Latest on Dawkins, Huff, and Ibaka + football recruiting notes from Don

Submitted by Raoul on April 28th, 2014 at 9:53 AM

A few notes on basketball recruiting, based in part on today's recruiting roundup on WTKA:

Aubrey Dawkins: Had a great (and extended) visit to Dayton, according to Sam Webb, who also reported that Dawkins is not taking any more visits and will choose between Michigan and Dayton. The announcement could come any day and will happen within the week. In Sam's opinion, Michigan has the upper hand based on the criteria that Dawkins related to Sam. If Dawkins adheres to his stated criteria, Sam thinks Michigan will be the choice. I don't have a Scout subscription, so I don't know what's in the premium article on this posted there, but from what was said on the free Scout board, it appears that one criterion is academics.

Cole Huff: There's been no announcement of a visit date to Michigan for Huff. But his former AAU coach, Clint Parks, tweeted yesterday that Huff was off to Creighton for "his 1st of 4 visits." Visits to Iowa (May 2) and Dayton (May 9) are already known, and presumably Michigan will be the fourth. As a pure FYI that I mention only because of previous discussions about Huff: UCLA just lost Jordan Adams to a late NBA entry decision.

Igor IbakaSam thinks this is another case—similar to Byron Wesley—of a player expressing interest in Michigan, not the other way around. With Ibaka, it "certainly hasn't been Michigan pursuing him." Sam noted the rarity of juco transfers to Michigan in basketball. In the end, in his opinion, this is likely "much ado about nothing."

Also, for anyone looking for a good overview of where Michigan basketball recruiting stands, Sam has just updated his recruiting primer.

EDIT: Links to recruiting roundup podcasts: part 1 (Dawkins + the football items Don summarizes below) and part 2 (Ibaka).

EDIT2: Updated title so people know there's good info in the thread from Don on football recruiting.

Comments

Don

April 28th, 2014 at 9:59 AM ^

Sam flat-out said he thought Michigan was in the "pole position" right now for Roseboro, who was in town for a visit with his parents. They apparently all were blown away by the visit. I was skeptical about the chances of him coming here in another thread, but I was wrong.

Sam also basically confirmed that the staff is looking at Cornell as a DT, along with Tim Settle, and since they're basically in good shape on the DL interior, they are concentrating on DEs like Roseboro and Lucier-South. This may explain in part why Cornell is turning his attention to MSU.

Malzone also had a workout this morning with Nussmeieir and other coaches present, and put on a great show.

Here2CWoodson

April 28th, 2014 at 10:39 AM ^

Those things tend to work themselves out throughout the year. We thought that we had the same dilemma last year with McDowell and Hand, and obviously that never materialized.

The only times in recent memory that I can think if Michigan turning away a really solid player that actually tried to commit (not just had us high on his list) was the whole Tommy Schutt fiasco a few years ago.

Don

April 28th, 2014 at 10:58 AM ^

I'd add Jonathan Hankins to the fiasco list. The previous staff refused to offer Hankins early because of his conditioning, but his conditioning was good enough for an OSU offer and by the time we finally offered him it was too late. Hankins conditioning was so terrible it got him into the NFL. I guess you're gonna whiff on some kids. I just hope that if we don't get Malzone that he doesn't end up with one of our rivals and tortures us for four years.

Don

April 28th, 2014 at 1:09 PM ^

I know this is old water under the bridge and doesn't mean shit now, but from what I remember Hankins was a big UM fan and was just waiting for an offer.

It's been my opinion forever that the road to a national championship-caliber team is through the defensive line. The three best defenses I've seen here—'85, '97, and '06—had All-Americans Hammerstein, Steele, and Woodley, future All-Americans in Messner and Renes, and future NFL players Hall, Williams, and Branch.

Bodogblog

April 28th, 2014 at 10:59 AM ^

I thought Roseboro was more of a 5 Tech, rather than a WDE.  Maybe with the 4-3 Over there's less distinction (I thought Brian mentioned that, could have read that wrong).

