How quickly do folks jump back on the wagon

Submitted by Hail-Storm on August 5th, 2010 at 9:29 AM

I wholy admit to being a Michigan slappy, and have a feeling that they can win the Big Ten every year. Through my maize and blue colored glasses I see a 10-2 season coming our way, with lots of improvement. I loved Lloyd as our coach, and have been a Rich Rod fan since he got here, and fully support him and the program right now. I do, though, understand others are not as easily swayed and some truly dislike Rich Rod as our coach.

 

My question is not how many wins it will take for Rich to keep his job, cause in my world, the win total will be so high by October, this topic will be moot. My question is, how many wins, or seasons of winning, does it take for him to get back the entire fan base? Or has that ship sailed where no matter how many championships he gets, he can't do enough to get certain fans back?

Comments

JeepinBen

August 5th, 2010 at 9:34 AM ^

Sure, there has been backlash at the hire, but EVERYONE was excited about it before the actual football was played. I think this will be a case of "winning will cure all ills" and we'll be fine

30 days... 30 days

ChasingRabbits

August 5th, 2010 at 10:39 AM ^

"EVERYONE was excited about it before the actual football was played."

Wow, I couldn't disagree with this more and it is the reason I point out that the people who say, "8-16", "8-16", "8-16" are full of it.  The "he is not a Michigan Man" BS started the day the hire was announced. The irrational flip out over the #1 Jersey, the freak out over the way he picks captains, the players leaving (RR ran out of town) BS,  the list goes on and on.. all before the actual football was played.

Winning will just remove that one actual fact that they all point too...  then they will have to rely on their real argument  "well, ahhh...  I just don't like him...  he is 'shady' "

JeepinBen

August 5th, 2010 at 10:49 AM ^

there is the small percentage of fans that are "Harumph harumph he didn't play for Bo" types, and these people I don't think will ever be satisfied. These are the people who started "Firelloyd.com" and everything else. They will never be satisfied unless the Ghost of Fritz leads us to 13 consecutive national titles.

I know that a majority of people I talked to saw the spread-ish look that we threw at Florida were ridiculously excited. Here we were, with Michigan Athletes, Shredding up an SEC defense... there were questions if RR was calling the plays that first series. It was all hype, potential, and awesomeness.

Then the honeymoon ended and the "BS" you talked about started. I think most (if not all) of that BS disappears with wins as you said at the end. 

IronDMK

August 5th, 2010 at 11:24 AM ^

I am always looking for someone else with Blind Optimism for Michigan Football, especially in these dark days.  There are always going to be those stubborn A--wipes that will predict catastrophe in the midst of something incredible (like a 5 or 6 win start).  For them, I think it will take a 10 win season to admit that they were being fair weather nay-sayers.  For the record, that type of fan really pisses me off... and it's too bad there are so many of them among us.  I think the majority of fans have had that reality check and have seen what it's like to be on the other end of the whipping stick.  So now we, as fans, can really appreciate it when the team plays well.  I think for some, the point at which we win 6 games and secure a bowl bid will be the turning point. 

I think the bes way to get the fans behind RR is for the team to beat he Evil Triumverate: ND, MSU, OSU.  If Blue does that I think that you'll be hard pressed to find a nay-sayer... even if they team only wins 6 games.  Those 3 mean a lot to me and I think they mean a lot to all Michigan fans. 

Still, the Blind Optimist in me says that we'll win 9 regular season games this year and I think that will be enough to get many people on board.  I could be wrong, but probably not cuz I'm pretty smart.

Corey

August 5th, 2010 at 12:26 PM ^

They'll be there after a National Championship too.  I was in New Orleans during the period LSU won their last one, and some people were still expressing their dislike of Les Miles the day afterwards*.  A depressing existence, really.

 

*regardless of how warranted that dislike may have been

Blazefire

August 5th, 2010 at 9:37 AM ^

I have some neighbors that claim to be Michigan fans. They started last season in the "fire" camp big time. After the ND game, they pulled a complete 180, and RR was the best thing ever. By the end of the Iowa game, they were ready to get out the pitchforks again.

BlockM

August 5th, 2010 at 9:39 AM ^

People already had one leg back on the wagon after the 4-0 start last year... I don't think it will take much longer than that this year, especially given the higher degree of difficulty against UConn.

Bryan

August 5th, 2010 at 9:45 AM ^

from now until say November that posts a thread asking "how many wins will it take for RR to keep his job?" We have to hear it from everyone else, I don't want to read it here. Please?

