Article on Michigan avoiding negative recruiting like other schools

Submitted by M-Wolverine on January 30th, 2012 at 9:54 AM

As the recruiting sky is falling for some, talked to some of our recruits, as well as Allen Trieu who has spoken with recruits not even committed to Michigan, and they universally say Michigan is doing it the right way.  They're not using bad situations at other schools to taint recruits views, and are promoting Michigan. Quotes not only from Trieu, but Wormley, Darboh (and his guardian), and one from Pipkins that the "Hoke touching kids" crowd will love.

So remember, we may not be getting every one, but we're doing it the right way.…




January 30th, 2012 at 9:59 AM ^

But I do wish there was a way for us to not exactly negatively recruit, but point out, say, for battles against LSU or Alabama. Maybe that just opens a whole new can of worms, but it would be nice to think that big time coaches tried to hit people like Miles or Saban in a way that hurts.

SF Wolverine

January 30th, 2012 at 10:00 AM ^

fewer kids leaving, better rep with college coaches and with successive classes at schools where our kids (or even kids we recruit but don't get) come from.

Also appears to be paying off in the short term.


January 30th, 2012 at 10:02 AM ^

But....but....without Kozan, Reeves & Maderis there's no point in even talking about recruiting anymore is there? Seems like we have now determined the following based on posts this past weekend on the board:

1. Hoke has "lost his touch" and cannot close the deal on recruits anymore

2. Urban Meyer is a big, fat liar!

3. Our basketball team is likely to never win another game this year if ever

4. Urban Meyer lies and the only way he gets recruits is by lying cause he's such a liar.  Has nothing to do whatsover about his past national championships, his coaching resume or the fact the kids were OSU leans in the first place.

Good to know we keep everything in perspective.

Perkis-Size Me

January 30th, 2012 at 10:05 AM ^

this is what separates us from everyone else. we may not get all the best kids, but we're getting the right ones. hoke knows what he's doing, and its clear that character is as important to him as talent is.


January 30th, 2012 at 10:08 AM ^

Speculation abounds, but it is most important to be who we are, to do things the way we think is the right way, and to see those results in terms of wins and losses over the long haul.  There is a reason why we are no. 1 in terms of football wins in college, and it is that we know what works over the long haul, not just over the next 2-3 years.

Bangkok Soiree

January 30th, 2012 at 10:11 AM ^

but this article doesn't really quote any independent sources.  I'm all for Michigan homerism, but Allen Trieu isn't exactly an independent observer of Michigan recruiting (even if he's the "Mid-West" recruiting guru for Scout).   Just wish Kyle would have gotten some quotes from better sources, that's all. 


January 30th, 2012 at 10:16 AM ^

Hoke already had a lot of good will in the Midwest before he came back to Michigan, and he seems to be increasing it all the more.  Michigan isn't going to get every recruit it wants - it never did.  But Hoke will, I think, pull in enough big-time guys to compete for Big Ten championships.  Anyone losing it over the last few weeks of recruiting is missing the forest for the trees. 


January 30th, 2012 at 10:21 AM ^

Nice way to sugarcoat the aftermath of a disappointing day in recruiting.  Win Big Ten titles and compete for national titles more consistently and the recruits will follow.  I think it's no coincidence that after we won the 1997 national title and we're conference co-champs in 1998, that we got  one of the top recruiting classes in American with Henson, David Terrell and Marquise Walker.  

Despite the Urban Meyer ethicial issues, those rings he can pull out mean something.  And until Brady can get his own rings that compare, it will be hard to compete with OSU.  Keep beating OSU, go to the Rose Bowl as B1G champs and recruits will forget about the cold weather here or the distance from their hometown.

Two Hearted Ale

January 30th, 2012 at 10:43 AM ^

He was on the staff in '97. It even says Michigan.

I think Meyer flashing his rings sends a mixed message. On one hand two BCS Championships while at Florida is a pretty big accomplishment; on the other hand, why isn't he still at Florida? Did he tell his Florida recruited, whom he left behind, the same thing?

Ohio will always get top recruits. It's not a big deal as long as Michigan does too.


January 30th, 2012 at 10:26 AM ^

but the possibilities 

Garnett: without luck, what do they have?

Reeves: I hope your girlfriend doesn't want to go to ohio. good chance urban will try to make some moves on her.

Kozan: you really don't want to pee brown do you?


boom number one class. All kidding aside I love our staff and I couldn't be happier with the way they represent michigan to everyone in the nation. Thank god we got hoke and not miles. 

