Comprehensive Thursday Penn State Thread

Submitted by BiSB on November 10th, 2011 at 12:39 PM

Your Penn State thoughts for today go here. ALL of them.

Comments

ATLalumni

November 10th, 2011 at 1:24 PM ^

my fiance' works for CNN here in Atlanta.  She just texted me that the anchors are working on a lead that goes past what we've already seen.  They are checking into a lead that Sandusky was also pimping these kids out to donors.  THIS IS UNCONFIRMED, yet more could still come out of this.  Terrible.

Again, just informing you of a lead that CNN is working on behind the scenes.

EDIT: again, just confirming what BISB posted above.  This is about to get much messier.

CRex

November 10th, 2011 at 1:23 PM ^

My hope is that the BoT fired the President and Paterno, figuring the rest of the fish could be fired by the interim President.  So I want to see the interim President terminate McQueary today or tomorrow.  

 

WolverineRage

November 10th, 2011 at 1:20 PM ^

...that the "pimping" allegations aren't true.  It's too disgusting to even think about.

1) Have there been any more stories about the prosecutor who just disappeared a few years ago?  That to me is just a weird facet of this entire story.

2) What bugs me about the way the media handled this, is how it wasn't really a "story" until after the weeks football games were over.  At least that is how it felt to me.

It started on Saturday where ESPN just referred to it as "sexual assault of young men".  Which, not being familiar with anything surrounding Sandusky, my friends and I all assumed it was college guys or at worst high school recruits, which is bad but not as what it turned out to be.  Did ESPN not know?  Or, were they tempering it for some reason or another?

And granted, I was on the road most of Sunday but there was hardly any mention of it on the radio.  And even Monday there wasn't a lot.  Then Tuesday it blew up.

Am I the only one who feels that way?

And clearly, the way its being discussed after the fact where its all about Joe Paterno's f'ing legacy is disgusting.  The people who rioted last night give me little faith for the next batch of college graduates and their ability to put things in proper perspective.

And btw, Buckeye or not, Kirk Herbstreit's comments last night were dead on, on all fronts.

jg2112

November 10th, 2011 at 1:28 PM ^

How about.....it wasn't really a story or released until Joe Paterno got his 409th win, passing Eddie Robinson?

I think people should stop calling Paterno "the winningest coach in major college football" and instead recognize John Gagliardi of St. John's University in Minnesota, who has 459 wins, as the winningest coach in college football history, full stop.

Yeoman

November 10th, 2011 at 2:15 PM ^

It became a story when the grand jury handed down the indictment. Up to that point it was just a rumor, and one that was apparently easy to dismiss (as pointed out upthread, that's what happened on this board as well).

Or are you suggesting that the prosecutor and/or presiding judge arranged the schedule so the indictment wouldn't come down until Joe got his 409? I suppose that's not inconceivable.

bouje13

November 10th, 2011 at 1:28 PM ^

Hard on mcqueary but he was just a grad assistant and if he over jumped joe pa who is the most powerful man on campus he'd never get another job in the business again because it is a fraternity.
<br>
<br>I'm not condoning any of this just trying to point out that he did about as much as he could do (unless he didn't really tell what he saw which we will never really know what was really said).
<br>
<br>But there is no excuse for Joe Pas inaction he was the man and there are no repercussions for his actions. He blatantly did the wrong thing just as he did last night with his inaction and then egging on the kids.

Moleskyn

November 10th, 2011 at 1:39 PM ^

That seems a little sensationalistic to me. He was at his home, where else is he going to go? He would have to be retarded to step foot on that school property right now.

Now, the fact that his home is so close to an elementary school in the first place seems to be more than a little suspicious at this point. I think it's safe to assume that he won't be allowed anywhere near any kids for the rest of his life non-jail life, though.

willow

November 10th, 2011 at 1:36 PM ^

Per the NY Times,  the worst condemnation of all is that the President of PSU, Graham Spanier, is a trained therapist with a PhD in Sociology!  They had a trained, expert professional at the very top of the Administration who knew better than most the proper procedure to follow and that pedophiles are difficult, if not to impossible, to rehabilitate.

