Harbaugh & American Sniper
There is some controversy on campus about the University showing American Sniper. It was cancelled after some protest, but it has since been rescheduled. I know that politics aren't supposed to be talked about on the board, but it involves our beloved coach.
Harbaugh weighed in on the matter via twitter:
"Michigan Football will watch "American Sniper"! Proud of Chris Kyle & Proud to be an American & if that offends anybody then so be it!"
Apologies for not being sure how to embed twitter posts.
http://www.si.com/college-football/2015/04/08/michigan-football-jim-harbaugh-american-sniper-screening
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2015/04/08/after-university-canceled-american-sniper-showing-football-coach-harbaugh-made-this-announcement/
Harbaugh has stirred a bit of controversy on campus with this tweet- a minority of students have complained about this.
My personal opinion on this is that I like Harbaugh more because of it. He is not afraid to step on people's toes, and voice his opinion. He is unapologetic. That's exactly how a coach should be.
As far as the film goes, I would prefer the University show it. Although I am not a big fan of Chris Kyle, I can understand why people would be. There are a lot of inspirational things about him, but also some negatives. I think the film addresses the negatives of war adequately, and makes a nuanced argument- Kyle is a controversial figure.
[ED-Seth: Aaaaand we're locked. Handed out one ban. Leaving because it's news that Harbaugh waded into it. This is why we don't talk about politics. But see Comment 14 for a good example of why I wish we could sometimes.]
times when it was nice to look at, he found the right mix of authenticity and gloss to make a sharp looking film for the most part. But there is simply no depth to the story or the character(part of that has to do with the lack of any indication of moral complexity of the person on which the film is based at least based on his writings) and being that there is no central internal conflict to build around, he is left to base a good portion of the war sequences around a "rivalry" with individual enemy combatants that was barely even mentioned in the book. At times he seemed to want to make a movie that was nearly a documentary but then abandoned it at times when he realized that the material itself was just not that interesting.
Cooper was good, but he always is. Other than his performance I thought it was just a pretty bad(average at best) movie. Best picture nominee - come on?
I'll take Paddington.
No doubt about that ijohnb. I was dragged to see this with my lady, and was thoroughly unimpressed. Then again, I hate war movies, and psuedo patriotic drivel. Paddington was much better anyway.
A university education should be about seeking unity through diversity. This rarely happens, though, as one ideology runs rampant, unquestioned and supreme. Students are powerless to disagree without facing backlash. It's unfortunate. And it often gets movies like this censored.
agreed
IMO a neo-nazi ideology should be shouted down and, before claiming this is an outrageous example, recent news suggests there is apparently a fair bit of these feelings at least in OK, IN and AL. And, because I'm confident life on earth is older than 10,000 years, I'm also going to be very curt with someone with a fundementalist argument on this subject as well. Overall though I agree with your point, it is more difficult for a conservative viewpoint to get a fair hearing in a university setting than a liberal one.
I'm with Coach. Show the film and talk about it. What are you afraid of?
There is NOTHING wrong with a film glorifying war and a soldier in war--just as there is NOTHING wrong in a film totally condemning war in a blanket manner. Both are legitimate expressions. The most concerning problem to me on campuses today is that the left, which began as a free speech movement, is now actively censoring opinions that they find wrong or offensive. They now are no better at all than the people they protested against.
People can not like this film for any variety of reasons, but to ban it shows incredible hypocrisy and weakness. The irony, and their heads would explode if you told them this, is that the people who want to censor this film are just as fundamentalist and closed-minded as Jerry Falwell or any other Biblical literalist that they seem to enjoy bashing.
I got lots of very positive press from lots of very conservative commentators. I was expecting a very conservative viewpoint of the Iraq conflict. Not so. I didn't see the film as biased at all. Just pretty good. I think much of the conservative press doing the commentary either didn't watch it and assumed it was something it was not, or took credit for it on behalf of their own political belief system.