Gulo Gulo Luscus

January 30th, 2012 at 10:34 AM ^

Are we willing to lose games in the name of "doing things the right way?"  Will we, as fans, be holding our heads high even if Ohio under Meyer beats us on a regular basis behind the strength of shady recruiting practices (if that's even a legitimate claim at this point)?  I'm not saying we can't win with quality kids (see: team 132), but it will be interesting to watch how much UM fans can take as the NCAA plummets deeper into its wild wild west era.  Perhaps more importantly, will we see enough 4* and occasional 5* kids continue respond to that attitude, suit up in the maize and blue, and feel successful even if our program struggles to keep up?  Fans and players alike are sure to have their faith tested if college football continues towards even greater semi-professional status and we choose to honor the spirt of the "student athlete."


January 30th, 2012 at 10:49 AM ^

Michigan might lose a few recruits because it doesn't negatively recruit (we'll never be able to tell), but Hoke is going to get a lot of mileage out of being a positive, trustworthy guy.  OSU recruiting-watchers fear him for the fact that he has a lot of good will among Ohio HS coaches. 


January 30th, 2012 at 10:52 AM ^

We may not have to deal with your scenario.  It's interesting that one of the things that Darboh's guardian mentioned was the way Hoke handled the Hagerup punting disaster against OSU.  "Doing things the right way" also can bring you top-notch talent in the form of kids who are top-notch people as well.  I think it's a fallacy to assume that "doing things the right way" will lead to getting less talented kids. 

Gulo Gulo Luscus

January 30th, 2012 at 5:16 PM ^

Asking hard questions == trolling.  FWIW I believe we can remain a top level program without resorting entirely to tactics like oversigning, under-the-table benefits or allowing kids to skip class or have tests taken for them.  I do worry that this means we fall behind the so-called "elite," but feel that it's far from a certainty (hence the liberal use of questions marks and the word IF).  Furthermore, I couldn't be more proud of how Hoke's attitude has rubbed off on our program and players thus far, teaching them how to win, how to lose and why "doing things the right way" is more important than which happens more often.  I agree that this resonates with many coaches, players and their families, but some kids just aren't on board with that philosophy.  Finding the right mix of talent and character instead of just pursuing the most stars on a recruiting profile is a challenge, and the numbers demonstrate a correlation between recruting rankings and future team success.


January 30th, 2012 at 5:18 PM ^

And we've been doing it for decades.  Under Bo, and on.  It's not anything new.  Take your pick of teams we've faced.  USC, over a number of eras, but most recently.  OSU for the last decade.  That steroid pumped prison squad they called the 1992 Washington Rose Bowl team (1991 season).  Etc, etc. 

The point is if you believe it all those things in your last sentence*, it's not even a question.  And some segment of the fans may disagree, but the program doesn't, so they don't matter. It's not like they're going to stop supporting them in enough numbers to matter. We've had one national title in the last 60 years. The Stadium still fills over 100,000 every week.


*Until you edited your last paragraph.

Gulo Gulo Luscus

January 30th, 2012 at 5:53 PM ^

You've given me no choice but to realize I'm not asking "fans" or "players" these questions- I'm asking myself.  And the answer is definitely "yes."  More importantly, the program's hiring of Hoke reflects the reality that (the royal) "we" still believe in doing things the right way.  We've maintained a highly successful program while for the most part avoiding the ugly side effects of the win at all costs nature of NCAA football, and that won't change, nor will the fall ritual of piling 100k+ into the Big House.  That's a big part of what makes Michigan winning B10/National Titles even sweeter, and we're still competing to be the leaders and best.

Cheers, M-Wolve.  The sky is not falling.


January 31st, 2012 at 12:28 PM ^

And your post needs no response, but I'd thought later that it may not be as grim as it seems.  It seems worse in this day and age of instant info from around the world, because you hear about it...but I don't know that there's that much more cheating going on than there used to be. Watch the ESPN 30 for 30 on SMU, or more recently, Miami.  It was a lot more blatent before.  And quite possibly in bigger numbers. Now it's really hard to keep it quiet, because it's all a tweet away. And Michigan was able to compete with that, if not every actually dominate.  And it seems more like the cheaters are winning, because of the way it's all set up now. Before, the poll decided and all teams didn't play each other. Now they can set it up for the SEC to play the SEC.  But look back, and often the cheating schools were dominating the polls as well as the BCS games.  So the dirty SEC is having a dirty run.  But cheaters have always prospered somewhat...but so has Michigan, doing it the right way.  And up till the previous 3 years, doing it the right way hasn't caused Michigan to have a down period for about 40 years. Right around the time the real emphasis on doing things the right way started.


January 30th, 2012 at 10:38 AM ^

The coaching staff is doing it the right way.  Sell the school and present the recruits with all the info about Michigan.  No need to point out that PSU is a mess and OSU was under investigation.  The recruits already know this and it only brings us down to discuss them.  Then let them make thier own decision.  We don't need to point someone else's bad, just accentaute our good.  Go Blue!

