Non-Coaching Issues With RR

Submitted by michgoblue on October 31st, 2010 at 1:00 AM

I am sure that there will be numerous posts criticizing RR as a coach.  While I agree with those criticisms, this is not the subject of this post.  Rather, my criticism is with some statements that RR has made to the press.

Watching this game, one of the announcers commented that RR said to him that he hoped to find a FG kicker on the trip to Penn State. It sounded like ajoking comment, but if this is what he said, than he is an ass.  OUr FG kickers are not good.  Fine, we know.  But they are young men coming to practice every day to try to help M win.  How do you think they feel hearing RR say things like that?  How do they feel when RR says (earlier this year) that he would welcome students to cme and try out for the kicker job.  Talk about undermining a kid's confidence. 

More importantly, if I were a parent of a recruit, and I heard that RR mad statements like that publicly, I would think twice about sending my son to play for him. 

Comments

raleighwood

October 31st, 2010 at 1:03 AM ^

He's thrown his players under the bus numerous times during his tenure.  It's hard to figure out.  Usually the coach takes a "the buck stops here" approach.  RR doesn't do that.

raleighwood

October 31st, 2010 at 1:23 AM ^

Here are a few examples (and I'm going to paraphrase)...

"We're looking for a kicker on the way to Happy Valley this weekend"

"Vince Lombardi couldn't come in and fix the defense"

"We'll win when we have better players" ....after OSU loss last year.  That one in particular concerns me because OSU totally out-recruits Michigan right now.

In my view, he tends to deflect the blame to the players.

TheVictors97

October 31st, 2010 at 1:28 AM ^

I agree. He has continued to trash the kickers all year. When will he step up and place some of the blame on himself? HR was the one that offered Gibbons a scholarship wasn't he? Maybe his ability to judge talent and retain players should be questioned, instead of always trying to blame others.

maizedandconfused

October 31st, 2010 at 10:24 AM ^

Well raleigh, we were looking for a kicker on the way to Happy Valley, and I dont know if you were watching but the way we looked last night he might have just called a spade a spade on that defense.

Secondly, those comments are not  throwing players under the bus.. comments like "Mike Martin needs to man up through his injury" or "JT Flyod needs to be more athletic" or "Our entire LB corp has played like a bunch of women".. thats throwing players under the bus... singling out A player is throwing them under the bus, commenting on an entire unit is just talking about your team.I realize he said he was trying to find a kicker, but Im guessing that it was taken out of context and that he was trying to go with the lighthearted "were trying to find which kicker were going to use on the bus"

M-Wolverine

October 31st, 2010 at 1:48 AM ^

To other teams to know how other coaches do it at other schools? Because I don't know how much of this is a lack of responsibility, or just system shock from Lloyd who would never blame a player or assistant, and would always want the press to put it on his shoulders. (He occasionally call out a player to get him on the same page for disciplinary reasons, but never for screwing up
<br>a play).

MadtownMaize

October 31st, 2010 at 11:15 AM ^

John Navarre was the reason UM lost to OSU in 01' . Lloyd not only stood by him, he admonished anyone in the press who called him out. He protected his player/student-athlete. By Navarre's senior season he had learned to stay clam in the pocket, step up to avoid the rush, and deliver the pass accurately under duress. UM beat OSU 35-21.

    I agree that RR has deflected criticism many times over his short tenure here. He has also referrenced the Lion King at press confrerences more than once. All of these things would be glossed over if he actually won games.

kgh10

October 31st, 2010 at 4:40 PM ^

Like, what the fuck is that supposed to mean?  I know this is a mostly male-particpating board and I really don't post much anymore...but I'm asking you to seriously relax with comments like that. There are many other ways to express your point without insinuating something about those with that particular plumbing.

maizenbluedevil

October 31st, 2010 at 1:09 AM ^

Regarding what was said by the announcers during the game, I thought the same as sixwingedangel above.

Regarding open tryouts - Are you effing serious??  So, he's supposed to not try and find a better kicker?  If he didn't try and find a better one, and settled for what we have, people would criticize him for that.

It really is a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" thing with RR.  I really, truly feel bad for the guy because some people are just outrageous in their criticisms of him.  No matter what he does people will look for something to find wrong with it.

Tha Stunna

October 31st, 2010 at 1:57 AM ^

I don't feel sorry for him overall.  He makes 100x more per year than many people with full time jobs.  Plenty of people work harder and more dangerous jobs than he does and get paid less.  It's true that there will always be some who criticize him for dumb reasons, but that doesn't mean you can't make rational criticism of him.

I do feel he was dealt a much worse hand than anyone thought, but his worst case scenario is getting fired and getting a head coaching job in a non-BCS conference, which would easily jump to have him.

BlueinLansing

October 31st, 2010 at 1:07 AM ^

"we're not good enough to make those mistakes and win" lines.  Especially when those mistakes keep occuring over and over and over.  When do those mistakes get taken care of in practice.

We kicked a f'ing kickoff return out of bounds and it cost the team points.  This has been a 3 year problem.

Geaux_Blue

October 31st, 2010 at 1:08 AM ^

is a common term. it was used when we've had two players fighting for a starting position 100s of times under a variety of coaches. it means that people will be "trying out" and, through performance, they will be "found," meaning they will emerge into awareness.

 

this is a non-issue

zohizzle101

October 31st, 2010 at 1:09 AM ^

I mentioned this a couple of years ago when RR would keep blaming losses on the fact that he didn't have spread athletes...he really needs to keep his mouth shut at times because saying that is just going to alienate him from his players.

