[Patrick Barron]

Spring Bits: Defense Comment Count

Brian April 16th, 2019 at 1:18 PM

Previously: offense.

A word about format

This seems to happen in year three or four every time: after a brief introductory burst of spring game optimism the thing degrades until it's the barely-tolerated Lloyd-era relic. Remember Harbaugh's first spring game? The one that came down to a contested two-point conversion that got reviewed on the scoreboard?

…the white team poured onto the field like they'd just won the Super Bowl and blue team coach Chris Partridge roared off the sideline to have a Harbaugh-level conniption fit at the ref.

A couple other coaches reacted similarly, if not as dramatically, as Partridge; the white team organized at midfield for a photo. Wyatt Shallman headbanged like there was no tomorrow. Drake Johnson collapsed in a heap.

I tweeted to Ace that he should title the recap "Controversial finish mars Spring Game ending,"* because that was funny. It's only funny because it's kind of true.

This is a different thing now. Last year's team was good but it was still caught between being a program that apologizes for a tent stake and a program whose DGAF levels are off the charts. Judging from the reactions of everyone involved on both sides, the all-competition-all-the-time ethos has sunk in. That more than anything else makes me anticipate the upcoming season.

There were rappists! We got pictures of them:

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My rap name is Medium Wayne. Dunno what this guy's rap name is. Steve? [Eric Upchurch]

This year we kicked off with 20 minutes of drills. There was a 12 minute halftime in which nothing happened. Score was not kept. I don't know how it ended because after three hours and change I saw Not Cade McNamara come out and decided that I'd had all the data I was going to get. Last year's spring game was flat-out cancelled instead of being moved a day or a week.

I'm pretty used to Michigan football going out of its way to be unfriendly to its fans but… yikes. When your spring game is untelevisable that says something. Do you know the things they put on TV these days? There's a show called "God Friended Me"! They'll put anything on. But not Michigan's spring game type substance.

Long way from the early days of Harbaugh to this place where douchy guys buy messages to fly over the stadium. And find some way to televise hockey FFS.

[After THE JUMP: I have concerns]

Remain calm?

This was not previous spring games where the offense did zilch because they had wolves at their door on every play, but the defense held its own decently. And the nominal starting defense that was put out there was missing several key components. They were down Josh Ross and Lavert Hill, likely to be the best players at LB and CB. Likely DT starter Mike Dwumfour participated in drill but not the scrimmage. CMU transfer Mike Danna, the likely starting WDE, is not enrolled yet.

But when you strip Nico Collins and DPJ away from the offense you've got Martin, Bell, Black, and Sainristil looking capable. Yoink those defensive players and certain spots look hairy.

Defensive line

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Shaun Nua might have some more side eye moments this year [Barron]

Defensive end is going to be fine as long as Mike Danna translates reasonably well. His out of this world PFF grades were largely against MAC competition and they appear to grade like I do, so they're not opponent-adjusted. But lower leagues occasionally spit out a dude at any competition level and Danna has the profile of one.

That should push Kwity Paye and Aidan Hutchinson into the anchor spot together with Josh Uche and—fingers crossed—Luiji Vilain backing up Danna. I have some concerns about Paye's pass rush, but that's a solid two-deep with no freshmen and many established contributors.

FWIW, Michigan only used Uche as a passing-down linebacker and only deployed three-man lines on passing downs.

As far as the individual performers, no one stood out in a Hurst fashion. This is in part because the OL wasn't giving anyone a free pass into the backfield. Closer inspection of many spectacular DL plays from past spring games has revealed a guy who simply wasn't blocked. When that doesn't happen you have to earn it, and they didn't really. The occasional pressure the offense suffered was almost always delivered by a blitz.

Hutchinson did give Mayfield the business in drill time. FWIW. Hutchinson flashed talent as a true freshman and should make a big leap forward in year two. Paye may also have an ignite button to press. There are enough bullets in the chamber here to expect a hit.