 
Quote:  "Spanier, 63, has helped to raise the academic prestige of Penn State during his tenure. A trained therapist with a Ph.D. in sociology,"
 

Engin77

November 10th, 2011 at 2:17 PM ^

goes even further, in an article entitled:
Penn State's Dangerous Culture of Silence at the Top

Former university president Graham Spanier, not Joe Paterno, deserves the majority of the blame for covering up the child-molestation allegations

http://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2011/11/penn-states-dangerous-culture-of-silence-at-the-top/248231

Alton

November 10th, 2011 at 2:44 PM ^

This is referring to something that I find to be one of the most important secondary points of the story, and one that everybody in the media seems to be ignoring:  the reason that everybody kept quiet.

When the House of Representatives was investigating the Nixon White House's reaction to the Watergate break-in, Nixon staffer Jeb Magruder was asked "When was it decided that there would be a cover-up?"  The answer:  "We never considered that there wouldn't be a cover-up."

So here are the top 3 people in the University's athletic governance structure--the President, the AD, the football coach--all deciding, either independently or collectively, to try to keep this from getting out.  You can't say that the cover-up is as bad as the original crime, but you can certainly say that the cover-up allowed more children to be abused, and that the people covering for Sandusky would of course have known that was likely to be the result.  They were more concerned about their own reputations than they were about these kids. 

As far as McQueary is concerned, I almost wonder if he was ordered not to go to the cops.  Of course, he should have ignored that order if he was given it, but I do wonder what kind of pressures he was facing from above.

profitgoblue

November 10th, 2011 at 1:38 PM ^

Just saw a report that Nebraska's AD is concerned for the Nebraska players' safety in Happy Valley this weekend.  Something I never even considered.  Is anyone else thinking that this game should not happen (even though it probably has to happen because of scheduling, etc.)?  Can you imagine what will happen in and out of the stadium if Nebraska rolls in and smokes PSU?

 

reshp1

November 10th, 2011 at 1:48 PM ^

I don't want to jump to conclusions, but holy crap

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/45243142/ns/sports-college_football/

"[Centre County District Attorney Ray Gricar] disappeared on April 15, 2005 after telling his girlfriend that he was going on a drive.

Ray Gricar’s car was found the next day in a Lewisburg parking lot and his laptop, sans hard drive, was found in the Susquehanna River, according to the Patriot-News.

909Dewey

November 10th, 2011 at 2:00 PM ^

Yesterday, I was having a conversation with a friend on wether or not JOPA should retire.  We began discussing the whole of the situation and a question came up - It seems the PSU insiders were protecting Sandusky - why?  Why wouldn't you just let the creep reap what he had sewn?  I mentioned that one possibility was he was using his charity to provide boys for people of power and influence.  This was before I knew of the most recent updates alleging exactly that.  Look up the Franklin child prostitution ring.  I fear this story isn't over and in time it will lead to a very cold dark pit of hell.

909Dewey

November 10th, 2011 at 2:18 PM ^

Perhaps it was a hoax or perhaps the allegations were so damning that the system could not let them go forward.  Remember, the cops at PSU closed their case against Sandusky in 98/99.  The ADA went missing in 2005.  His laptop was found months later without the hard drive.

HighSociety

November 10th, 2011 at 3:03 PM ^

I wouldn't be so quick to write it off as a hoax, also the media coverage and technology were a lot less sophisticated then, I wouldn't be surprised if some damning emails and/or pictures surface in this case at some point.

True Blue Grit

November 10th, 2011 at 2:11 PM ^

I would guess there will be no scenario where any of the current PSU staff is rehired after this season.  The BOT and new AD will most likely want to start with a clean slate.  I can understand this.  Given that a coaching staff is a very close knit group, it's hard to believe that the rest of them (other than Paterno and McQueary) were not aware to some degree of Sandusky's depravity.  They (rest of the assistant coaches) may all be completely innocent.  But the BOT investigation must determine whether any of them was involved in the cover up.  Either way, I think the process of purging the program of this scandal will involve a totally new football staff.  Tom Bradley will be interviewed for the job, but it will be as a courtesy given his years of service to the school. 

enlightenedbum

November 10th, 2011 at 2:24 PM ^

Would anyone else like to prove themselves reprehensible human beings out of this mess?  Oh wait, Bret Bielema, you have something to say?