Back to tonight though, I think Gerg might have finally cost RR his job...it ultimately comes down to the head coach and as a loyal RR supporter, I really wanted him to succeed here. Obviously we can speculate all we want but it will be interesting to see what DB does in the next few weeks...

jmblue

October 31st, 2010 at 1:51 AM ^

Last year we ran the kind of NFL-style scheme GERG wanted.  It was a disaster.  At Syracuse, he had four years to run whatever scheme he wanted, and it was a disaster.  It's hard for me to believe that he's the guy to turn around the defense.

CWoodson

October 31st, 2010 at 1:39 AM ^

NFL teams bring in new kickers constantly after their kickers choke the week before.  Great coaches and solid teams do this all the time (see: Saints, Giants).  This is done in an effort (effective or not) to motivate their kickers or find something better.

But when RR does it, he's throwing his players under the bus?  OK, you've figured it all out.  Somebody tell Tom Coughlin he's been a scumbag all these years trying to find someone better than that bum Lawrence Tynes.

CWoodson

October 31st, 2010 at 1:48 AM ^

Which players think he's scum?  Even Tiki never said that, and Tiki actually is verifiably scum.  I know a ton of players have praised him, and some have certainly clashed with him.  But scum?  Coughlin is a good guy.  Scum is you talking, and since we've established that you know almost nothing about basketball, I'm ready to add the NFL to the list.

M-Wolverine

October 31st, 2010 at 2:23 AM ^

And his players at on the Giants can't stand the way he treats him. He's not a "player's coach", by any means. But if you actually had any real knowledge yourself rather than attacking others who know far more than you, you wouldn't come off looking so foolish all the time. (And nice typical dodge that how professionals handle professionals isn't the same as how coaches should act towards college kids. Still waiting on that recruiting response...).

CWoodson

October 31st, 2010 at 2:51 AM ^

Others who know far more than me =/= you, as usual.  Coughlin is a disciplinarian, if you want to call him a jerk that's probably fair.  I've watched every Giants game for 10 years, read all the stories, I know about the 5 minutes early is on time, the players' council he started in the Super Bowl year, etc.  All of it.  Many players chafe under the system, and calling him a players' coach (though they did on MNF this week) would be inaccurate.  He did not always get along with the players.  He has, however, mellowed and changed his system over the years.  Dozens of stories on it, particularly in the lead up to the Super Bowl they won.  But instead, you offer more expert generalizing about how ALL current Giants players hate him.  That must be why they're so unsuccessful under him every year and can never bring in free agents.  Six years ago called, it wants its opinion of Coughlin back.

You call him scum because he's a strict coach - that's your opinion.  Mine is calling someone "scum" is an attack on their character that a good guy like Coughlin doesn't deserve, certainly from you.  I won't lose sleep waiting for you to find quotes from players calling him scum, even though that extensive knowledge base you're constantly talking about suggests it would be easy for you to find them.

I didn't get into your 4-word "point" because you were busy making unjustifiable attacks on Coughlin's character for no reason other than your typical idiocy.  I don't think bringing in kickers motivates anyone - they're either going to make the kicks or not, they're already trying their hardest to make them.  True in college too.  But to act like it's a "scumbag" motivational technique is ridiculous - it's just not that big a deal.  We just gave up 1000 points AGAIN - that is a big deal.

M-Wolverine

October 31st, 2010 at 2:46 AM ^

"December
28
By: the mighty mjd
Apparently, most of the assistant coaches do, too. “Guys absolutely hate Tom Coughlin,” one Giant told the New York Post. “He’s not the type of coach we’re going to go and put everything on the line for. Guys don’t play for him; we play because we have to play and you’re not going to win that way. Arguments go on every day in that building, cursing out between the players and the coaches.”

“We will not win here when he’s the coach,” another veteran added. “It’s coaches against the players. It’s Coughlin against the coaches. There’s no team atmosphere or camaraderie.”"

http://www.themightymjd.com/2004/12/28/giants-players-hate-tom-coughlin/

That's one of probably a dozen you can find with a simple Google search...which must be beyond your expert knowledge.

CWoodson

October 31st, 2010 at 2:57 AM ^

"We will not win here when he's the coach" - 2004.  Beating the best NFL team of all-time in the Super Bowl - 2007.  $5 says that anonymous veteran was not on the team in 2007 (and was likely Tiki, who constantly leaked things to the media, like his 2006 retirement tour).

You may be STUNNED to learn that people and styles change over time.  His style in Jacksonville, while turning an expansion team into a legit contender, stopped working, so he modified his approach and was an unfortunate gunshot through the leg away from back-to-back rings.  Do some players probably still hate him?  Sure, he's not warm and cuddly and friendly.  Does that make him a bad coach or a scumbag?  Absolutely not.  Does using a quote from 2004 that was directly contradicted 3 years later suggest your "massive knowledge" you talk about constantly is imaginary?  Sure does.

Fuzzy Dunlop

October 31st, 2010 at 8:13 AM ^

Seriously, you post a player saying, in 2004, that the Giants will never win under Coughlin as proof of your position?  And you don't see the problem with that? 

Setting that idiocy aside, if one anonymous player saying crap about Coughlin proves him to be "scum," what does that say about Rodriguez?

jsquigg

October 31st, 2010 at 1:41 AM ^

If your criticism of a coach could be the same regardless of record and you only choose to critique said coach when coach loses, then you are a fairweather fan, a troll, and should not post criticism ever.

Black Socks

October 31st, 2010 at 2:01 AM ^

Did anyone else listen to WTKA after the game?  I have never heard Ira so open about changing coaches.  Sounds like he is super frustrated like the rest of us.

david from wyoming

October 31st, 2010 at 2:12 AM ^

You know what really pissed me off about Rich Rod? He doesn't have a mustache. Real men have mustaches and since Rich Rod doesn't, I just don't see how he can be a real man. If I was a parent of a recruit, I would want my son to be playing for a man with a mustache.