True Blue Grit

January 30th, 2012 at 10:38 AM ^

recruit decisions is that because they've waited this long (not always, but frequently) often they are more undecided about where they want to go.  A lot of coaches play on this by being more aggressive (negative) in their recruiting pitches.  I'm not saying that was THE factor in the 3 players who recently chose other schools, but it's true on a large scale in college football.  That's why Coach Hoke and others probably prefer to fill up the class much earlier so that the week or two leading up to signing day doesn't make or break us.  This is only logical as it cuts down the risk factor of ending up with not all position needs being filled.  I like what we're doing and the way we're doing it.  It will lead to winning more of these 50-50 battles in the future, not less. 


January 30th, 2012 at 10:46 AM ^

The, "we're not winning, but we're doing it the right way" argument is very Notre Dame fan.....having said that, I completely agree with doing things the right way.  However the SEC winning 6 titles in a row is beyond coincidence at this point. 


January 30th, 2012 at 10:47 AM ^

Dantonio can learn a lesson or two from Hoke on how to not negatively recruit.  We all know it was him that Rich Rod called out about someone in the conference negatively recruiting against Michigan day in and day out.


January 30th, 2012 at 10:50 AM ^

That's really nice to hear for a couple of reasons:

  • The success of your recruitment efforts are based strictly on the good things about your school, which aren't going to change from recruit to recruit based on who else that particular recruit is considering
  • You don't waste time digging up dirt on someone else
  • If you are honest and open during the recruitment process, where it is easy to make promises you reneg on later, then you will clearly have that same integrity when it comes to the actual football
  • Everyone knows where they stand coming in, so you can be fair to everyone -- it's all about team chemistry -- you know noone has special privileges


Hoke and company rule.  I'm excited about how we finish this class and what 2013-2028 will bring.


January 30th, 2012 at 11:06 AM ^…


"Luke Neal called Urban Meyer's visit "intense." He said he tried to get a commitment from the Scottsdale Chaparral receiver/cornerback that night. It didn't happen, but now, it appears, Ohio State is right up there with Notre Dame in the Neal recruiting sweepstakes.

"He said, 'I came all the way here for you because there isn't anybody else like you,' '' Luke said Meyer told his son.

Neal said Meyer wants Davonte' to play right away as a kick returner and slot receiver. He also said he would hold a scholarship for Davonte' after Wednesday's National Letter of Intent Day."


January 30th, 2012 at 11:29 AM ^

The contrast is that he made potentially false promises and wasn't honest. Devonte Neal is a great prospect, but there are others like him and better than him. I can't imagine Hoke saying "I came all the way out here because there's no one like you." 


January 30th, 2012 at 11:39 AM ^

Child, please.

You think Hoke is telling recruits, "Hey, we think you're pretty good.  There are plenty of others that are better than you, but we still want you.  You'll get the chance to play with other players who we think are mediocre, just like you!"


Section 1

January 30th, 2012 at 11:14 AM ^

I especially like it when the better-quality coaches (Tressel, Rodriguez) are willing to confirm publicly that their rivals are not negative-recruiting.

There were lots of stories, virtually all 'historical,' for lack of a better term, about Mattison being a notable example of a negative recruiter.  I've seen no hard evidence of anything, and most rumors seem to originate with Notre Dame complaints after Mattison left and went to Florida.  So if Mattison is not being negative as a Michigan assistant, that's good.

Negative recruiting shouldn't be a hard story to report, should it?  I always wondered why it would be at all difficult to get a kid to talk about another school recruting him if he didn't commit there.  People get grants of anonymity from reporters all the time to talk about stuff like that.  Why would any egregious acts of negative recruting go unreported if they were true and could be confirmed by multiple sources?  My own guess is that there's probably less negative recruiting out there than we might imagine. 


January 30th, 2012 at 11:52 AM ^

Everyone hates negative advertising in politics.  But it works.

This is cynical, but negative recruiting, especially on uncertain recruits still sitting on the fence in late January, probably also works.

Not that we should do it, but it is pretty effective on 18 year old kids that want to hear certain things.




January 30th, 2012 at 12:03 PM ^

Grabble Grabble Grabble Grabble.  No but I am glad that we are doing it the right way.  Though I don't think that we should be dropping all of these guys right away when we don't think that it would work out.  There are a ton of recruits who I think we could have (Reeves, Wright, Grant, Diggs) who we dropped for one reason or another.  I am not saying it wasn't the right thing to do, I am just saying that we really could have a assembled a phenomanal class.  We have a great class, but it still could and can be better.

Here is to getting Diamond, getting back in on Thompson (hopefully), Muller, Denman, and maybe a random other recruit along the way.