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Michigan might have to play a true FR like Mazi Smith (#58) [Fuller]

Defensive tackle… well. I focused on Donovan Jeter intermittently. He was able to survive against Ruiz/Bredeson/Onwenu. This is an accomplishment; several Big Ten DLs are going to get clonked by those guys this fall. Jeter was limited to holding up against the run and occupying blockers against the pass, though. He was more of a Mone space-eater type than a penetration threat. He's the nose tackle here:

This was a little better as the DT to the bottom of the screen; he's able to drive the pocket a little and might get a PBU on a different pass.

Maybe he's able to push the pocket more against dudes under 350 pounds, but I don't see a bunch of TFLs in his future.

So the situation at DT is probably this:

  • Jeter and Carlo Kemp, two guys who are fine against the run and offer next to no pass rush.
  • Mike Dwumfour, who's potentially in the Hurst vein as a rusher but got knocked on his ass on every other run play last year.
  • True freshmen and a converted fullback.

Maybe one of the three veterans takes a leap and becomes a complete player, maybe one of the freshmen is immediately ready to be a rotation piece. Maybe neither of those things happen and things get gross.

I made a comparison between the seven man DL class of two years ago and Hoke's giant bust of a six-man OL class that drew some objection because Michigan does look like they'll get a player or two out of it. They will indeed, but the situation Michigan is left in is the same: shorthanded and looking towards true freshmen to stem the bleeding. That class:

  • Corey Malone-Hatcher medically retired more or less on arrival.
  • Aubrey Solomon, Deron Irving-Bey, and James Hudson transferred.
  • Luiji Vilain spent his first two years injured and is only now getting back healthy.
  • Phil Paea bounced from DL to OL and back to DL and only got walk-on time in the scrimmage.
  • Jeter and Paye are tracking as contributors.

Not quite as bad as the Hoke disaster OL class, which got one season of starting time from Patrick Kugler and was otherwise a total washout. But the overall picture is similar. Hudson is particularly frustrating because while moving him to OL made all the sense in the world at the time he had a great Willie-Henry-ish senior year as a DL and would certainly have gotten enough time to keep him engaged at DT.

Anyway. Time to make chicken salad.

Linebacker

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Gil: still Gil [Fuller]

With Ross out, Jordan Anthony got the snaps with the ones next to Devin Gil and looked like a reasonable Devin Bush facsimile. He had a sack on a blitz up the middle that got home in a flash and was close to a couple more. Gil looked like Gil. Maybe a little more decisive, but it was hard to tell with the DTs getting pushed back a bit on many plays.

Cam McGrone played a fair amount with the twos but lasted deep into walk-on time. Hard not to take that as a sign that he's not as close to a breakthrough as I'd hoped. He did have a few nice plays sprinkled in there; he had some productive edge rushes… or edge rushes that would have been productive if the DTs were able to collapse the pocket more.

At viper, Hudson is Hudson and Glasgow is Glasgow. The interesting guy there is redshirt freshman Michael Barrett, who was a thumping presence when he entered. Walk-on time was more live contact than the rest of the scrimmage. Barrett took advantage of that to deliver a series of zero-YAC hits.

Coverage is an open question with him. His interception of Milton was a perfectly fine zone drop that Milton did not see. I'm not sure if he can carry TEs down the seam and the like. Hudson and Glasgow look like safeties. Barrett looks like a linebacker. It was in fact really easy to get Barrett and Uche mixed up because they're both #6 and at first glance are not obviously dissimilar body types. Barrett was already listed at 224 last year, which points more towards MLB than viper if any pounds get added.

With the two seniors in front of him Barrett's time is going to be limited; he's the slight leader to take the reins at viper next year.

Cornerback

Another spot where Michigan's lack of depth is a little worrying. Lavert Hill and Ambry Thomas should be one of the better starting pairs in the league and maybe the nation. In Hill's absence, though, Vincent Gray got pushed into the starting lineup. He's the guy who got torched by Martin on the called-back TD, and that jam whiff was comprehensive:

Gemon Green's time was most notable for getting dusted by Black…

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[Bryan Fuller]

…and Myles Sims, the top-ranked CB from last year's class, was not even dressed. Jalen Perry, the early-enrolled four star in this year's class, got dusted a couple times himself.