As for not showing the film at M because someone may get offended? That's bullshit.
Double post
Your view on the movie is irrelevent to me. It isn't fair or right that the majority of people were okay with watching the movie and the minority that wasn't got it shut down.
I agree. They show terrible independent movies on campus all the time with no issues. American Sniper was little more than a middle of the road military movie, who cares if it is shown on campus? Censorship is universally bad.
I actually agree with you even though it seems like you are calling me out. I don't think a majority/minority opinion should determine what ideas students are exposed to. Obviously the majority opinion will have more influence in the matter, but universities are supposed to push people outside of their comfort zone when it comes to ideas.
Wasn't calling you out. When I said "your" I meant it in a way meaning anybody.
Indeed....that the University would capitulate to the whims of a few hundred students I find troubling, even if American Sniper is shown at a later time.
One of the privileges of being an American is freedom of choice. If a bunch of individuals or a group of individuals don't want to watch, then they shouldn't. As for historical inaccuracies, I'll leave that topic alone to be in compliance with the lack of politics on this blog.
Good for Harbaugh.
In fairness, "the University" didn't cancel it. The group that was sponsoring it cancelled it. As has been mentioned, actual University classes show much more controversial (albeit, older) films than American Sniper.
The problem is that we've become a society of where the wants, needs & desires of a few outweigh the wants, needs and desires of the many.
We've also forgotten that being offended is a choice just as viewing the movie is a choice. They could have un-offended themselves by not going to the movie. People cause 99% of their own problems
I'm in a pretty good mood today, and censorship, especially when justified by political correctness, makes my blood boil. So I'll let UMChick speak for me on this issue. We're the same age and this overly PC garbage started when we were in high school.
Now here's a picture of some bunnies.
but you are wise beyond your years
Because a society where the majority opinion is de facto regarded as correct is certain to provide freedom and justice for all citizens.
It's easy to roll your eyes and complain about the vocal minority when you're not actually a part of that minority.
I don't agree with the University's decision to pull the viewing of the movie in this instance, but taking this specific case and using it to paint a broad-stroke "this is what is wrong with America" comment is heavy-handed and simplistic.
I just always figured part of the university experience was being exposed to ideas outside your comfort zone.
Any ideas that don't align with the loud minority will be killed
The whole "brotherhood" theme is a big part of the movie so I can see why he would want to show it.
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They should also see Lone Survivor too for the "brotherhood" theme.
Ugh. That was a good, but tough movie to watch.
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This is just not university news. It has hit all the local news sources as well as national news as well. Most of the commenters have been very critical of U of M and their decision (which has been reversed by the way).
Harbaugh is to be greatly commended for his take no BS from anybody stance.
It's gone national in certain political circles, FWIW.
Like the sidebar of Facebook and the front page of Reddit? Yup, two decidedly right-wing rags.
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Reddit users are so afraid of the "PC police" and "SJWs" it's amazing they can even find the will to leave their parents' basements. If being a SJW means being against racism, sexism, homophobia, and pedophilia apologism, sign me up.
It hit Foxnews before both of those, so you can feel some relief now.
Being anti-Chris Kyle is so hot right now. It's cool to see Harbaugh go against the grain.
Ironic that it coincides with it being so hot right now for people pretend to be like Chris Kyle.
I think the bigger thing is being against the current climate of censorship going on. I personally think Chris Kyle was a racist and a proven liar, but the movie was still great mainly because it was neither pro nor anti war. It both showed the view of many of the people actually fighting and it showed the toll it takes on many of them. In other words, a great, nuanced movie
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How any American can speak so poorly about a man who risked his life to protect this country pre and post 911 amazes me.
Joining the military doesn't make you immune from criticism. And the dude lied about a lot of stuff. Like punching out Jesse Ventura, Who sued and won. During that suit Kyle admitted some of the stories in his book are untrue. He also claims he shot dozens of American citizens post-Katrina as part of an illegal military deployment.
Dude was a liar.