"Guess it's a good time to be a Badger fan."

omg_shiirtless

November 10th, 2011 at 3:03 PM ^

I'm going to be interested to see the atmosphere of Beaver Stadium on Saturday. I really hope these students wrap their heads around Joe's wrongdoing and realize the BoT had no other option. 

 

I'm guessing the students are in denial about what Paterno did (or didn't do) and don't want to believe what happened, which probably created the outcry we saw last night.

Wendyk5

November 10th, 2011 at 5:37 PM ^

Anyone who did what he (allegedly) did probably doesn't have a really good grasp on reality the way the rest of us do. You would have to create such a web of lies that you tell yourself in order to perpetuate the kind of horrid things you're compelled to do and still function in normal society with everyone else. I can't even imagine the psychological tap dance he had to do on a daily basis to be a functioning member of a family, a husband, and a father. 

Alton

November 10th, 2011 at 3:07 PM ^

In a news story from August 2005, 3 Penn State football players were suspended for making harrassing phone calls to "a retired member of the Penn State football family."

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05232/557150.stm#ixzz1dKmVmM8d

This is essentially nothing, but I have been wondering how much of a secret this actually was.  I think it will soon be clear that Sandusky's actions were common knowledge among the football team and athletic staff.

profitgoblue

November 10th, 2011 at 3:10 PM ^

As of 2:45 EDT, I have yet to hear if Tim Curley has been fired by Penn State University. We know McQueary is still a coach at Penn State. Both men failed, much like Joe Paterno to notify the police. Curley has been criminally charged for perjury and his failure to notify the police - something he had both a moral and legal responsibility to do.

Last night I watched one of the worst press conferences imaginable. Penn State had an obligation to do the MORAL thing that I keep hearing about. That would have been to fire the President (they did), fire Joe Paterno (they did), fire Curley (they didn't address it), and also then put in motion a plan to have the entire board step down since they are responsible for the hiring and continued employment for those directing the university. 

They had a chance to explain clearly why these firing occurred - for Spanier, his responsiblity as a President and the failure of his subordiantes, for Paterno for neither contacting police or following up - the moral thing to do, for Curley for not only failing to act morally, but apparently breaking the law, and finally for McQuearry for doing the same, or not doing as much as needed, like Paterno. They could have sent a strong message that this is unacceptable. Instead they just tried to deflect attention from the situation by tossing out two bodies to the media, the most visible people, while keeping the biggest offender on staff.

When asked if they'd pay the legal fees for Curley, they declined comment. They damn will. In fact, that liar will twist in the wind and do whatever PSU wants. Don't be surprised if he lies up and down to both save his arse and make Paterno and Spanier look like total liars. In fact, between Curley and McQueary, they can both paint Paterno as the real villian and save their behinds. 

Penn State had an opportunity to make a very strong statement by all taking responsibility, not just putting it on an 84 year old man who made a horrible, damning mistake. They failed to do the MORAL thing. 

CRex

November 10th, 2011 at 3:37 PM ^

Yeah, you fire Curley after he is convicted of prejury.  Then you can hold a press conference, call him a scumbag, announce he gets no benefits, and he has no legal recourse to go after you.  

If you unload on him prior to his conviction, you might end up eating a wrongful termination lawsuit.  Many lawyers be good at scummy moves.

treetown

November 10th, 2011 at 4:11 PM ^

"Evil flourishes when good men do nothing"

This quote is variously attributed to Edmund Burke or Tolstoy but sums up the situation.

1. What is charged in Happy Valley in the Penn State locker room and elsewhere on campus was evil, not bad, not a violation of some NCAA rule, but evil.

2. Joe Paterno began his career aiming to do good and arguably did a lot of good.

3. But when he came up against evil, he didn't act the way we all hoped he would - and fight to protect that one particular kid and ultimately other kids from this monstrosity which lived in his own professional house.

As many noted, Paterno isn't the evil party here. But he isn't the innocent bystander many PSU students and others would like to cling to. People can do good and people can also make mistakes. Unfortunately in this case, Coach Paterno could have and should have done much more and didn't. During a long career filled with many good deeds, he made one very bad horrific mistake.

We won't see the end of this for a long time - questions about McCreary's duty and obligations, questions about what the Board of Trustees knew in the past, questions about how the local police handled things.