I'm probably paranoid about third corners because of last year's Ohio State game, but… last year's Ohio State game. It doesn't look like Michigan is going to be able to field a third CB who's in the same range as Hill and Thomas athletically, unless they just say "screw it" and go with Dax Hill there and bring in a safety as their fifth DB.

About that…

Safety

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second team D: walk-on Tyler Cochran at safety [Barron]

In a word: disconcerting. Josh Metellus is established as a pretty good Big Ten player so spring game data is to be taken with a grain of salt; still a bit ominous that he overran crossing routes twice to turn modest gains into big ones. With Kelly-Powell's move to corner the contenders to keep Dax Hill's seat warm were J'Marick Woods, Brad Hawkins, and walk-ons. Sammy Faustin did not make an appearance and IIRC neither did German Green.

Tyler Cochran, pictured above, and fellow walk-on Hunter Reynolds appeared to be the second string safety pairing. Reynolds has been garnering a little chatter inside the program, and he's a two-time scout team player of the year, so maybe he's a find. One walk-on can be fine. Two is alarming.

Other ominous things included a total lack of over the top help on several different deep balls and Hawkins lining up as a man-to-man slot defender. He was in the same outside leverage that Michigan used last year, outside leverage that was required to prevent getting slot fades on their face, and outside leverage that limited Devin Bush's rush opportunities. In an ideal world Hill shows up and can immediately play over the slot, straight up.

Special Teams Note

There was no punting but there were a lot of field goals both in the game and a special post-halftime field-goal throwdown that started at XP length and went out to 60-yarders. Every field goal in the game and every one in the FG-off was good until the 60-yarders. Both Moody and Nordin left theirs two or three yards short.

It's Moody's job until he misses a few. #collegekickers and all that but Michigan seems to have an excellent situation there.

Comments

Mfrank

April 16th, 2019 at 1:55 PM ^

The excuses are getting old. This staff recruited these players and it's their job to keep them around and develop them. If they leave or don't pan out it's on them, period. Second of all lets talk about the secondary and the lack of talent back there. Corner recruiting has been getting worse every single year since 2016. Safety recruiting has been deplorable until Dax Hill committed. All those 3 star trust the coaches guys? Samy Faustin, Brad Hawkins, Gemon Green, Vince Gray, German Green, Jamarick Woods, etc haven't done squat or been developed. That's what you get when you sign a bunch of projetc DB's. It's literally the easiest position to scout just watch a 7v7 game and see if a kid can cover gtfo here with these 3 star sleepers. I'd throw Metellus in that mix because he's been a huge liability too and got dusted against OSU and UF but I won't. Stop messing around and start recruiting top 100 players again.

Oh and be prepared for linebacker to be the next position we worry about. Yall really think low 3 stars like Joey Velazquez, Charles Thomas, Cornell Wheeler, and Mike Barrett are going to make us forget about Devin Bush, Ben Gedeon, and Jabrill Peppers? That's funny.

Who are the best players on the defense? The top 247 guys in Hill, Thomas, Hutchinson, and Ross. Can say the same exact thing about the offense which is filled with top 247 guys in the starting 11. Recruiting matters. Sad thing is 2020 class is tracking like the 2018 class. It's damn depressing.

SMart WolveFan

April 16th, 2019 at 5:42 PM ^

Clemson did, as I reminded one of your accounts last night ......here it is:

Let's quickly look at '12-'13

Germone Hopper #79, Chad Kelly #187, Ronald Geohaghan #297, Marty Williams #583, JayJay McCullogh #898, Tyshon Dye #165, Scott Pagano #279, Adrian Baker #369, Dane Rogers #540, Korrin Wiggins #665, Kyrin Priester #3

How will they ever keep the program afloat?

SlickNick

April 16th, 2019 at 6:17 PM ^

This is the type of shit that should have you permanently banned from this platform if it's actually possible. I have seen you multiple times, through your various accounts try to demean people over their opinions. What in that response drew this kind of anger out of you? How many accounts do you need to have banned to realize your vitriol is not wanted around here. I commend the mods for taking action against your accounts so quickly....but good grief man...get some help, and find healthier hobbies. 