If correct, having an athletic/quick 5T like Roseboro would be outstanding.  But what's desperately needed every class is a pass rushing WDE.  We have Lawrence Marshall coming in, need one for 2015.  Given that I assume we take two if Roseboro is one of them.

Blue in Seattle

April 28th, 2014 at 2:13 PM ^

posted at MaizenBrew  4-3 Over

The interesting thing to me is that the SDE moves out and takes the 4-3 Under SAM responsibility of contain.  The SAM comes off the line and takes the gap inside the SDE.  This does make the DL more symetrical than the 4-3 under, and I think that is what Mattison has been recruiting in DT's and DE's.  So now Taco and Frank are both in the first team DL, and most importantly there shouldn't be any more flip flop of the DL on the first motion of the offense, just minor adjustment left or right in reaction to the change in strength of the motion man.  Brian's repeated concern has been the loss of Jake Ryan's slashing ability, but I think Mattison wants to use that for blitzing up the middle, and in the Spring Game there was a classic example of Jake Ryan overpursuit when he got into the backfield "too fast", and missed the running back, although the disruption caused resulted in a stop at the LOS.  And you can't have the confidence to do that if the corners can't cover the quick routes.

 

alum96

April 28th, 2014 at 10:36 AM ^

I am not buying the "Cornell to DT hence we are cooling on him" - sounds like saving face whispers to the public. 

Why?

We want Roseboro for a DE - who is currently 6'4 283 lbs.  But we don't want Cornell as a DE who is 6'3 270 ...we'd rather have him as a DT?  Nah, not buying that stock one bit.  We have been flipping Wormley and Charlton between DE and DTs in their limited time last year and both are in that size range.  Roseboro sounds like he is going to be 300 by the time he gets to college and has 12 months of nutrition and strength training with that frame.

 

Don

April 28th, 2014 at 10:43 AM ^

FWIW, Sam said this morning that Roseboro was just recently weighed at 268. Not saying that rebuts your thesis, though. Maybe they think Cornell will be more naturally a DT than Roseboro by the time both are in school. I agree it's a good question.

alum96

April 28th, 2014 at 10:56 AM ^

OK thanks, I went off the Rivals weight which had him in the 280s.  (just looked up 247 and he is 265 - that's better than Jenny Craig)  That said, then they are both the same weight so I am still going with the "losing momentum with Cornell so 'cooling on him' meme gets leaked."  Both are big boys.  I wouldn't mind having 285 lb DEs if they have the speed...

fwiw Scout has Cornell at 245 lbs lol.

alum96

April 28th, 2014 at 11:36 AM ^

Yep which is why if (wait for it) they can develop Charlton as a 275 DE (with 3 more years ahead of him) I'd be happy.  I did see him inside I believe for some snaps vs OSU if memory serves.  

Wormley did some damage too with TFL and sacks, but I don't know if they came from the DT or DE - he is listed on the spring roster as DL so they seem to still be rotating him.

Call me nuts but a starting lineup next year of Wormley-Pipkins-Henry-Charlton would make me happy.  280 lbs at all 4 positions at the minimum if Charlton adds on 5 lbs in 17 months - yes please. If nothing else, that group should finally stuff the run.  And 3 of those guys seem like penetrators.  Poggi is 270ish as well and could be in that mix outside in 12 months if all goes well.  This is what those damn SEC teams have, 275-280 lb ends who somehow run like MLBs.

Bodogblog

April 28th, 2014 at 12:10 PM ^

Would love it if they pushed Wormley out to 5Tech permanently, though I think you're right they're rotating him.  He said on his mgoblue interview (and I think we "talked" about this before) that he, Strobel, and Godin were the 3 Techs.  But with Pipkins, Henry, Hurst, Glasgow and now Mone available at nose, they could slide one of those to 3T and Wormley (and/or Godin) out to 5T.  I know they like Beyer there, but I'd rather see him as back-up WDE.  My guess is we'll see position flexibility from a few players, and playing time will depend on down and distance and week-to-week performance.

