Haywood Jablomy

August 5th, 2014 at 9:48 AM ^

Maybe they'll regress now that the steroid user/captain was busted and suspended from the Rose Bowl. Seems like an eye will be on the rest. And don't say we don't know so don't accuse. One thing I've learned is that if you don't provide facts, people will fill the "facts" in for you. The fact is not a word from msu or bullough(spelling? and don't care) since January. Coached up or juiced up?

Space Coyote

August 5th, 2014 at 10:16 AM ^

You'll be disapointed in what the future brings. MSU has very technically sound players, and regardless of someone's pure strength, technique will almost always give you a more important and significant advantage. MSU does have good technique, and it pays dividends with their success on the field.

On top of that, most have accepted that Bullough wasn't caught for roids, but more likely for improper use of pain killers.

UMxWolverines

August 4th, 2014 at 11:31 PM ^

Why can't we just beat them? That is the only way they will regress. They won't do it on their own. You don't regress after winning two big ten titles, a rose bowl, and recruiting better than ever while only losing to your instate rival once since 2007. 

We had fucking -48 rushing yards against them last year. And people on here still talk about them regressing. They're almost as annoying as actual staee fans. 

That being said, that's a nice expensive mistake on that sign. 

Larry Appleton

August 4th, 2014 at 11:57 PM ^

You're right, but people want easy answers. And the easiest of all is the idea that State will regress just because they're State. You'd better hope nobody actually in the program actually has this attitude, because things will never change if they do.

ThadMattasagoblin

August 5th, 2014 at 1:04 AM ^

Their recruiting is about the same as it was in 2009 or 2010. This year they just have Scott who's a 4 star. Last year it was just McDowell and Nicholson and a few other 3/4 splits. Looking at their 2009/2010 classes it's almost identical.

ThadMattasagoblin

August 5th, 2014 at 2:17 AM ^

They were battling with Michigan, ND, and Ohio for Gholston and Lawrence Thomas in 2009/2010. If you look up their class on rivals they have 1 4 star and 10 3 stars. Like I said, Michigan and PSU haven't been good at all recently. If they can maintain their level when those two schools inevidently get better then they get all the respect from me.

TheTruth41

August 5th, 2014 at 2:05 PM ^

I think the biggest thing has been having program stability from coaches and having capable coaches.

 

Northwestern would be another good example of this.

 

While it doesn't always improve a program, having stability in coaching certainly helps.  MSU had growing pains when Dantonio first started at MSU but he redshirted a lot of his first recruits and continues to while playing mostly established upperclassmen in a system that those 3 stars have been in their whole career.

 

You could argue that a 3 star as a RS Junior in an established program is on the same playing field as a 4 star RS Junior or true senior in a program that has gone through one or more coaching changes over his career.

Talent is one thing, understanding your position and doing it without thinking has many benefits to being able to play to your potential.

saveferris

August 5th, 2014 at 10:50 AM ^

It's not so much a question of them regressing as one of the historically elite teams in the conference not performing to their expectations.  The entire conference has regressed as a result of the shift in demographics of the country from the Midwest to the South.  This coupled with coaching instability has hit Nebraska, Penn State, and Michigan the hardest.  Ohio State has been able to tread water because Ohio is still a hotbed of football talent.  The other programs that have weathered this the best is Wisconsin and MSU, and it's questionable how well Wisconsin will be able to maintain it's position within the conference given their recent coaching woes.

You take these 11-2, 12-1 Dantonio teams and drop them into the Big 10 of the 80's and 90's and they'd fare no better than the best squads that Perles and Saban fielded.  The conference is simply not as good as it used to be 10 years ago and MSU has stepped into the void to give the appearance that Dantonio has built an elite program, but it's an illusion.  There's a reason that the most knowledgeable Spartan faithful were clamoring to have MSU aligned in the West Division during the last conference expansion.  Anyone with any sense knows that once Michigan and Penn State start performing like themselves again, suddenly MSU is not going to be a regular player in the conference championship because they simply don't have the horses to compete year-to-year with OSU, MIchigan, and PSU. 

MSU isn't going to regress to Bobby Williams / JLS levels with Dantonio at the helm, but this idea that his coaching acumen is the key to their closing the talent gap with the elite teams of the conference is ridiculous.  If Dantonio was really that much of a coaching guru, other programs with deeper pockets would've come sniffing around, and from I can tell that has never happened.

saveferris

August 5th, 2014 at 2:41 PM ^

Where did I make any excuses for this program?  If anything, I did the opposite.  The point I was making is that MSU's rise is directly proportional to Michigan's (and the Big 10's) fall.  My point I was making is that we should be expecting less a regression from State then a return to expectations for Michigan and under those conditions, you're going to see Dantonio's record against Michigan and the conference drop to something more consistent with history.

Bottom line, history shows that when Michigan has it's act together as a program, MSU loses more than they win against us.  This notion that Dantonio is somehow going to buck that trend should Michigan become resurgent because the program he's built is that much better than Saban's or Perles' is ridiculous.  Now that said, it's still up to Hoke and the rest of the staff to see that it happens.  They're getting paid a handsome sum to make it happen, and if it doesn't....well they won't be around very long.

Whether or not we beat MSU this year or they go on to another 11 win season doesn't change the point of my argument...but it definitely wasn't to make excuses for Michigan.

saveferris

August 6th, 2014 at 11:52 AM ^

No, it just proves that every 30 years or so the stars align and MSU has a great season and goes and wins the Rose Bowl.

 Let me try this again.

  • The Big 10 as a conference has been regressing relative to the rest of college football over the past 6-8 years
  • The biggest beneficiary of this over that period has been MSU because Dantonio took that program from absolute tire fire to good
  • This does not mean that Dantonio has made MSU an elite program.  Their season last year was, but is that performance on outlier or the norm?
  • I think it's the latter because past history and stats bear this out (i.e. Recruiting stars matter and MSU loses more to Michigan when it's managed competently for that reason)
  • It is still incumbent upon Hoke and Co. to get this squad to start performing to their expectations.  If they do, then suddenly MSU won't seem like such world beaters because I don't think Dantonio and his braintrust are that much smarter than the rest of the staffs in the conference.
  • Dantonio can prove me wrong by continuing to beat Michigan, OSU, and PSU on a consistent basis over the next few seasons and making some more Rose Bowls, playoffs, etc.  Until then, I'm going to remain a skeptic as to how good MSU really is.

I really don't understand the pessimism around here that because MSU had one great season that suddenly they've become Big 10 Alabama in eveyrone's mind.  Dantonio has built an upper tier Big 10 program, but they are far from being in a position to dominate year-to-year.

PM

August 4th, 2014 at 10:34 PM ^

how accurately centered the text is. It almost makes a person think that adding one letter might just throw everything off... So, you know, it wouldn't appear accurate anymore.