(OFFICAL per fox sports) ND suspends 3 starters, 1 backup for academic fraud

Submitted by orobs on August 15th, 2014 at 11:59 AM

 

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=109&f=2594&t=13053689

http://www.uhnd.com/bb/forum/index.php?action=display&forumid=6&msgid=2…

http://notredame.247sports.com/Board/87/Contents/Staff-Academic-Issue-R…

http://www.irishenvy.com/forums/notre-dame-football/203702-rumored-viol…

Supposedly, 3 starters, 1 backup

 

again, rumor, but "Hearing Moore (backup LB), Ishaq (starting DE), Daniels (starting wideout), and Russell (starting CB)... FWIW"

 

UPDATE

 

Leading story is a female tutor doing players' homework in exchange for....services.  If true, players will likely be expelled.  Also potential for vacating 2012 "Return to glory" version 5.0 season.  

 

UPDATE #2 

 

The four alleged players were not seen at ND practice today, which is the first official reporting suggesting some truth the rumors.

http://notredame.247sports.com/Bolt/Players-Missing-From-Fridays-Practi…

 

UPDATE #3

Yahoo Sports sources: Academic probe underway at Notre Dame involving football players. Story: http://yhoo.it/1oOXKnQ 

 

Now official per fox sports

http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/story/notre-dame-fighting-iri…

 

Comments

GoWings2008

August 15th, 2014 at 12:05 PM ^

Considering how ND claims to give academics a lot of attention in their program, what happens to these guys over the long term will be very telling.  EDIT:  Some talk about inelgible players and vacating wins, possibly.  We'll see....  May overshadow our 2 new Home/Home series news?  /s

stephenrjking

August 15th, 2014 at 12:10 PM ^

Let's be fair: If this is true, it gives credibility to the idea that Notre Dame takes academics seriously. Remember when Auburn and LSU had to sit all those guys for academic issues? Of course not, because... obviously.

Notre Dame takes academics seriously, thus guys who don't make the grade actually sit out, even if they were going to be a starting quarterback. It's like sports that take doping seriously--the ones that do actually catch people juicing. The ones that don't never have a positive test ever, because they aren't actually trying to suppress it.

GoWings2008

August 15th, 2014 at 12:13 PM ^

And that's why I tabled it with, "If they take it seriously..." then what actuatlly happens to these individuals over the long term will be telling.  If they're suspended for a year like Gholson was, then its consistent.  If anything less, and considering how serious the infractions are, who knows.  No judgment from me, just an interest in what happens next.

mjv

August 15th, 2014 at 12:22 PM ^

It depends on what the issues are.  The general consensus was that Gholson was caught cheating, not so much a grades issue.  I suspect that most schools are more aggressive in punishing cheating than punishing students who fail to meet certain grade standards.

MChem83

August 15th, 2014 at 12:49 PM ^

The fact that he had to cheat in the first place is a good indication that he was actually being expected to perform academically. At a non-Vanderbilt SEC school, he would have just been eased through with winks and nods, and individual cheating wouldn't even have been necessary.

stephenrjking

August 15th, 2014 at 12:22 PM ^

Given what surveys say about rampant cheating and plagiarism throughout American academia, the culture is pretty much ubiquitous in this country. I think that's bad, by the way. I don't think we can consider Notre Dame worse than most other places, just better at actually dealing with what they find.

ijohnb

August 15th, 2014 at 12:34 PM ^

given what surveys say about rampant cheating and plagiarism throughout American academia, the culture is pretty much ubiquitous in this country. I think that's bad, by the way. I don't think we can consider Notre Dame worse than most other places, just better at actually dealing with what they find. 

GoBLUinTX

August 15th, 2014 at 12:23 PM ^

to the idea ND takes seriously that those who aren't academically eligible will be suspended etc.  But let's not get ahead of ourselves and give them credit for the punishment phase and extrapolate that out to taking academics serious.  If they were taking academics serious wouldn't it follow they wouldn't have players in academic trouble?  

