInNYC

September 30th, 2014 at 8:20 AM ^

Hoke won't be fired until after the season. My guess? With no bowl game to go to, it takes 1-2 weeks post-OSU for official word. And I think that's regardless of what happens with Brandon.

Brandon? Who knows. His tenure has been an unmitigated disaster, but I don't know what kind of precendent there is for firing ADs, how bad for how long before they get the axe. Compound that with the recent presidential turnover, it's really hard to guage how close he is to getting ousted. You know it's bad when the AD is being called out via chants for your firing on TV broadcasts, but I really have no idea what it takes for someone like Brandon to get fired.

wlubd

September 30th, 2014 at 8:23 AM ^

Re: Hoke, The Game is November 29th. I'd be stunned if he's employed at noon on December 1st. He should be gone now but I definitely think there's an issue getting an interim HC and Brandon cannot be trusted to do a coaching search. That gives Michigan 2 months to get a replacement AD in.

GoBlueInNYC

September 30th, 2014 at 8:31 AM ^

I think Hoke gets a customary "we'll think about it" period of a week or so, but that it's actually decided long before the Game that he's gone. The coaching search and stuff will probably happen as soon as the season ends, if not even a little before.

I think he should be the coach throughout the season, because I really don't think there's any benefit to firing him midseason. But I think the instant that clock hits 0:00 in Columbus, he's done, not matter how long it takes the university to announce it.

karpodiem

September 30th, 2014 at 8:31 AM ^

to Brandon or Hoke until attendence dips below 80K, for multiple consecutive games. Until then you can keep dreaming. The timeline that MGoBlog and Twitter think this is all going to happen is laughable. It's going to take at least a year, at the earliest. I would say two years.

Hoke is going to be around for 2015 because the coaching talent pool is shallow and we need a slam dunk hire. If this was a good year for coaching replacements, it might happen this year, but that's not the case.

kjblue42

September 30th, 2014 at 8:31 AM ^

Two years?? That my friend is laughable, attendance has guaranteed dropped to 80 thousand in actual ticket sales.. They are giving away thousands for nothing to charities to fill the stadium. You think they are going to let the dumpster fire continue in A2 for two years, you are severely mistaken and far disconnected from reality. Do you see all the petitioning coming from every angle?? That is what it takes.. Depending on whether it happens in the middle of the season depends on how bad the next game or two goes and the embarrassment along with it.

GoBlueInNYC

September 30th, 2014 at 8:35 AM ^

People always complain about the coaching pool being shallow. What do you think is going to change in 2015? Coaches aren't like NFL players, whose contracts come up and become free agents. Coaches who are doing well are always going to be locked into contracts. There's never not going to be a shallow talent pool for good coaches. You either lure the established ones away (either with money or promises of more automony) or you identify the up-and-comers. Next season will be no different than this season which will be no different than last season.

karpodiem

September 30th, 2014 at 8:57 AM ^

Much like the post-2010 season coaching search.

Nothing happens fast and there has been _zero_ indication that the AD is willing to pay big (10 milion for head coach along with OC/DC) to get a winner. They'll get someone for 3 or 4 million, he may or may not work out. 

This isn't an intellectual arguement - this has happened now, once. It's about to happen again in a year.

GoBlueInNYC

September 30th, 2014 at 9:12 AM ^

I'm pretty sure Hoke has a salary that ranks in the top ten for head coaches (link), and both OC and DC salaries are among the highest. So yes, the AD has absolutely demonstrated that they are willing to throw money around to hire coaches.

And speaking of setting onself up for disappointments, please explain how if we keep waiting, there will somehow be a crop of great coaches that are available waiting to be hired if we just postpone the next coaching search long enough.

(And for what it's worth, in my post above, I have no idea how long it will take for Brandon to go. I am doubtful he'll be gone ASAP the way some are hoping.)

J.Madrox

September 30th, 2014 at 9:12 AM ^

You never addressed the previous posters point. You claim they can't fire Hoke because they need a slam dunk hire, so what makes you think the coaching pool will be any deeper next year, or the year after that? Is it your belief that Michigan is going to wait around year after year until a big time candidate becomes available? What happens if that coach doesn't want to come to Michigan, do you keep Hoke on again?

You also imply Michigan isn't willing to pay big money, you do realize Hoke is currently the 7th or 8th highest paid coach in the country with an annual salary of more than 4 M, so you think his replacement will get less?

You may be right, this will probably not happen with the speed fans around here want, but to imply Hoke will keep his job solely because there are no viable candidates out there that you, a MGoBlog poster, think is a slam dunk hire or that Michigan isn't willing to pay big money is off-base.

karpodiem

September 30th, 2014 at 10:05 AM ^

I don't know if it's going to be deeper next year but in the absence of a solid option, they'll keep him. We have a for sure thing today (bad pool) to delay in the hope of a better pool tomorrow and it spares us the embarrassment (_their_ embarassment, the AD. The AD doesn't care how you feel, unless it impacts the money) of the firing a coach for another day. This kind of how, you know, our government works as well. Not saying this is how things _should_ be done, it's just how things are. 

The AD will wait until the very last moment or if it's a complete and total collapse that brings seating down to below 80K for multiple consecutive games, like I originally said. This is the only series of events that will yield us a new coach in 2014.

It has to hit them where it hurts - money from attendance. It's already bad, but it's got to be 'stadium quarter empty even with tickets being given away bad' for something to happen.

J.Madrox

September 30th, 2014 at 10:52 AM ^

I am not trying to attack you here, I am just genuinely curious as to how you believe the pool will just magically improve in future years. What kind of coach are you expecting to come along that will be a home run hire? Major, established coaches don't come along very often, if they do exsist, no matter how remote the chances (Harbaugh's) you need to do everything you can to get them.

If you believe Michigan is not willing to do whatever it takes thats fine, I can't really dispute that, especially as long as Brandon is the AD. I just dont understand how you think they are going to stick with a coach who has demonstrated he is terrible simply because there is no overwhelmingly good hire out there. There are multiple coaches out there destined to be succesful big time coaches, Michigan just needs to find the right one.

I guess I may just be trying to apply a level of logic here that Dave Brandon doesn't possess. Michigan will never be good again if they just sit around and wait for a "home run" hire to come along, those guys just don't fall into your lap. You are entitled to your opinion and I am not trying to attack it, but for Michigan footballs sake I really hope you are wrong.