OT: Tigers Open Thread

Submitted by Moleskyn on May 24th, 2012 at 12:13 PM

Taking on the Indians in game 3. Verlander vs. Masterson.

For all of you trolling Leyland-haters, feel free to stay out of this thread. Nobody cares about what you have to say. Now, if you want to have reasoned discourse, then feel free to add your thoughts. Just stay away from name-calling, all caps, and lots of exclamation points.

Go Tigers!

Comments

Moleskyn

May 24th, 2012 at 12:17 PM ^

Welp, Choo just led off by taking Verlander yard on a hanging breaking ball. At least Verlander got rid of any doubt about a possible no-hitter early.

1-0 Indians.

EnoughAlready

May 24th, 2012 at 12:21 PM ^

"For all you trolling [by implication, irrational] Leyland-haters..." -- Just stay away and shaddup!  We want to stay away from name-calling, you "trolling Leyland-haters."  But for people who want sober, reasoned discussion, I'm all ears!  Just shaddup if you don't like Leyland.

You should get an AM radio talk show.

Moleskyn

May 24th, 2012 at 12:31 PM ^

Man, bad decision by Boesch to go home. He was on 3rd with 1 out, Peralta hits a grounder right at the 3rd-baseman and Boesch goes home. Out by a mile. Frustrating.

winterblue75

May 24th, 2012 at 12:32 PM ^

I'm far from a troll, but I am a Leyland hater. He is an uninspring, excuse making, rely on the same people bad outing after bad outing manager who needs to go.

Moleskyn

May 24th, 2012 at 12:45 PM ^

Fair enough. Just because you have issues with Leyland doesn't make you a troll; that's not what I was saying. I was more referring to people like GoBlueMich. It's people like him who can't say anything WITHOUT REVERTING TO ALL CAPS and calling Leyland ridiculous names. OH YEAH, AND THE EXCLAMATION POINTS!!!!!

winterblue75

May 24th, 2012 at 1:02 PM ^

Managers and coaches get fired all the time when they have no control of the players they have to choose from, that's the business. Most of the time it's just the fact that the leader has worn out their welcome. They become old, tired, and stale and the players don't respond to them anymore. That is where Leyland is right now.

winterblue75

May 24th, 2012 at 1:09 PM ^

Sorry, I don't have any hard evidence. That's just the impression I get from watching this team night after night. No one on the outside can really tell when the players have stopped responding or don't care, but that never stops fans from calling for the managers/coaches head.

Sometimes it just looks like a shake up needs to happen. To me this is what one of those times looks like.

 

Moleskyn

May 24th, 2012 at 1:16 PM ^

Ok, but let's say the Tigers lose today; a sweep to the Indians. So Dombrowski goes and fires Leyland, because the team needs a spark. And let's say they go out and hire Manager X (we could even say Terry Francona, since he's probably the first guy people will say anyway). So they've shaken things up and done what they can to "light a fire." Is that going to all of a sudden make guys like Avila, Boesch, and Peralta turn things around, stop swinging at crap pitches, and start making plays in the field? Maybe, but I don't see how the head coach has much of an influence on those things. Maybe Francona would make them spend extra time working on their skills? I mean, I just don't see how firing Leyland really solves anything.

Moleskyn

May 24th, 2012 at 2:02 PM ^

I think that's a fair question. And I guess I don't really have a good answer. But I think you need to have a realistic purpose in mind for doing it. I've not seen any (nor done any) research to see what kind of effect firing a manager typically has on a team. I understand the thinking behind it (shaking things up to wake guys up and light a fire under them), but I don't know that there is any merit to that. Look at the Cubs; they've had a revolving door for the past few years, and what good has that done them?

If the manager is creating an atmosphere of laziness, entitlement, or carelessness, then I would see a reason behind firing him. Is that the case with Leyland? I can't say, because I don't have access to their locker room, or what they do on a daily basis.

Moleskyn

May 24th, 2012 at 2:17 PM ^

It's possible the coaching change had something to do with that, but so far, that's circumstantial at best. And I'm not saying my Cubs example proves much, either, but the bottom line is that, unless someone has done some research on this topic, it's just an unproven hypothesis at this point.