MGoDC

August 5th, 2010 at 9:46 AM ^

I hope people can never jump back on the wagon. Hopefully RR put a barbed wire fence around the wagon so those of us who have stayed with him these 2 years can ride to the Rose Bowl with him while the haters get left at the side of the road.

dahblue

August 5th, 2010 at 11:18 AM ^

I'm baffled by this comment:

those of us who have stayed with him these 2 years...

I thought this was a post about the football "team", not just its coach.  I didn't know that our program began with the hire of RR.  It sounds like you jumped on the bandwagon two years ago.

mtzlblk

August 5th, 2010 at 1:12 PM ^

IS part of the team, along with the players.

I think he is referring to exactly those people who dumped the "team" because of an irrational dislike for the coach, or simply because of an identitity crisis as an M fan that wasn't getting enough W to fill their cup and they didn't have the huevos to take the abuse from rival fans and so buckled and did things like booing a bunch of kids when they were down against Wisconsin.

That is the very definition of fair-weather/bandwagon fan. On/in when they win, off/out when they don't, then right back on when they win again.

I will definitely be calling out some people I know personally who have jumped off for the last year citing Freep headlines as the cause and not having any semblance of an in-depth understanding of the reality of the situation(s) they were using to justify their stance. When questioned, they had no response of any substance and would ultimately retreat to "8-16, 8-16, 8-16" as their defense. Should they ever turn and profess their devotion to RR, and the "team", once they improve in the W department, I plan on making them eat some crow.

Sadly, they will all jump right back on and pretend they were aboard the whole time and act as if they were never gone. I too saw this after 4-0 last year, people back-peddling, supporting the coach and players and getting behind the program as a whole once they thought they were going to be winning again, only to have it erode ever so quickly as the season wore on and the results did not live to the early promise. Those people jumped right back off again...

dahblue

August 5th, 2010 at 3:57 PM ^

People "dumped the team" because of an "irrational dislike for the coach"?  Not a chance.  First, no one "dumped" the team.  No one.  Do you know anyone who stopped caring about games?  Didn't even know they were on tv?  Nope.  Many people "dumped" the Lions after years of failure, but no one "dumped" Michigan.  Plenty of people were/are frustrated with the performance, but no one "dumped" them to become, say, an Illinois fan.

Second, there is nothing irrational about being upset with 3-9, 5-7 (especially when one of those wins shouldn't even count - DSU).  That's a terrible record.  Folks also have every right to be upset about the first NCAA sanctions in the history of the program (even if the "major" violations were really minor).

It's ok to criticize something that you love.  We all love Michigan football and I highly doubt that anyone here is a "bandwagon" fan, nor has anyone "dumped" the team.

mtzlblk

August 8th, 2010 at 4:13 PM ^

often heard saying, 'I don't want to hear about recruiting and depleted player talent, I heard something about investigation results, but I don't have time to delve into all the complexities of what they found, I want more W and Rich Rodriguez isn't giving it to me. Until such time as I have more W in my cup and my identity as a fan of a Winning team is restored, I am going to blame him for everything that I can. Even though every other major program in history has gone through a downturn or adjustment period at one poit or another, michigan is different and special and shall always be immune to things that impact other teams. They should be magic. I don't appreciate the decades of W that I have already received that have provided me with my sense of entitlement and therefore when I don't get my fill of Win, I will immediately withdraw my support until it comes back and puke and mewl about the coach every chance .Ii get like he is the Devil Incarnate. I will be glad to be spoon-fed bias information from local media sources and I will read those headlines religiously and quote them back to people to justify my puking and mewling. In fact, I will do the same thing that I do when my Mommy doesn't give me what i want and I will drop to the floor and beat my fists and kick and scream until she gives me what i want. If that doesn't work, I will hold my breath until we win again. Gimme, gimme, gimme.'

Three seconds after we win again you will be a big fan of RR and act as if you were on board the whole time and your Mommy will let you stay up to watch night games too. You will probably tell your freinds 'I knew it all along'.

dahblue

August 8th, 2010 at 7:37 PM ^

To quote another NCAA coach, Rich Rod is a "man".  You're treating him like a child.  

He is responsible for his record and the violations.  He's man enough not to run from it and would likely be a bit embarrassed that someone like you would blame the media for his dismal tenure.  The "downturn" has been more than a downturn; it's been a free fall.  Worst stretch in over 50 years, etc., etc.  What you blind apologists fail to understand is that folks like me WERE supporters of RR.  I was fully behind RR.  I even held tight at 3-9.  I was hopeful for most of last season.  Then, I saw the light...I mean reality.  I remain fully behind the team, but the coach needs to prove he's good enough to be here.  If/when he does, he'll have earned the support that he lost through his own poor performance.