Yeah that would be formidable (though this year I prefer Clark over Charlton, hoping for big things from him) - I think Pipkins/Henry/Hurst can penetrate by pushing people backward, while Wormley just holds guys up at the LOS then chucks them when sees where the play's going.  They probably all need work on handling a double team, but block them one-on-one and I think you have problems as an offense. 

alum96

April 28th, 2014 at 1:35 PM ^

Well would definitely help "our" (you and I) cause if Godin and Strobel begin to flash this year at 3T.  Hard to really say they were behind last year because that's a big boy's area of the field and they are still so young but this year they need to show something - at least in a rotational way.  Strobel just went MIA at some point early last year.  If not, I agree slide Hurst over there and let's see what he does.

I am excited about Wormley due to the "just wait until the 2nd year back from ACL" - he was penetrating last year as a very young dude in 1st year back from ACL.  Hope he can build on it since he looks like he really has a nose for the ball.

Yes of course Clark wil start this year, I was speaking to the year after... I am already in "this year" thinking about 2014 so should have stated that better when I said "next year".

Bodogblog

April 28th, 2014 at 1:47 PM ^

Wormley and Godin should probably both be at 5T.  Reading what I wrote, I'm even more convinced Wormley moves out there.  Pipkins, Henry, Glasgow, Hurst, and Mone (and Mone will play this year) - that's too many bodies for one position at NT.  Some will play 3T as well.  Wormley will have to slide down.  He should.  That's a hell of a lot of depth on the interior DL. 

We need some combo of Clark, Ojemudia, Charlton, and Marshall to emerge as pass rush threats from the outside. Beyer is an effort sack guy, and those guys are good too, but we need someone who's a threat to run around or bull rush through opposing offensive tackles.  D could be great if that happens.  But we all knew that already, going back to last year.

madmaxweb

April 28th, 2014 at 10:04 AM ^

I was really hoping for a surprise commit from Roseboro to give the program a shot in the arm. But hearing that they were blown away is the next best thing.

Don

April 28th, 2014 at 10:17 AM ^

Sam said that Roseboro is planning to be an EE, and that the decision will come by the end of the summer. Way too soon to buckle up, but it certainly sounds good right now.

Roy Manning has been a huge factor in Roseboro's recruiting, from what Webb said.

Erik_in_Dayton

April 28th, 2014 at 10:21 AM ^

Coach Beilein's socks know more about how to run a team than I do, but I worry the staff is running the risk of having little to no room for the 2015 class.  If Dawkins and Huff commit, there will - for now - be no room for a 2015 player.  We have to assume, based on past experience, that someone will go to the NBA and someone else will transfer, but that won't happen until after the 2015 season.  That's a long time to be unsure if you'll have any room. 

ypsituckyboy

April 28th, 2014 at 10:28 AM ^

There will be room for at least 2, and possibly 3. LeVert is likely an early entry for the NBA based on current projections, Bielfeldt may get a firm handshake after this year since it'll be his fourth year, there's usually at least one transfer, and there's also the possibility that Hatch receives a medical after playing for a year.  

Also, wouldn't you rather have Huff (a known quantity, someone who has proven he can play well at the collegiate level) than a 2015 guy who is unproven?

Erik_in_Dayton

April 28th, 2014 at 10:33 AM ^

...is that he seems fairly duplicative of Chatman and Wilson.  That's not to say they have the exact same skills, but they're all seemingly 3-4 guys.

I'd prefer to know that there is room for Brunson, a center, and one of Coleman, McQuaid, and Grandstaff, but your points are well taken. 

alum96

April 28th, 2014 at 10:48 AM ^

I am with the phallic avatar- getting a proven upperclassmen for a team that seems like it will be perpetually young and who has already demonstrated his game transitions to the next level is a far safer bet than "ABC recruit". 

If (big if) Irvin goes with Caris, Huff (if he comes) will not even be close to a luxury but potentially the 2nd (or 3rd) scoring option on that 2015-2016 squad.   We know what his game is - we are all speculating what Donnal's, Chatman's, Wilson's etc are.