Mfrank

April 16th, 2019 at 6:34 PM ^

Look at the dolts posting history. Not only does he name call other people all the time, he makes these stupid ass straw man arguments that have no relevance to the conversations and he thinks hes slick. "Michigan lost nine top 247 recruits" Him: Lists a bunch of recruits nowhere near the top 247 that clemson lost as proof they did too. Uhhhh what? Guy is a flat our moron and has been since he joined this site.

SMart WolveFan

April 16th, 2019 at 6:19 PM ^

So you're saying a team can suffer attrition of their 2nd, 4th, and 7th best recruit from 2012, a class ranked 20th; plus the 4th and 9th best recruit from '13, ranked 15th, than loose a handful of other guys but, after all that, they still win two championships?

Wow ......now I'm REALLY excited.

Clemson '12-'13: SIX players from top 150, 2 transfers 33%

UofM '16-'17: 20 top150 players, 5 transfers 25%

Narratives be broke all up in here.

Mfrank

April 16th, 2019 at 2:19 PM ^

As opposed to making excuses for it like this fan base has done for the last 15 years while our biggest rival kicks our ass up and down the field? You're damn right I will "bitch about it." When will we as a collective say enough is enough? I don't think it's too much of an ask that our 7 million dollar head coach start landing more top 100 and top 247 recruits. Goodness gracious.

mgobleu

April 16th, 2019 at 4:07 PM ^

Look man, I'm done mocking you and bitching back at you and all that because it's gotten so far beyond the point of reasonable. 

I'm going to say this with the most honesty and love I can muster, because I'm concerned about you as a person.

Honestly, I think you need a new hobby. If Michigan football makes you this upset, your priorities may need a little course-correction. I don't like watching my team lose either, but in the end, it's a bunch of kids playing the game they love. It's a pretty high stakes game and for a lot of them their careers and futures depend on it, but they're all human, including their coaches. Sometimes a program is just snakebit and shit happens and keeps on happening for years and you do your best, which no doubt they are, but to act like just because you've thrown enough money at someone makes it unacceptable for them to fail is just unreasonable and life is too short to be pissed all the time. 

I hate losing to Ohio and having to make excuses to my buckeye and sparty friends, but I've learned to just let it go a little bit. It doesn't mean I don't want them to succeed anymore, and it doesn't mean I don't want them to be the best, but I can still have fun following them and not want to commit felonies when they fail.

I know you say otherwise, but it really really really will be ok. There will be lots of losses and I'm sure I'll get mad here and there, but I do honestly think someday they're going to win the CFP and we'll all hang our Bo hats on it till the day we die. But until then I'll just have to figure out how to be patient because pounding all caps into my keyboard certainly isn't going to help. 

Now let's all go outside, enjoy the warm weather and maybe have an ice cream. 

schreibee

April 16th, 2019 at 9:52 PM ^

I think without ever actually saying it (that I've seen), MaizenFrank is saying "get bag men, just do whatever it takes to compete with bama, osu, etc. for croots.

We've all,including MF, acknowledged that to ever beat osu in crooting with all their built in advantages, M needs to beat them on the field. 

But as MF points out multiple times every thread, the chance of beating them with lower-rated croots is slim (unless possibly there's a nice fall off from one of the greatest coaches of the modern college football era to a guy who might not be that).

So it's a chicken/egg, serpent swallowing its own tail thing. I guess?

And as always, the MOST obvious question is:

"If the All-American QB alum, who's led multiple prior teams to successes far exceeding what they'd been doing before his arrival, isn't the answer to get this serpent's ass out of its mouth,  WHO tf IS?!?!?!"

Mgoeffoff

April 17th, 2019 at 8:55 AM ^

Oh and be prepared for linebacker to be the next position we worry about. Yall really think low 3 stars like Joey Velazquez, Charles Thomas, Cornell Wheeler, and Mike Barrett are going to make us forget about Devin Bush, Ben Gedeon, and Jabrill Peppers? 

