OT - Monday Night Tigers Thread (Sky Is Not Falling Version)

Submitted by MGoBender on July 22nd, 2013 at 11:02 PM

Tigers threads almost always get started after losses nowadays, so I wanted to mix it up and maybe discuss things other than reactionary statements after a loss.  Here's some bullets that hopefully will spark some discussion.

  • OMG Miggy left the game today!  Day-to-Day with a sore hip flexor.
  • Tigers bounce back to win the last two games after dropping the first two to start the second half.
  • Tigers put another whooping on Chris Sale. 
  • VMart's average is up to .270 (!!!).  He went 4-5 tonight and has been on an absolute tear.
  • Rondoner has pitched 4.1 innings since the break (appearing in each game) and has given up just 1 run: a balked in run tonight.
  • The LA Dodgers have reported put their hat in the K-Rod race.
  • Omar Infante still a bit away from returning.

Here's my question:

If the price gets too high for K-Rod (is there such a thing as too high a price this year?) does acquiring a left-handed bat become a better deadline move?

Comments

MGoGarbs

July 22nd, 2013 at 11:21 PM ^

The pitching market seems like a very demanding one this year. where would you put a lefty bat? I assume you're talking about replacing Dirks in the platoon with Tuiopposopo, but I'm not sure it's time to give up on him yet. I guess I'm in the small minority that thinks no trade, or one for a lesser-known reliever, would be enough to get this team to the Series.

MGoBender

July 22nd, 2013 at 11:53 PM ^

Yes, it would be nice to have a LH bat off the bench that isn't Dirks or Kelly.

I think Rondon would have to really show he's the man over the next 2 weeks for the tigers to not get a reliever (or a closer level reliever), but a LH hitter is definitely the next theoretical piece I think they have to consider upgrading.

Dirks has been brutal against lefties (and righties) and when you start looking at a series against the Rays and Matt Moore, that becomes worrisome to me. I think Leyland pretty much said that Tui is the guy against lefties, but what if his hot streak ends?

xxxxNateDaGreat

July 22nd, 2013 at 11:22 PM ^

I think that's why I like football the most out of any sport. 16 games means a losing streak is a real problem. 160 games means a losing streak happens every other week or so and everyone still panics.

Maizeforlife

July 22nd, 2013 at 11:42 PM ^

Bats aren't the real problem with this team.  Even down the batting order, they can all come and go at times, but in general, are at least where we need them to be.  The focus for the tigers to be able to make a late season run will be to shore up their late game pitching - especially at the closer position.  

MGoBender

July 22nd, 2013 at 11:55 PM ^

Ajax, miggy, hunter, and peralta skew how good the lineup is. Outside Prince and VMart, the tigers have no left handed hitting. Avila, Kelly, and dirks... I trust none of them in the playoffs

bronxblue

July 23rd, 2013 at 1:08 PM ^

But if you have Prince and VMart hitting well against Lefties plus a guy like Miggy who can hit against anyone, I'm not sure you are going to find another suitable bat in the market that will have a demonstrative impact.  I mean, sure you can get a guy better than Kelly or Dirks, but maybe only 10-15% better.  That doesn't seem worth it.  I'd rather the team swing for a Best Player Available and otherwise just stand pat.

MGoBlue96

July 23rd, 2013 at 12:13 AM ^

that, but Benoit has been lights out so far in save situations. I know his past record is that he is better in the set-up role, but so far I see no reason why the Tigers couldn't either acquire a set-up man or a closer. Only looking at closers is shrinking the potential market.

Overall though, the Tigers need to get on a consistent roll of some kind (though acquiring a reliever is probally needed before that will happen). Tired of this hot and cold business so far this year.

JBE

July 22nd, 2013 at 11:58 PM ^

I'm starting to think the Tigers don't need a closer. Benoit has been lights out this year in both roles. Bullpen help would be nice, but Rondon is coming on strong and Coke has had a couple good outings in row, although he only pitched to one batter tonight. Get Coke going, Rondon some confidence and Smyly and Benoit maintaining what they're doing and the Tigers seem in pretty good shape.

