May 8th, 2014 at 11:42 AM ^

"Here's the key to financial success - find something that's available on the open market and that no one wants, then, let everyone know that you're desperate and that you'll pay double what anyone else is offering. You'll win every time."

--Teaser from Chapter 1 of Joe Dumars' new book, "The Art of the Deal: How to Underpay while Overpaying" which the NBA Players Association has called "The Bible..a must read" for all NBA GM's


May 8th, 2014 at 11:51 AM ^

In all fairness to Joe, he was brilliant when he first got into the league.  After he built the NBA Championship team from pretty much nothing and set Orlando back seven years with the Grant Hill sign and trade, nobody in the NBA would give him a bona fide offer anymore in fear of being the next Orlando Magic.  

So now, everyone in the league lowballs the Pistons in any trade talks.  Worse yet, it's not like Detroit is the kind of city that has free agents lining up for privilege of living there.

When nobody wants to trade with you and FA's don't want to play in your city, it's a bit tough to get the job done.


May 8th, 2014 at 12:17 PM ^

Fair points, but can't the same be said about Dombrowski? He wins trades 90% of the time, you'd think teams would be reluctant to trade with him since he bends them over a barrel every time. However, some teams still decide to do so and DD still wins. 

Although, comparing baseball and basketball trades and free agency isn't really fair with how different the markets and minor league systems are. 

The FannMan

May 8th, 2014 at 12:24 PM ^

The "no free agent will play in your City" thing is overplayed.  The Tigers and Red Wings prove that free agents will come to Detroit.  The City itself has well documented issues.  However, the metro-area as a whole (where most pro-athletes actually live) is very nice.  The media is generally respectful of athlete's privacy, and the City has great sports fans.  If the organization has its crap together, has won or will win, and is willing to pay FAs will come the Detroit.


May 8th, 2014 at 1:01 PM ^

Everything you said, I agree with, except that in basketball, I think there's certainly something to the idea that a lot of free agents prefer to be in more glamorous locations.  Hockey and baseball players are a different breed; hockey players in particular aren't nearly as interested in the club scene.  A lot of basketball players are interested in building a personal brand.  They want to sell shoes, clothes, start a rap label, whatever.  And if you want to do that you're better off in Brooklyn or Miami or LA or as close as you can get.

I appreciate that there certainly are NBAers who want different things - more stable family life, good organization, etc.  On the other hand, Chris Paul wanted to go to LA so bad he forced a trade to the Clippers when he couldn't go to the Lakers.  There is no way a franchise like the Clippers would've become a title contender if they were in the Midwest.  They would've just bumbled along playing crappy basketball for decades.


May 8th, 2014 at 9:11 PM ^

This just seems like some stereotyping not based in actual facts. How's Indiana good? How's OKC good? How do the Knicks continually suck? Yes, a few players have complained about going to a place like Milwaukee, but that's rare and I've never heard someone say that about Detroit. It's not like free agents only ever sign with the huge coastal cities. And anyway, a place like Detroit would be great for making a rap label.

Did Chris Paul say he wanted to be traded so he could go to a big market team? I'm guessing it had more to do with being unhappy how things were run.


May 9th, 2014 at 6:16 PM ^

Yeah, those aren't great examples.  Name for me the big free agents who have picked Indiana or OKC lately.  Now name the big name free agents who have picked either LA team, Miami, Boston, Brooklyn, etc.  

Baseball and hockey are different.  Detroit is a major hockey town in every way.  The weather is also less of a deterrent because the northern cities have more fans and most of the players are from cold weather places.  And baseball is uncapped, and Detroit is a team willing to spend, which helps us keep the guys we trade for, and allows us to trade for big contracts that other teams shy away from.  


MI Expat NY

May 8th, 2014 at 12:53 PM ^

I don't really buy the "couldn't trade because of the Grant Hill deal."  Denver was willing to trade Iverson for Billups.  Besides, the Hill trade was more of a free agency thig then a trade. I think most NBA observers would say Orlando was stupid for giving up anything to be able to pay Grant Hill more money than he was probably willing to take as a straight up free agency signing.  Sure, Dumars gets credit for a good eye in taking Wallace, but I don't see this as everyone saying "oooh, beware of that crafty Dumars guy."  I will give Dumars the Rasheed trade, but I still don't see how that translates into nobody wanting to deal with him.

Maybe some FAs don't want to come to Detroit, and I'd agree that the Pistons were never in on the biggest signings of the 2009 class, but that shouldn't give him a pass for the contracts handed out to Gordon and Villanueva or some of his extensions like Rip Hamilton.  

