September 15th, 2013 at 9:50 AM ^

Refs may have fucked up, but what was stave doing not getting ready to spike the ball? As soon as he took the "knee" he should've lined up his offense to spike the ball immediately. Not sure why he stepped back in the first place, total amateur hour


September 15th, 2013 at 10:32 AM ^

Breaking it down:

1. As far as I can tell Stave never took a knee. He rolled left and laid the ball down on the ground.

2. I don't know if laying the ball down like that is the same as a kneeldown but my guess is probably not. If you recall the famous fumblerooski play that's how the QB gave the ball to the OL -- it was treated like a fumble recovery HOWEVA the fumblerooski is illegal now so who knows?

3. The ASU players treated it (understandably) like a fumble, so you can't flag them for delay of game.

4. That does not excuse the refs from getting the call right. They should have huddled, figured out what happened, decided on a ruling, and applied it, resetting the clock if necessary. As badly as Stave screwed up (and I'm 98% sure this is ultimately all on Stave for not taking a knee or spiking the ball) for them to walk off the field the way they apparently did was inexcusable.


September 15th, 2013 at 11:17 AM ^

Upon further review -- had the sound down and didn't hear the whistle.  You're right.  The whistle blew before the ASU player fell on the ball, so there wasn't a fumble recovery. The delay of game is a closer call -- was he trying to stall or was he just confused like everyone else? -- but probably because players are supposed to stop when the whistle goes.  At the very least ASU shouldn't have been rewarded for it. My real main points still stands: The refs should have taken time to get the call right.  And what they probably should have done was reset the clock to about 10-15 seconds and let Wisconsin spike the ball.


September 15th, 2013 at 11:26 AM ^

I can't understand how every 7th play is reviewed in college football (and every other play in Basketball) and yet, not only did the officials NOT review it, they didn't even huddle. They simply ran off the field amid mass confusion. Isn't that why you have booth reviews? What a disaster. Definite mistake by Stave but the officials need to do better than that


September 15th, 2013 at 10:43 AM ^

The whistle clearly sounded before the ASU player flopped on it. By rule, if the whistle sounds, you're down, and that can't be overturned IIRC (no "continuation rule"). So at about 15ish seconds, the officials had made the final decision that he was down right there. From there, it's simply a matter of they taking forever to spot the ball. Yes, the Wisconsin actions were odd and not advised, but if the officials had, you know, done their job, there would have been zero concern over time. 


September 15th, 2013 at 4:08 PM ^

he was complaining about to to official. To hurry up and get the ASU players off the ball so they could spike it. So basically he was urging the refs to spot it, they just wouldn't listen.

Also people keep saying they didn't realize the clock was running, of course they did, there is no reason they wouldn't. The issue and this is the point that people keep on missing, is that the offense can't actually line up over the ball until it is spotted, it wasn't spotted by the ref until there were only 2 or 3 seconds left.


September 15th, 2013 at 11:59 AM ^

I think the correct call would have been to call a penalty on the ASU player for laying on the ball, thus stopping the clock and giving Wiscy a field goal that would have been more like an extra point attempt.


September 15th, 2013 at 12:15 PM ^

there would have to be 4 seconds left after the spike. isn't there a new rule this year that requires a 3 sec runoff of the clock following a spike??

still with 18 secs left there should have been plenty of time to snap, knee lineup snap and spike but hey that was a big play by that d-lineman


September 15th, 2013 at 12:23 PM ^

They got far too cute on the road, especially given the makeup of the officiating crew. It was idiotically risky to not have Stave spike the ball instead of taking that knee. And if you're going to take a knee, he should have retreated a few yards so that he wasn't hidden by his OL, and the knee needed to last longer than the split second he took. It's not surprising to me that the officials missed the knee.

Wisky put themselves into the position of relying on hostile and/or incompetent officials to make the right call in a confusing situation, and it cost them the chance to win the game.


September 15th, 2013 at 12:37 PM ^

He didn't even need to spike the ball, because the previous play ended out of bounds.  The clock was already stopped for them, so they could have done whatever they wanted.  They created a clock problem when there wasn't one.



September 15th, 2013 at 12:34 PM ^

That was just a disaster on all fronts.  The officials certainly could have flagged the ASU guy for delay of game, but Wisconsin's got to take a look in the mirror here.  Calling a running play of any kind with 18 seconds left and no timeouts is playing with fire.  You should only do that if you can be absolutely certain your players know how to pull that off, and judging from the confusion that ensued, it didn't look like they did.  If you're going to run what they did, your QB needs to fall down on the ground (to avoid any confusion about the play being live), hand the ball to the official (trying to spot the ball yourself only wastes time), and immediately get everyone lined up - don't chitchat with the refs while the clock is running.

If you're not confident your QB can handle all that, don't run a play inbounds.  Throw one pass into the endzone or just kick the FG already.



September 15th, 2013 at 2:02 PM ^

It's like traveling to a third world country and assuming you can take risks thinking that the local officials aren't corrupt and/or incompetent

I watched a portion of the game earlier and I thought Wisky looked like they were going to win comfortably. Can't believe that ASU had gotten the lead.


September 15th, 2013 at 2:05 PM ^

With no time outs, I understand you can't take a knee or fall, because the clock would keep running. Is your kicker that bad he needs to have the ball centered? When the game is on the line, spike the damn ball and hope your kicker practices from all angles. Stave did something the refs probably have never seen before, and the way they handled it was basically by the book. It is not on Stave though, someone told him to center the ball.


September 15th, 2013 at 4:15 PM ^

to spot the ball in that situation is not handling it by the book. The book is that when time is running out refs are supposed to make an effort to spot the ball quickly, instead these refs were acting like it was the middle of the first quarter in their sense of urgency. Regardless of what  you thought about Wisky's decision making, there is no way you argue that refs handled that sequence correctly or by the book.


September 15th, 2013 at 6:19 PM ^

If they are not careful, this can get in their heads and tank their whole season the way the Colorado Hail Mary tanked our season in '94.  We were never right afrter that, and the players and coaches have admitted it.


Hugh Jass

September 15th, 2013 at 6:55 PM ^

take a knee - he set the ball on the ground which is a fumble and Arizona st. fell on it.  The officials should have stopped the clock and awarded the ball to state 1st and 10.