WMUgoblue

July 23rd, 2013 at 12:40 AM ^

V-Mart has raised his average 45 points in the last 20 games, he's been raking. Just curious, realistically who's available bat wise because I haven't seen many names out there (Give me the Left handed Marcus Thames!!). Benoit has been outstanding so far as a closer so a 9th inning guy isn't the primary need but getting another late inning arm would be wise, also 7-8th inning guy are much cheaper than closers.

Speaking of K-Rod, with the Dodgers getting involved that might be enough for me to say no thanks from the Tigers perspective. The price will continue to increase everyday until he's dealt and I'm not sure the Tigers can outbid Boston or LA for his services. The more realistic option if you wanna continue to talk with the Brewers is to ask for John Axford, while he has been up and down the last few years he seems to be hitting his groove right now and would be worth a shot, especially since he could be acquired for a toolsy prospect that isn't in our plans for the immediate future.

 

DK81

July 23rd, 2013 at 12:43 AM ^

Anyone know the deal with Jesse Crain? I heard his name floating around a few weeks back but then he was put on the 15 day DL. I don't know if he would be worth giving up much for considering the injury. Assuming the White Sox would want to deal him to a division rival.

Yinka Double Dare

July 23rd, 2013 at 10:27 AM ^

I think the White Sox will take the best offer regardless of who they send him to, since he's a free agent after the season.  He's on the DL with tendonitis at the moment, so I doubt anyone will even consider trading for him until at least he has thrown in a minor league game, if not fully back up in the majors.  Sort of running out of time there...

Re: the same division thing, If anything, long term it's almost better for the Sox if the Tigers finally win a title, because there's at least a chance Illitch will stop throwing so much money at the team once they do win one.  Not that he'll force a teardown or anything, but they probably won't be doing things like the Fielder signing anymore.  And since Crain is an impending free agent, it's not really a big deal to trade him within the division.

LSAClassOf2000

July 23rd, 2013 at 9:00 AM ^

The last twenty games for Victor Martinez, if I pulled the right stuff from Fangraphs, have seen him go 35-87 at the plate (0.402 BA) with eight doubles, two home runs, 12 runs scored and 14 RBIs. That would put his OBP around 0.460 (hand figuring there) with a slugging percentage in the 0.600 range (did this one on paper too). Those may not be exact figures, but the last three weeks of Victor Martinez have been fun to watch. 

Prince Lover

July 23rd, 2013 at 12:11 AM ^

They need relievers. Smyly good, Benoit good, then who else? Rondon has been better lately but what was his biggest issue? Consistency on the big stage. He may be getting better in the bigs, but what happens when the playoffs start. I don't want to put money on that. Albuquerque? Same comments as Rondon. Coke? I'm assuming we're all Tiger fans so no comment needed. Seriously, 2 trustworthy relievers wont make it out of the 1st round.
They will need to get 1 (probably 2) relievers if they want to take it to the next level. And if all goes well, maybe a left handed bat would be thrown in, in one of these trades.

Generic MGoBlogger

July 23rd, 2013 at 12:20 AM ^

My thought is that once the playoffs start we go down to a four starter rotation. That leftover starter will then go into the bullpen... Probably Porcello. This adds depth in the case of relievers but you are definitely right when you say we need probably 2 relievers. Plus we just aren't sure how a starter like Porcello will handle himself in big game situations like the playoffs.

Generic MGoBlogger

July 23rd, 2013 at 12:26 AM ^

It just pains me that we may have to give up some of our young potential talent in the outfield for the bullpen issue. The Peralta situation just pisses me off because until I hear otherwise, I'm assuming he will be gone the rest of the season. I doubt we see a move made for a middle infielder or SS with our bullpen issues, but it may be painful trying to watch Santiago and Perez (or whoever the heck from AAA) play SS for the remainder of the season. Hopefully the starting pitching can stay consistent and the hitting doing a lot of the same.

WMUgoblue

July 23rd, 2013 at 12:34 AM ^

If you're worried about us trading Garcia or Castellanos for bullpen help i'd advise you to back away from the ledge, teams don't trade one of their top 2 prospects for 7/8th inning relievers.

Now if the "potential talent" your talking about is the likes of Tyler Collins, Daniel Fields, or Steven Moya than I suppose you have a right to be a bit disappointed but these guys weren't going to make an impact for another 3-4 years down the road (if ever considering the fail rate of prospects.)