You implied, using Auburn and LSU as examples, that if a school isn't suspending players for academic problems they A) Don't take academics serious and B) They're hiding something.  Fine, using that logic does that mean Michigan doesn't take player academics serious and is Michigan hiding something?  I'm sure you didn't, but that's where your logic was leading.

I think what we have going on here is that ND the school takes academics far more serious than ND the football program.

stephenrjking

August 15th, 2014 at 12:42 PM ^

What I was doing was refuting the idea that Notre Dame must be a hotbed of academic dishonesty because they catch people engaging in it, when in fact catching people involved in it is a sign they take it seriously. I used Auburn and LSU as examples of schools widely believed to be engaged in unethical practices who probably don't take class all that seriously--they don't seem to have a lot of academic scandals, and that's not necessarily a sign that they are morally superior in this area.

This can be a key issue, because if people bash schools who catch cheaters while assuming that schools who don't catch them are clean, the net effect is that schools will actually enhance their academic reputation by covering up scandals and acting like they don't exist. That was a serious problem with doping in cycling, for example--the UCI did not want Lance Armstrong to test positive because it would taint the public image of the sport. As a result, the sport was much dirtier.

jtmc33

August 15th, 2014 at 12:50 PM ^

Good for ND... and good for UM for having those standards.   But shame on the "student-athletes" that forget to study.

UM has graduated 69 of 69 seniors since Hoke started.    This will be 4 starters that ND had to suspend for academics.   I like this trend.

 

jtmc33

August 15th, 2014 at 1:44 PM ^

I root for my team to win.   I never root for any person to fail off the field to help my team get that win.  That's just petty. 

And "rooting" for someone to fail won't work unless you actually know voo-doo or are a diety.  I don't and am not, so, I won't waste my time.

But never forget that these are grown men and they are capable of making the right decision in life.  I never hope for individual failure, however, if York or these ND players fail to make the right decisions then they face the consquences.   And how that shapes their team is also a consequence.

Rooting for failure?   No.     Acknowledging the effects of one's failure?   Just factual observation.

Oscar

August 15th, 2014 at 4:52 PM ^

Fair enough, and after rereading your post, I think I was keying on the "I like this trend". I should have given you the benefit of the doubt that you were referring to UM's positives rather than ND's negatives.

edit: after rereading my post, that sounded smug, no smug was intended.

Maize and Blue…

August 15th, 2014 at 1:11 PM ^

between not making the grade and CHEATING.  Then again, I guess if you're not going to the make it may be what caused you to cheat.

If you read some of the comments further down it sounds as if an academic advisor may have been fudging grades in 2012 and they may be vacating wins for playing ineligible players.  One poster was very upset as Brian Kelly was suppose to get their academic standards "dumbed down" so they could get more 5 stars.

Wolverine 73

August 15th, 2014 at 1:29 PM ^

I agree with your point generally, but if the rumors reported by the OP are true, this goes somewhat beyond cheating.  I would think most schools would treat trading "services" for schoolwork a bit more seriously than "someone did a term paper for me because I'm on the FB team."  It is a bit more unseemly when there is a quid pro quo. 

93Grad

August 15th, 2014 at 1:09 PM ^

happen at every school, including Michigan, you are mistaken.  Of course, its the same with players getting $ from boosters.  No program can claim to be 100% clean. What separates the good programs from the bad, is the culture they establish, including what they do to those found to guilty of violating the rules.

93Grad

August 15th, 2014 at 1:33 PM ^

at least 2 posters have their heads in the sand.  Cheating happens at every institution by athletes and non-athletes alike.  No school or team can stop it 100% of the time from ocurring. What matters is what each school does to prevent it in the first place and what they do once it is discovered to have ocurred.  I would hope and expect that Michigan would handle such an incident appropriately.

LSAClassOf2000

August 15th, 2014 at 12:38 PM ^

If the "Daniels" mentioned in the OP is DeVaris Daniels, then it is definitely sad because - if there is something going on here and his name did indeed turn up - this was his second chance actually. He was suspended in the winter for failing to maintain academic eligibility along with ND hoops standout Jerian Grant.