It's hard not to look back on Dumars' time and think that maybe he got a bit lucky putting that first contender together.  Minnesota didn't want to resign Billups.  Portland had grown tired of Rasheed.  Blowing the Darko pick may have actually been a blessing to that particular team.  He was also unlucky in that the team really should have had at least one more title, which would certainly have helped his rep.  And some of his moves were defensible parts of a seemingly good plan.  But everything that happened after the Billups-AI trade makes it hard to put too much faith in the fact that Dumars was at any point an excellent executive.  


May 8th, 2014 at 4:59 PM ^

Yes, he clearly was -- but wow, this is Michigan, so it shouldn't have gone way over everyone's heads like that.  Pretty sure Shakey Jake was just trying to refer to the person who made note of his typo as being a Nazi in a clever way.  Apparently too clever for this board -- keep it simple, Jake, be very literal when Timmaayy's around so he doesn't end up making a stink (speaking of South Park, this kinda reminds of when Stan's dad or whoever has a bad idea and gets the whole town to go along with it by being all dramatic).

Really, Timmaaayy? You're gonna neg me because you're embarassed about attacking someone because you didn't get their joke?  That's really, really pathetic...


May 9th, 2014 at 6:20 PM ^

"Head Over Feet"


I had no choice but to hear you

You stated your case time and again

I thought about it

You treat me like I'm a princess

I'm not used to liking that

You ask how my day was

You've already won me over in spite of me

And don't be alarmed if I fall head over feet

Don't be surprised if I love you for all that you are

I couldn't help it

It's all your fault

Your love is thick and it swallowed me whole

You're so much braver than I gave you credit for

That's not lip service

You've already won me over in spite of me

And don't be alarmed if I fall head over feet

Don't be surprised if I love you for all that you are

I couldn't help it

It's all your fault

You are the bearer of unconditional things

You held your breath and the door for me

Thanks for your patience

You're the best listener that I've ever met

You're my best friend

Best friend with benefits

What took me so long

I've never felt this healthy before

I've never wanted something rational

I am aware now

I am aware now

You've already won me over in spite of me

And don't be alarmed if I fall head over feet

Don't be surprised if I love you for all that you are

I couldn't help it

It's all your fault


May 8th, 2014 at 11:30 AM ^

This is acutally a very good read, too bad the post is a mess.  There are 3 things wrong here.  First, it's not irony.  Second, it's Joe Dumars' son.  Otherwise it's Joe Dumar.  And lastly not acutally making the link clickable.  My disdain for Jake grows.


May 8th, 2014 at 11:35 AM ^

Shakey - can you drop me a quick line with the schedule for the rest of today's threads you'll be posting?   I'm going to be in a meeting here at work from about 1:30-3:00 but I can probably jump out for a bit if your 2:00pm thread is a good one.

Thanks - I'll hang up and listen.


May 8th, 2014 at 11:44 AM ^

It seems like Trey is getting good advice.  He should make enough money, if invested wisely and conservatively, where he should be set for life or at least have a very nice income stream.

It takes discipline to not get caught up in the "bling" that so many pro athletes succumb to.


May 8th, 2014 at 12:07 PM ^

*puts on mod cap*

While efforts to provide content in what is typically a slow time are usually appreciated, it does get to a point where volume posting such as this either A) tends to suffer in quality, or B) drowns out more relevant material regarding Michigan athletics. In this case, it is starting to be a bit of both, so the recommendation I would have have is to simply slow down and be a little more judicious regarding what might be threadworthy. After all, being OT Season here doesn't mean everything that is OT will remain on the board.

To be fair to the OP, the article itself actually is a good read. The documentary "Broke" was both illuminating and svery sad and it is great to see young players like Trey take steps to be financially responsible in a league that writes some impressive checks. 


May 8th, 2014 at 12:52 PM ^

I think we all read the blog for not only the content, but also for teh people posting. You learn, in  a rather short amount of time, who has an agenda, who tends to  be knowledgeable, and who is here just to make people upset. 

I have never really understood the last group of people, but unfortunately they exist in every section of America and MGO is certainly not immune.

Also, totally agree that "Broke" was a very insightful and heartbreaking. I still cannot think of Sprewell without imagining him trying to sell his yacht after going broke.


May 8th, 2014 at 12:11 PM ^

Well when you take an unnecessary shot at the people who are helping Burke be financially responsible, don't expect much in the way of pleasantries being directed at you. So there's a connection between Burke being responsible and Joe Dumars passing over him in the draft? Big deal. Who cares. The article itself is interesting and worth a read; the subject line you posted deserves to be negged to death.