Prince Lover

July 23rd, 2013 at 12:35 AM ^

That does bring up a good point, that could send the tigers trade hopes in a big and different direction. Personally I think the union will appeal his suspension and he'll get to play the rest of the year. That is 100% opinion based only on the fact that this is his 1st time ever been mentioned in association with peds. And a little bit of wishful thinking too.

MGoBlue96

July 23rd, 2013 at 12:52 AM ^

Major League Baseball, better have more solid evidence than was initially reported regarding Peralta, otherwise a suspension based on flimsy evidence is somewhat ridiculous. The initial report said that Peralta's name only came up once in the documents. Unless they have more than that, which to me wouldn't include the "word" of a slimeball like Bosch, than a suspension seems out of line. This also goes for any of the other players where the evidence isn't rock solid. Still holding out hope that this is the case, and there simply is not enough evidence against Peralta for a suspension.

baldurblue

July 23rd, 2013 at 10:33 AM ^

We need relief.  As consistently inconsistent as this lineup is, I think there's too much talent and firepower to go looking for another bat.  The 4 man rotation for the playoffs is a good point, so right now there's basically Benoit, Smyly, and Rondon, I think Downs(?) has good numbers, but he's on the DL.  Other than that nobody has good stats, there's a lot of talent and potential, I like Villareal and Al Al, but these guys haven't shown the consistency.

I've heard minor talk about Dirks being traded, I think Garcia seems pretty much Major League ready, you could trade Dirks and one or two lower level infield or outfield prospects for solid reliever on a noncontender.  I don't know who that reliever is but I think he's out there.

Moleskyn

July 23rd, 2013 at 10:39 AM ^

Yeah, Miggy didn't look too good yesterday. Hopefully it's just general soreness and something that can get healed with a few days off and rest. If he goes on the DL, I wonder if Castellanos would get called up.

I've been really happy to see VMart heat up. I knew it would happen eventually, and it's just really good to finally see him get into a groove. He provides such great depth to our lineup.

I've been cautiously optimistic about Rondon lately. In his last 9 2/3 innings, he has only 2 walks, with 10 K's, and he hasn't walked a batter in his last 4 appearances. Granted, he's had a couple shaky outings during that span, but his biggest struggle has been his control, and he seems to working that out. If he keeps this up, he's going to be the lights out addition to our bullpen that we've needed. With him, Smyly, and Benoit all pitching well, our bullpen all of a sudden becomes much less of a liability, especially heading into the postseason.

We really need Infante back, especially if the crap hits the fan with Peralta. I'm not sure if he'll get suspended, and I had actually read a report a couple weeks ago that MLB wasn't going to be handing any suspensions this year...but I'm not so sure about that, now that Braun has been suspended. Granted, he may be the exception and we don't see anybody else get suspended this year, but I don't know. Bottom line is, we need Infante back soon. I cringe at the thought of a middle infield of Perez and Santiago.

MGoBender

July 23rd, 2013 at 11:48 AM ^

Another good point on the bullpen that has been brought up:

Come playoff time, Porcello will be in the pen. That gives us 4 arms out there that I would personally trust: Porcello, Rondon, Smyly, Benoit.  Adding one more would be nice, but it doesn't have to be a 9th inning guy. (A LH specialist for cheap would even do the trick for me, assuming the 'Doner continues this recent success).

Adding a guy like K-Rod would be wonderful.  Forget Axford, I want nothing to do with him.  But sticking with the Brewers, would Jim Henderson be available?  They likely wouldn't trade two of their relievers, but if we can get him before someone else gets K-Rod....

Steve Cishek is closing games in Miami (once a millenia since the Marlins can't score).  He had a rocky start and then a stretch when he was lights out.  Miami is always looking to trade for prospects and I can't imagine them putting a huge value on a closer right now.

As for hitters, here's some LH OFs that could be available:

  1. Alejandro De Aza (White Sox...)
  2. Nate Schierholtz (Cubs)
  3. Andre Ethier (LAD)
  4. Norichika Aoki (MIL)

Schierholtz probably the most likely get for the Tigers.  Wouldn't break the bank but would immediately be an upgrade over Dirks and likely Tui (unless he continues to be Puig-lite)  Aoki would be great as he's a near .300 hitter with speed and has a great team option for next year.  The Rangers are reportedly in talks for Aoki.