So the hate comes from fish stories he told after spending 10 years serving this country before and after 9/11? Tough crowd. Should have collected the $80,000 bounty on him.
Can he not simultaneously be deserving of our respect for serving our country and be a liar about certain things and deserving of our criticism? More than one thing can be true at the same time.
Yes El Jeffe. This. Sadly the majority sees things in black or white. Objectivity is vilified because people are supposed to pick sides but not allowed to see the good and bad in something.
For those who are rabid about others questioning Chris Kyle, take note: No one is discounting his service record or the story there, it's the stories AFTER his return people have issues with. When witnesses and a court of law show you're not being truthful it does no good to bury your head in the sand and spew hate to others because they don't share your "throw the baby out with the bath water" mentality.
...level of nuance that the overall conversation is missing. I guess it would have been hard on twitter for Harbaugh to say that he was proud of some of the things that Chris Kyle, did, but not his serial (and self-serving) mendacity.
This thread was a bad idea.
Everything today is either black or white, no in between. We as a society have lost our appreciation of nuance, and it's a damn shame.
Because within nuance there is discourse and the possibility for persuasion, and lets face it, in today's society there is no greater sin than changing your position on something.
It takes a very secure person to admit they are wrong. The world is full of people trying to hide the fact that they are tragically insecure so you get shouting matches instead of intelligent discourse.
People seem to think that simply signing up for the police academy or armed forces puts you into a different, saintly category than the rest of society. You can recognize/acknowledge their service without acting as if they can't make mistakes or blindly supporting just due to association.
It's like people think disagreeing with a man in uniform's actions at any point makes them less than American. I just can't get with that.
Well, when said man was a xenophobic liar at best and a murderer at worst- I think it's fair to question the blind patriotic love he gets. It's a dangerous path and a slippery slope one goes down when they make it so we are unable to question 'heroes' simply because they killed a bunch of our 'enemies.' Also, please tell me what the Iraqi people had to do with 9/11- Iraq had nothing do to with 9/11, so who was Chris Kyle in fact protecting us from? Was he protecting us from people who were fighting against a country which invaded them competely illegally? It amazes me that some of us are so blinded by patriotism that we cannot intelligently discuss both sides of an issue without getting offended that someone is being anti-American when they bring up the completely valid facts that Chris Kyle was not all that great of a person.
As for the movie- I think it is incredibly stupid to censor it. I'm all for them showing whatever the hell movie they want- it could have been a good thing that prompted a lot of intelligent discussion and debate. The problem lies on the extremes of both sides of the issue- I agree with coach Harbaugh that if the showing of the movie offends people, too bad. I would however also argue that it is more offensive and less American to prevent people from thinking for themselves and asking questions in the name of love for country and reverence for 'heroes.'
lol... right cuz professional soldiers, many of whom kill for a living, are just perfect angels and immune from criticism.
Thank god you're not in charge of anything important. Do some reading and you might just figure out that Iraq had zilch to do with 9/11.
Actually I was refering to the issue of people pretending to be a Navy Seal, or an Army Ranger, or Special Forces, or "Delta", or a Marine.
It's not hot. What does that even mean?!
I am Lebanese Canadian. I love Clint Eastwood, Bradly Cooper, and Jim Harbaugh, but that shit too dehumanizing for me. I refuse to watch it because I find it offensive.
Same goes for some South Park episodes. Stan trying to give himself cancer so he can smoke weed makes me uncomfortable. I won't watch that episode again. That said, I've watched a million other episodes that were bound to offend other groups/people. I think not watching something should be personal decision, but an atheltic coach getting invovled with this issue doesn't make sense to me.
It was Randy and I also think that episode of SP and American Sniper are not even in the same universe. On top of that, I think comedies should be treated differently in "social outrage" than dramas, I guess.
It's Always In Sunny In Philadelphia is probably one the most offensive show ever produced, it happens to also be some of the greatest comedy ever put on TV as well.