When we win again, with RR or another coach, I'll be just the same supporter of the team that I've always been.  I won't be a fan of multiple typos and terrible incoherent argument, but that's what you're here for.  All your talk about "Mommy" is kinda funny though, especially when it takes a child to be so blind to failure that you're willing to excuse it.

mtzlblk

August 9th, 2010 at 3:12 AM ^

I read through the investigation results and would agree that RR bears some small, very small,amount of responsibility for whatever infractions may have occured, he did not as you put it 'bring sanctions with him', that is ludicrous and only points to your woeful lack of knowledge of everything that has gone on. To anyone with even a passing knowldege of what happened it is pretty clear that the current situation was the result of a breakdown in a UM/AD process for gathering and filing CARA forms, a problem that existed before he ever arrived on campus. Do you even bother to read beyond the headlines at all?

I'm not treating him like a child, I'm just not going to crucify him because a bunch of whiny snits can't take the fact that the Michigan program has had a few down years like EVERYONE else has. It happens to every program, sooner or later, get over it.

Quite frankly, I would be more upset with RR if it was revealed that he had been spending his time micromanaging a bunch of paper-pushers when the results on the field were sub-par. I would say to myself, "that guy shouldn't have been worrying about forms, he should be worried about coaching and recruiting until he puts up some more W's."

No one is suggesting running from anything, not sure where you are coming up with that. I am pretty sure that there is a whole team of people from M heading to the NCAA to refute some wildly inaccurate accusations though, which I wouldn't really equate to running away.

I get that you don't comprehend the nuances of the situation and don't care to spend the time or effort to grasp what is really going on. If you want to be obtuse and have your life be as simple as understanding nothing more than "RAWR 8-16!!!!", "RAWR only sanctions ever at UM!!!!" and you can live with having opinions as obtuse as that, that is your business, but don't act like that makes you a diehard fan. Your not.

Laughable to hear you say that when RR wins you will be the same kind of fan that you have always been, it just means that you will always fold in the face of a little diversity and then jump right back on when the Ws come again. You are an ill-informed, myopic, fair-weather fan that only backs a team and coach that wins. Plain and simple. When they don't you will whine and turn on the program until it satisfies your tiny ego to cheer for them again. Pathetic.

RR ashamed of me? That's funny, but I have the feeling that wouldn't be the case. Were I ever to have a conversation with him, I suspect we would have lots to talk about and probably agree on more than a few things.

MGoDC

August 5th, 2010 at 1:32 PM ^

Yes you caught me. I jumped on the Michigan bandwagon when we went 3-9 and then 5-7. I definitely did not root or care for the 9-4 team before that and certainly not the 11-2 team before that.

Or, another possibility is that you could stop trolling and actually read my comment like a rational person.

dahblue

August 5th, 2010 at 3:42 PM ^

Wait, I'm a troll because I don't agree with your post?  I'm irrational but you hope that people who aren't happy with RichRod are "left at the side of the road"?  Ummm...yeah...right.  

I made light of your childish notion that those who question the coach who brought us the 2 worst years of UofM football in over 50 years aren't real fans.  Have a good one.

pullin4blue

August 5th, 2010 at 9:47 AM ^

I think it will take many seasons of winning to get the entire fanbase back. Even though Lloyd (and Mo) were both products of Bo's system there were people who were not accepting of their hiring. Mo self-destructed and Lloyd took over. The biggest problem that we have had at the University of Michigan is that whomever the coach is, it is not Bo. For anyone who lived, attended games, and rooted for Michigan during the Bo era its just not the same. Its like "new coke".  We want the old coke, we want Bo, but we can't have him. When the fans realize that what we have is a damn good coach who will win us games and put Michigan in contention for Championships, they will accept whomever the person is who is on the sidelines.

bluebrains98

August 5th, 2010 at 11:48 AM ^

Absolutely right...people were upset at the Lloyd hiring--not animated enough, not head-coach material, etc. Then, a few years later, Lloyd won the National Championship, and the haters miraculously disappeared. Then, a few years later, he hadn't won another and people were calling for his head right up until he was carried off the field after beating UF, at which point the haters all said, "I've always liked Lloyd Carr."