GoBlueMich02

May 24th, 2012 at 12:33 PM ^

No talking about how horrible the manager has been this year! Or how his ridiculous playing of Inge, Don Kelly, etc. has cost the team.

Any real tigers fan knows it's time. #Fireleyland

BOX House

May 24th, 2012 at 12:59 PM ^

I agree somewhat. Knowledgable Tigers fans know that Leyland isn't the only problem. But I do think he is part of it. One of the bigger issues I have is that he continues to throw Putkonen and Balester out in close games. 

Jackson getting back should help a ton. But if Prince doesn't heat up then this team just isn't going to be as good as we though pre-season.

JBE

May 24th, 2012 at 1:06 PM ^

Well, Balester has been DFA'd, and, although I'm not absolutely sure, Putkonen seems to be simply holding a spot until Marte is ready.  

Injuries have really hurt.  With Al Al and Marte injured, Balester and Putkonen and Below are really the only choices Leyland has when the SP is knocked out early, or when he has to spell the back end of the bullpen. 

WMUgoblue

May 24th, 2012 at 1:10 PM ^

Hopefully Marte brings some stability to the bullpen, but aside from Coke they don't have a single lefty specialist down there. Below is the long innings man and should be used in more than just matchup situations, so we need another lefty arm in the pen.

JBE

May 24th, 2012 at 12:44 PM ^

Berry's played pretty well since his call up. I wouldn't mind adding some speed to this team, maybe batting Berry 9th to turn the lineup over, but right now there's really no place for him to get regular ABs unless he can play 2nd. 

Moleskyn

May 24th, 2012 at 1:02 PM ^

I know who Berry is, but shoot, if he shows that he can get on base more than Santiago or Raburn, and field the position halfway decently, he'd be an upgrade at the position. I'd take a .270 hitter with speed over Santiago or Raburn. That's assuming he wouldn't be more of an assclown at second than Raburn.

WMUgoblue

May 24th, 2012 at 1:05 PM ^

Delmon's hitting .339 since the Oakland series and appears to be settling into the DH role, Boesch has picked his average up quite a bit, they need Peralta and Avila to show up with men on base. The team has holes dont get me wrong, but they have the talent to run away from teams if they can get it together.

graybeaver

May 24th, 2012 at 1:16 PM ^

Why do people say that its not Leylands fault that the players suck right now?  If the manager has nothing to do with teams performance then why have one?  Its the managers job to get his players to perform well.  So far the Tigers haven't played well except for the first ten games of the season.  I don't think Leyland should be fired,  but it drives me insane when people say that he isn't the one pitching or hitting.  It wasn't Greg Robinsons fault that the players couldn't tackle either.  Why weren't you same people sticking up for him?

Lionsfan

May 24th, 2012 at 1:42 PM ^

I know I shouldn't reply to trolls, but there's a huge difference. One is coaching kids/young adults who are still getting used to playing the game, and not just being able to out-physical the kids like back in High School.

And the other is taking a bunch of mid/late 20's, early 30's guys who are the best in the world at what they do. They don't need to be taught how to play the game, they already know how. So no, it's not Leyland's job to tell his players how to hit, or pitch. They have guys to fine-tune those aspects of the game, but the players already know how to do that

Wolverine 73

May 24th, 2012 at 3:18 PM ^

with the Tigers is just this sort of complaining.  They are moaning about calls constantly.  They did it last night, whining about pitches that were plainly strikes on the corners.  ( I was sitting right behind the plate and watching.)  The umpiring wasn't great, but it wasn't one-sided.  The Tigers are a team that is feeling pressure because they are not performing up to expectations, and they are looking for someone else to blame for their failures.  That is not normally a formula for turning things around.

JBE

May 24th, 2012 at 1:22 PM ^

Dan and Jim have pointed this out on the radio, but I love how when Cabby check swings he's the one that calls for help from the 1st base umpire. It's hilarious.