December 18th, 2010 at 3:07 PM ^

We should've learned by now that you can't have too many DBs. Congrats to Raymon. I would recommend the coaches not assemble all of our dbs in one place at the same time, lest lightning strike or a flash flood occur. There's still plenty of room left in this class for DTs, a kicker, etc.

turd ferguson

December 18th, 2010 at 3:31 PM ^

i don't know, man. a lot of the things that happened to our DBs could have happened to any position group, so by that logic, you can't have too many of anything. except that you only get so many scholarships. i always cringe when people get excited for lower-ranked recruits at already covered positions who "build depth." depth in one area often means lack of depth in another (or less than top-level talent).

p.s. i'm not targeting this at raymon at all. i only have congrats for the kid.


December 18th, 2010 at 3:08 PM ^

I'm officially confused. I thought that I had a good picture of what our class would look like, but not anymore. I trust the coaches know what they are doing.


December 18th, 2010 at 3:10 PM ^

Is totally undervalued.  This kid would have been a 4* across the board if he had been healthy.  He has the size and speed to play safety, and could play corner.  I still think that we are looking at taking two more in the def backfield...possibly Taylor and Lyons?  That would shore up what is a very shallow bench.    And with, what, 8 more spots potentially available, we have plenty of space for some big guys on the front could hope.


December 18th, 2010 at 4:17 PM ^

I know people want linebackers and d-linemen, but it's not as if the coaching staff haven't pursued those positions. RR's banking on Zettel, who will go blue if RR is retained, and Frost, who from all reports projects to be a stellar linebacker, appears to be taking a similar approach. Time will tell with those guys.


December 18th, 2010 at 4:23 PM ^

I'm not quite sure I understand this offer.

Lots of cornerbacks coming in already.  Some movement probably has to happen (one of these corners to FS, one of them decommitting, one of them playing WR, something).


December 18th, 2010 at 5:04 PM ^

Hypothesis, Magnus:

Woolfolk, Floyd, Talbott and Avery are the four CBs predominantly being counted on for the 2011 season. Their freshmen 'backups'/redshirt candidates are Crawford/Countess.

Perhaps Christian is considered fifth in line, but also will be competing with Vinopal for the deep safety position (Carvin as well). Their backup/redshirt guy could be Taylor if he commits.

At the Kovacs position, maybe ... Carvin is the backup, and GERG Brown is the 3rd in line.

At the Cam Gordon position, Thomas Gordon is the backup, with Furman as a co-backup for 2011.

I'm also trying to make order of out this DB chaos.


December 19th, 2010 at 12:03 PM ^

I don't care who commits, but if you look at the information I lined up above, once they're committed, then I think it's appropriate to start looking at how they fit in.

Sam Webb's gut feelings, recruit's press conferences and tweets, their top fives, etc., are what I can do without.


December 18th, 2010 at 4:44 PM ^

Don't get too caught up in positions.  The upper tier of pure FS that Michigan wanted went elsewhere.  Instead of reaching for players they don't like, they're offering CBs whose generall skills and potential they like far more.

Furthermore, while Courtney Avery seems a lock to stay at CB, any other DB on the current roster could slide over to Safety.  No use getting worked up about how many CBs or SS or FS we have in this class with the fluidity at the position.

Taylor would be an excellent addition to this class.


December 19th, 2010 at 10:48 PM ^

Hmmm.  I took a closer look at our CBs and safeties, and Taylor looks more like a corner if you only look at height, weight and 40 time.


DB Height Weight 40 time
Woolfolk 6-0 186  
Floyd 6-0 183  
Avery 5-9 165 4.55 timed Scout combine
Talbott 5-10 175 4.47 Two Fakes
Christian 6-1 172 4.55 (One Fake) and 4.68 not Fake
Hollowell 5-8 125? 4.66 not fake and 'track notoriously slow'
Brown 5-10 180 4.4 one fake (Sept 2009)
Countess 5-10 175 4.47, 4.48 one fake (prob combine verified)
Crawford 5-10 180, 185 4.47 per recruit video, Brian guessed mid 4.5
Raymon Taylor 5-10 175 4.43
Vinopal 5-9 1/2 178 4.56 as HS freshman, 4 fakes
Van Slyke 6-2 206  
C Johnson 6-1 195 4.68 neg 1 fake
Robinson 6-1 204 4.6
C Gordon 6-3 208 4.6 two fakes
T Gordon 5-11 208  
Hawthorne 6-0 202 4.72
Kovacs 6-0 200  
Simmons 6-0 197  
Furman 6-2 192 4.39 wind aided fast track

The heights and weights come from the Spring '10 roster for anyone arriving earlier than this years true freshman.  All the 40 times and the heights and weights come from 'hello' posts except Taylor which is from Scout. 

Based on this, Floyd and Christian look like the best fits for a CB moving to free safety.  Crawford also has the size and speed if he's got the mentality.


December 18th, 2010 at 5:48 PM ^

Here is my question to everyone.  If you make an offer this late in the recruiting season, how long does it usually take for one of these recruits to say yes?

I guess I am surprised that it takes the recuits this long to say yes.  I wonder if it took a recruit that long to say yes to Bo / Lloyd etc.

FWIW, I think he stays and I think we end up with a top 15 class.


December 18th, 2010 at 5:54 PM ^

You make it sound like we turned Jones down. Didn't he decommit from us virtually on signing day?

I agree that we screwed up on Hankins. If he was good enough to merit an offer from OSU, then he was good enough to have gotten an offer from us much earlier, instead of when it was too late.


December 18th, 2010 at 6:38 PM ^

You're right, he turned us down. Jones was a recruiting battle we could have, maybe even should have won, but we lost it, and that's kind of the point. We've lost enough recruiting battles that now we're in a pretty sticky situation. And you're right, Hankins was way worse because 1) having lost Jones before we knew we needed a NT and 2) he was an athletic 320 pounder with offers from OSU and Florida and 3) he grew up in our backyard and desperately wanted to come here, so much so that he held out for most of the recruiting cycle for an offer.

The basis for this was his lack of conditioning. Meanwhile we recruit a guy from florida whose high profile suitors have backed away after questioning his motor. This guy shows up to fall camp 60 pounds heavier than advertised and Hankins contributes on OSU's 2 deep as a true freshman. Gah, just gah.

Captain Obvious

December 19th, 2010 at 3:19 AM ^

Predicting the work ethic of 300 pound 17 year olds isn't the easiest thing in the world.  Apparently Hankins came to Michigan's camp and the coaches saw him sucking wind and not giving full effort, right in front of them.  He wasn't worth an offer at that point.  They told him to get in shape, he did, Michigan offered, but OSU was too far ahead at that point.  UM's handling of his recruitment is only a mistake in hindsight.

You win some and you lose some.  The coaches aren't prescient.


December 18th, 2010 at 6:19 PM ^

DB and he's from the state,and people are saying we have enough DB'S.I didn't expect to hear this.Also Showers is back on the market maybe,would we take him to.GO BLUE!!!


December 18th, 2010 at 7:00 PM ^

We should make a run at Valdez Showers.  With the change down in Florida, he is having second thoughts.  We could have got his commitment months ago, but the staff was slow to offer.  I think if we give him enough attention we could get him back.