Wilson seems like a straight up 4, not duplicative with Huff (Chatman is however).  Huff and Chatman seem to be flexible combo guys.  Wilson for all the recent hype averaged just 13 ppg as a senior despite that great game versus the top 5 player in the class.  A more polished offensive threat who swings out to a 3, you'd think would be averaging 20 ppg as a SR in HS.

p.s. no way Max is getting a firm handshake with the knowledge leaked that no one in the Big 10 can guard him!

champswest

April 28th, 2014 at 2:36 PM ^

Actually, no, not necessarily.  You are making a lot of assumptions about scholarships, so consider this.  You would be using a 2015 scholarship on Huff, he could come here and sit out his year, play one year, and leave for the NBA.

I can see both sides of the discussion. In the end, I will trust Beilein to do what is best.

Yo_Blue

April 28th, 2014 at 10:21 AM ^

What's up with the Dayton love?  Nothing against them, but seriously, Dayton?  They did have a great run this year.  Archie Miller may be building a monster there.

LSAClassOf2000

April 28th, 2014 at 11:13 AM ^

Perhaps not, but he did get a contract extension a few weeks ago, I believe, and also said that he was quite content in Dayton and had no plans to roll his success there into a new position. Take that for what you will, of course - eventually, I assume he moves on. It is funny, however, that around the time his contract was extended, Wake Forest and Marquette - two higher profile jobs - fired their coaches within about 24 hours of each other. I assume he got some calls regardless of what he said. 

alum96

April 28th, 2014 at 10:28 AM ^

Interesting Sam has Kam as 1-2-3-4 which is sort of what I've been saying (only due to the comments about Kam with potential to play 1 per his coach's talk).  While I am not sure he ever makes it to 1, if this kid sticks around long enough he might be a guy who eats up a ton of minutes at 4, and goes all the way down to 2 a year later to eat the same minutes if we do not get an "elite" 2015 recruit for SG.   I think the recruitment we see in the next 6 months will tell us a lot about their future plans for Kam.

If we get Dawkins we start with 0 openings for next year.  And unless someone really blows up (i.e. Irvin) we will probably have 2 assuming Hatch gets an academic of some sort.  So have to be very careful on how that is filled.  I think we have enough wings (2-4) now and unless Donnal is going to be part of a 2 headed monster almost his whole career here at 5, we are going to need a 5 in next year's class.   That 5 than can redshirt in 2015-2016 while Doyle/Donnal split 5 (and whichever is better suited for 4, which we all assume to be Donnal gets some time at 4)...then in 2016-2017 that 2015 recruit is ready to go as a backup to Doyle at 5.  If no 2015 5 I think Donnal might play his whole career with a lot of time at 5 instead of the "stretch 4 concept".

And we need to start thinking about a PG in 2015 with that other spot.  Got to be tough on these coaches to figure out the moving parts with so many kids who may or may not be here in 12 or 24 months.  The matrix is constantly shuffling.  But with Huff* (if coming), Wilson, Chatman, Irvin* (if staying), Dawkins* (if coming), and MAAR you have a young group of 6 that can play 2-4 for a few years so it would appear -  MAAR locked at 2, Wilson at 4, and everyone else with position flexibilty.  (Dawkins might be locked at 3)

1 and 5 would be the focus with so few scholarship in '15 in that setup.  But if Huff and/or Dawkins don't come you have a different chess set altogether.

MaximusBlue

April 28th, 2014 at 10:40 AM ^

Dawkins said his criteria are academics and alumni base, basically what degree holds more weight. Looks like a shoe in for Michigan, but we've heard recruits say this before and go completely the other way.

Shakey Jake

April 28th, 2014 at 11:15 AM ^

That when 99.5% of elite high school athletes talk about academics, it's not about the fact they want to be challenged in the classroom so they can grow as a person but how easy does the school make it for me to pass my classes so I can focus on my sport so I can get to the pros. Granted, I do realize there a handful of smart guys who care about education but they are far and few between.