True Michigan fans support the team and the coaches no matter what. They realize that the school is committed to winning and understand that the insiders know more than they do about how to realize that goal. When DB decides there is a better option out there than RR, that is when I will believe it.  Until then, I think we have a kick-ass coach who is finally getting to the point where he has an equally kick-ass set of personnel to work with. Good thing all the blind haters don't know it :-)

M-Wolverine

August 5th, 2010 at 3:00 PM ^

It's just the candy flavored memories we like to have.  People used to bitch about Bo all the time when he was a coach. "Too conservative" "can't win the Rose Bowl" blah blah blah.  I was in the Alumni bus after his last Rose Bowl (loss) and people were saying "well, maybe now our offense can hit the modern era". But time rosey-ups the glasses a lot, you know? Ten years from now, we'll remember the good times from Lloyd, and the "wanted him out crowd" will mellow.  And people will still (hopefully) be bitching about Rich "because he always loses a game, and can't get back to the title game" or "hasn't won a National Championship in, like, 5 years".  I mean, the standards some people have set for his regime, right here...dominating the Big Ten, multiple National Championships...you don't think some people are going to be disappointed, if he's just Lloyd 2.0?  (Which to even match, he's going to have to start winning the Big Ten every other year, and a National Championship along the way over the next 10 years....as the Conference just got tougher). And then, when all the let down people recover that he didn't win 5 National Championship over his tenure, people will wish the new guy was him, and then start feeling nostalgic over the Rich Rod years....human nature.

jtmc33

August 5th, 2010 at 10:02 AM ^

I would assume every member of MGoBlog has been on the bandwagon for years, and nothing can knowck them off.

Everyone but for Irish, Not a Blue Fan, and that Sparty and pipes up once in a while.  Obviously, those three (and maybe a couple others) are not on their teams' bandwagon or else they wouldn't be shopping around.

jtmc33

August 5th, 2010 at 10:00 AM ^

IIRC, everyone jumped back on the bandwagon after beating ND last year.  Then most of them jumped off after losing to Illinois - and the rest jumped off after Purdue.

This year it will take the 6th win to convince the "band-wagon-fake-fans," and their fearless leaders - the media - to jump back on.  But it will take an 8-5 season to keep them secure in their seatbelts through the summer of 2011

maznbluwolverine

August 5th, 2010 at 10:01 AM ^

All Brandon is looking for is improvement.   Is the team improving the right way?  Is progress being made.  No way in hell can you put anumber of wins on it, that's crazy.

w2j2

August 5th, 2010 at 10:05 AM ^

Like it or not, I find the Michigan fan base similar to other fans of both professional and amateur athletics....  They mostly care about winning.

Sure, they TALK about integrity, character, etc........but for a huge proportion of them, those subjects really are VERY secondary to winning.

To a lot of people, a coach of any sports team could eat babies for breakfast.....as long as he wins.

MGoDC

August 5th, 2010 at 10:08 AM ^

Honestly, I dont think thats the case for many of us on this site at least. I'm not on board with hiring Nick Saban even if he wins a National title for Michigan. It's not worth selling out the entire University for a guy like that.

Bosch

August 5th, 2010 at 10:07 AM ^

most people were back on the band wagon after week 2 last year.

Exhibit A (upper right corner):

Of course, the curse went into effect soon after this release.........

1464

August 5th, 2010 at 10:08 AM ^

I'd say a National Championship converts a large group back to believers.  The ship has sailed on getting the entire fanbase, but hey, there's people calling for Tressel's head, and Meyer's head, and so on.  You can't impress everyone.

rlc

August 5th, 2010 at 10:18 AM ^

I think "off the bandwagon" means people who don't watch and follow the team until they are ranked high, or in a big bowl game. I don't know that not approving of RR, means people are not cheering for and supporting Michigan. I can't think of anyone I know that has stopped going to games, or said they wouldn't until RR was gone. We just have not been competitive in enough games the last few years, and even the fans "on the wagon" search for reasons to explain that. Heck, in the past even when we had 3 or 4 loss seasons there were coaches / players under fire from the fans. I think it is possible to be a supportive fan and disapprove, or have negative opinions, about certain aspects of the program.

I believe most fans understand the program, and individual pieces, are dynamic and change each year. Eight or more wins would settle a lot of the negative opinions. I personally hope Michigan has a great season and we can keep RR in the Big House.

Blue Blood Strip

August 5th, 2010 at 10:21 AM ^

People will fight Coach Rod until he retires.  And then other people will say how they stuck with him during the early years.  Once he starts winning the people who fight him will just do it quieter.