Did anyone else hear Rick Leach this morning?

Submitted by Garvie Craw on October 15th, 2009 at 8:32 AM

Rick Leach was on with Sam Webb this morning, and he was very uncomplimentary toward Lloyd Carr. He went so far as to say that LC has flipped a huge middle finger at the program. I would relate what he said, but I wouldn't be as accurate as I'd like. Did anyone with a better memory hear what he said?



October 15th, 2009 at 8:46 AM ^

the tail end of it. He was fired up about something. I'm hoping they put a podcast of it up soon.

I hope Coach Rod brings Rick in to charge up the players for at least one game this season. I'm ready to run through a brick wall for the guy.


October 15th, 2009 at 8:47 AM ^

According to Greg @MVictors, Leach thought that Lloyd sitting in a suite full of Iowa people, among a few other things, was a middle finger to the program. Leach is definitely an opinionated guy who loves Michigan, but sometimes I wonder if he doesn't say stuff like this intentionally to stir things up.


October 15th, 2009 at 9:35 AM ^

If someone offered me a seat in a box, I'd be in there too. I don't see how his argument has any merit and it does seem like he is trying to stir the pot a little bit with over-the-top claims against a former Michigan football coach.


October 15th, 2009 at 8:51 AM ^

He implied that Carr went to the Iowa game as a guest of someone from Iowa and that someone should investigate that and report on it.

lexus larry

October 15th, 2009 at 11:20 AM ^

how about Bump Elliot? (sp?)

The coach who preceded Bo, whom Brian (always) suggests is looking at a tasty sandwich during the Canham-Bo introductory presser.

Bump got 'promoted' to Asst. AD, not fired, and then went to Iowa as their AD. They LOVE him there, and he's still a Michigan man, through-and-through. (Don't know if he's still part of the org, or an honorary retired type.)

So, yeah. As a previous poster suggested, it seemed Rick was more on a "investigate THIS while you're at it, ya pantywaists" than ripping on LC.

My $0.02.


October 15th, 2009 at 11:25 AM ^

When I heard Leach I thought he was impugning Lloyd, but you're right. He could just be saying that certain people are trying to take Rodriguez down, and that those people are Lloyd supporters (or supporters of the old ways) and that if the Freep were really just interested in U of M controversies they could investigate Lloyd sitting with Iowa.


October 15th, 2009 at 8:54 AM ^

And Leach loved Bo. And he knows that after Bo retired, he would NEVER, EVER HAVE SAT WITH THE OPPOSITION, especially in an important game. Leach has also been very outspoken about those in the program trying to sabotage RR's tenure, and that everyone should pull together for Michigan.

Maybe Leach has connected a few dots and is getting really pissed off. I'm glad he is standing up for Michigan.

Canton Woverine

October 15th, 2009 at 9:13 AM ^

I Listened to Rick Leach this morning as well. Rick started off by venting about those people with an agenda or an "axe to grind" attacking the GPA story and Rich Rod. He then went on about how Lloyd "flipped the bird" at Rich Rod by taking a trip to Iowa and hanging out with his Iowa friends. With all of these "we know who they are" references to who has been trying to sabotage Rich Rod and the program, I have taken away that it is Lloyd and his minions. Disgruntled ex-assistants and their friends like Rosenberg who supposedly is so close to one ex-assistant that they have vacationed together. If it really is Lloyd and company I wish someone would just call them out. First they torpedo Les Miles and now they want to attack Rich Rod because he doesn't fit the mold that Lloyd prefers. I am sorry, but Lloyd was just a caretaker to Bo's program and that is all he will ever be.


October 15th, 2009 at 9:55 AM ^

The Free Press article has little to do with that. At worst, somebody from the previous administration told the Free press that they never kept team GPAs so RR's claim was bogus. But we HAVE NO IDEA if that happened or not. And it's moot, because it's stupid...the Free Press still wrote the story.

PS, the Rosenberg vacationing with asst coaches thing is ludicrous. I don't know where that came from, but it's conspiracy theory from the nut-jobs in the fan-base.


October 15th, 2009 at 11:43 AM ^


I have had drinks with Bo. Have variuos high end boosters in my cell phone directory. And have sat in the same seats since the Leach days.

See, we can all say we have Insiderz bona fides.

Does not change the fact that you have offered no proof to support any of your claims other than 'look at me, I am an anonymous poster on the Internet and I am Michigan Man, so hear me roar."

This site was a lot better this morning. I'll leave it at that.

The King of Belch

October 15th, 2009 at 11:46 AM ^

You've been going to Michigan for 25 years? Isn't it about time you graduate? Or have you not yet picked a major? What do your parents think aout this? I think you should be ashamed that you are wasting their money, smoking the pot, masturbating constantly, and not doing anything with the money they send you for college.

I bet you're one of those guys who enrolls, and sends his parents a bill for lik $34,000 and when they send the money, you run right out to the drugs pushers and the hooker pimps and blow all that money in one night, and then sleep on the floor of some friends who have a house somewhere near campus--and none of you actually GO to Michigan, but you say you do so you can get laid.

And what's this about being a 36 year season ticket holder? Did you get season tickets when you were like 11 years old? That's pretty precocious.

STW P. Brabbs

October 15th, 2009 at 4:16 PM ^

He won more national championships than Bo ever did.

Lloyd: 6-7 in bowl games (2-3 in what can be considered BCS bowls); 75.3% overall win percentage; 77.9% conference win percentage; 5 Big 10 championships in 13 seasons.

Bo: 5-12 in bowl games (2-10 in Rose, Orange Bowls), 80.2% overall win percentage; 85.6% conference win percentage; 13 Big 10 championships in 21 seasons.

Pretty comparable, IME. You're a moron if you don't think Lloyd was a very good coach. It's not like he won that 'ship with Bo's players, either.


October 15th, 2009 at 9:14 AM ^

Lloyd has never embraced RR and never "welcomed" him into the Michigan family. Lloyd's silence during the Freep fiasco speaks volumes about where he stands.

From more than one source, including a former player under Bo, the same story emerges that there are Lloyd supporters and on the other side there are those that are willing to give RR a fair chance.

This divisiveness both within the Department and among former players has contributed to some of the negative press.

I think RR has handled it very well and has never publicly complained about the internal issues.


October 15th, 2009 at 10:22 AM ^

"Lloyd's silence during the Freep fiasco speaks volumes about where he stands."

Where does this notion come from that Lloyd needs to say something or that his silence makes him somehow complicit in the attacks against Rodriguez? The only thing his silence speaks to is that he wants to remain out of the spotlight and enjoy his retirement.

As you said, Rodriguez has handled this well with little complaint about any internal divisions. He will continue to do so, and continue to shape the program as he sees fit. Lloyd doesn't need to say anything, and Rodriguez doesn't need Lloyd to say anything. Silence does not equal culpability.


October 15th, 2009 at 10:31 AM ^

RR can handle the program himself, and Lloyd doesn't need to say anything.

I knew people were unhappy with Lloyd in his last few years, but it always seemed to be "He was a good coach but the game passed him by. I'll miss him because he was the classiest coach I've ever known"

Now it seems more like "He's trying to ruin the program" which is honestly an opinion that I never thought I'd hear.


October 15th, 2009 at 11:31 AM ^

The only one to make note of Carr’s visit and make it an issue was Leach 5 days after the fact. No one else made a big deal of it. That’s not stepping into the spotlight. That’s putting Lloyd under a microscope.

Bando Calrissian

October 15th, 2009 at 9:40 AM ^

Seems like a ton of conjecture to me.

Now, if Lloyd were to have been at the game as a guest of, say, Bump Elliott, who is a former athletic director at Iowa AND a Michigan All-American and former head coach, would Lloyd be in the wrong? Frankly, who the heck cares who he sat with? Was he wearing Iowa clothes? I bet you he wasn't. I fail to see how this is something to get worked up about.

Just because Rick Leach went on WTKA and went on the rampage doesn't mean that everything Rick Leach is saying is the Gospel truth. Rick Leach has always been about Rick Leach. This isn't new.

Lloyd Carr has more love for Michigan than probably all of us combined. He gave almost the entirety of his professional career to help build the tradition of Michigan football. He is a fine ambassador of our University, and it is disingenuous to imply that he is anti-Michigan.


October 15th, 2009 at 10:01 AM ^

But that doesn't mean:

a) we all have to (we're not sheep that blindly follow Rick Leach)...
b) it means we can somehow blame Lloyd for the Freep FOIA'ing team GPA records and writing a dumb article about it
c) it means we should blame Lloyd for the angst around the program the last few years


October 15th, 2009 at 10:29 AM ^

"we're not sheep that blindly follow Rick Leach..."

I don't blindly follow anyone. I do have a hard time with people who cite Leach's support for the team as simply "trying to stir the pot". What's his motivation other than passion for the team?

Why would people "blindly" support Carr and attack Leach? Without knowing any facts themselves, they dismiss Leach's support and bend over backwards to apologize for Carr. Lloyd's support during the maelstrom of the last two years has been passive, at best. Leach is out there throwing his reputation and support behind Michigan's current coach at every turn and somehow Rick's the troublemaker?

Some of you are far more loyal to Carr than the Michigan program.


October 15th, 2009 at 11:45 AM ^

Leach "connected the dots" in the same way that the Freep connected the dots from Sundays at Schembechler into major violations and taking advantage of the poor kids.

There are rabid M supporters and participants who can be just as close minded and irrational as the people we all criticize here. Say what you want about LC and his coaching ability the last few years, but to accuse him in that way is blind and dumb


October 15th, 2009 at 9:06 AM ^

He thinks Lloyd might be behind the Freep stuff. I posted just after you. I caught the whole thing. He said that he can't get info about his own son from the University, so where is all this insider stuff coming from.

I was shocked when I heard Leach call out Lloyd like that.

Maize and Blue…

October 15th, 2009 at 9:14 AM ^

He was sitting in a box with the Iowa coaching staff. Considering he is still getting a paycheck from Michigan and has never really come out publicly in support of RichRod and the new regime. Thus, the giving the middle finger analogy. Quite frankly, Leach is three times the Michigan man that Lloyd could ever be.

The King of Belch

October 15th, 2009 at 11:55 AM ^

Tin foil hat wearing Scout Fucktards say ANYTHING besides "Lloyd's silence speaks volumes"--you morons literally sound like a bunch of belching 6th graders who meet once a week in someone's basement underneath a bunch of blankets propped up by couch cushions to discuss stuff like this.

Please take this garbage back to Scout or Rivals or whatever--it isn't selling here--and NO the silence of MgoBlog or Brian does not speak volumes HAHHHhHHAHAHAHAHAHALOLZ (Cue the Twilight Zone theme).

The King of Belch

October 15th, 2009 at 12:28 PM ^

Right now you are just contributing to all this bullshit conspiracy stuff and dragging Lloyd Carr into it. It's rumor mongering silliness and to be honest, though I have come to expect this kind of shit from the average Michigan fan, it is still reaching levels that embarrass even me.


October 15th, 2009 at 12:49 PM ^

If you want to be treated with respect, perhaps you should show some to a man who worked for the school for most of his professional career, and still does to this day - and a guy that's contributed more to the school than you or I ever will. Perhaps when you start showing some, you may get some.


October 15th, 2009 at 1:10 PM ^

Lloyd has already been as supportive as he can be without being intrusive. He distains the media, and has made a point even from the time of the coaching search that he did not want an active hand in matters. He purposefully distanced himself, and it would be hypocritical to inject himself back into the mix uninvited.

Most importantly, I could not think of any advantage that would outweigh the damage that would come from Lloyd speaking out. Rodriguez is halfway through his second season. There have been charges that he cannot handle the burden and pressure associate with this program. Nonetheless, Rodriguez has handled himself admirably in the face of alleged scandal after alleged scandal, each one ending up without merit. To have Lloyd come in at this juncture would undermine all of that.


October 15th, 2009 at 5:19 PM ^

And gave you a +1, despite you telling me to keep my yap shut.

I think the "silence speaks volumes" cliche is pretty tired myself. I should have found a better way of articulating my point. My bad. And pretty lame.

I can call MYSELF out for a poorly written (and impulsive) post.


October 15th, 2009 at 9:44 AM ^

but that last comment is idiotic.

Rick Leach is a glorified cheerleader who is not particularly bright. He says what he says to defend his view and perception of the program.

Further, IMHO your characterization of Lloyd's conduct is way off base. Lloyd Carr said during the coaching search that if they could land RR they'd be getting the brightest young coach in the game.

Since RR was hired, Lloyd has not gotten in his way. RR said the equivalent of the cupboard was bear, etc. etc. last year. RR then ran his system offense without players suited to it. The team went 3-9 and did not go to a bowl game for the first time since, what, 1968. We have now lost to State twice in a row, another first.

There have been plenty an opportunity for Lloyd Carr to make a seemingly benign comment here or there that would have raised all kinds of problems for Rich. He has never done so.

I have no idea what Lloyd actaully thinks about RR as I have never spoken to him. I do know from years of observation that Lloyd Carr has far too much character and love for the University of Michigan to do anything which would harm it or its coach, period. Even if it has meant remaining silent about the shape of the team he left for RR or the lack of conditioning that has been inferred.

As for "in the box", etc. etc., you do recall that Mary Sue Coleman invited Kirk Ferentz to A2 to discuss potential coaching candidates at the end of Carr's tenure, right? There is, and has long been, mutual respect among the coaches of Iowa and Michigan. In fact, Ferentz himself said after the game that Michigan's got a great coach and that he'll be working his magic soon.

I don't see a problem with a coach traveling with his team to an away game and visiting a booth with a former assistant in it. It certainly doesn't make Lloyd any less of a Michigan Man. Rick Leach is a terrific cheerleader. Let's not confuse his comments with anything more than that, though.


October 15th, 2009 at 9:52 AM ^

For all of the talk, coming from RRod, of what a sorry state the program was in when he came here, LLoyd has done an admirable job in just keeping his mouth shut. For what it's worth, RRod took over a team that was returning most of it's offensive line, a 5-star QB, and a relatively stacked and deep defense. It was when RRod came aboard that a lot of the OL left, Boren transferred, Mallet transferred, and then our defense played terribly last year. For what it's worth, Lloyd has gotten really slammed for the shape the team was in last year, when, it wasn't really his fault.

I think the LLoyd bashing is a bit unwarranted.


October 15th, 2009 at 10:48 AM ^

Mallet probably would've left anyway and our D was going to play badly no matter what due to the incredibly poor coaching, player development and the lack of teaching of football fundamentals that was endemic under Carr.