I do think Barrett is going to be good & our next viper.  We also have McGrone, Solomon, & Savage as 4-stars behind Ross & Anthony.

Sad thing is 2020 class is tracking like the 2018 

It's way too early to get worried.  We just dropped down because of the Branham decomittment.  That happened because Gattis is targeting different guys like Martinez & Carr.  Yes, we are never going to compete year in and year out with OSU in recruiting.  If that's your barometer you'll be disappointed.

This staff recruited these players and it's their job to keep them around and develop them.

I'd agree that losing Hudson, Singleton, & Solomon is frustrating and losing Evans & Samuels is also annoying, but on them.  Also losing Irving-Bey, St. Juste, Hall, & Malone-Hatcher, is unlucky.  You can see how that makes RB and the two lines a bit of a problem.  But, a lot of that attrition seems unlucky with injuries or rules violations.  The big three are frustrating because they were highly ranked recruits.  I sometimes wonder if a guy like JH is more of a "tough guy" versus a players coach like Urban Meyer who gives a bit of preferential treatment to star players.  Sometimes it makes me wonder if the stars may need a bit of preferential treatment in order to keep them around.  Maybe that makes some sense?

ThePolishFalcon

April 16th, 2019 at 4:41 PM ^

Attrition happens at every school and it’s the coaches job to make sure the next man up can compete.  Plus, other than Solomon, all those players who left were unproven or showed little promise anyway.  Most were MAC level guys who never should’ve been recruited in the first place 

Mgoeffoff

April 17th, 2019 at 9:05 AM ^

We also had Singleton & Hudson who was a highly ranked recruit who left, then we've got St. Juste who showed promise, but got injured & Evans who violated team rules.  Those are all quality players.  And, Solomon I think left because he wasn't tough and the coaches didn't like that, not because he wasn't talented.

GotBlueOnMyMind

April 16th, 2019 at 3:52 PM ^

Giving you the benefit of the doubt, I have a question: why does other people’s optimism/hope offend you to such a degree? Why can’t you be pessimistic and let others be optimistic without seemingly getting upset and insulting the other person? How does another person’s optimism affect you in any way? I get making a post or two saying you are worried or something. But, incessantly making negative comments on every post and every even half-hopeful comment is just sad.

BlueWolverine02

April 17th, 2019 at 1:27 AM ^

Sure Maizen goes overboard.  But to be fair, anybody that says anything negative, unless it's actually in a game thread, tends to get attacked around here.  So it might just be a reaction to all the people who don't want to hear anything negative.  It gets a little old constantly hearing "we will be fine" or "trust the coaches".

JFW

April 17th, 2019 at 11:29 AM ^

I think it's because of the way negativity is brought up. 

I don't mind if someone says 'Whoa, worried about D line depth. Have to be concerned about that' or even 'Man, I wish I knew why we had all that attrition'. 

But instead, we get the opposite of 'trust the coaches' which is 'distrust the coaches, they are bad', and often in the face of, and denial of, the progress we have made. 

When I went through 7 years of:

* disgusting defense (RR)

* Misuse of QB's (Hoke)

* Getting into shootouts with bad teams (Akron. Indiana)

* Flat out losing to teams we should never have lost to (Toledo) 

* Blowing our bowl game streak

* Having flat out losing seasons

* Not only losing to, but getting physically dominated by MSU

* Getting embarrassed by other teams (Remember WSU running down our throat All*The*Time)

* BAD O line play

* Utter lack of development....

getting back to 10 win seasons, .500 with MSU in games where we square off with them instead of back down, better execution, and a resurrected culture looks pretty damned good. 

Is everything perfect? OF course not. Pep was tough. Coaching turnover is tough. The blowouts last year were tough. Not beating OSU sucks. 

But to say that Harbaugh isn't better, and trying to continually improve, is just false. And his argumentative style is like 'idiot on Usenet circa '1993'. 

DonBrownIsAStr…

April 16th, 2019 at 4:47 PM ^

So two questions. One for Mfrank, and the other for everyone else.

Mfrank, Maizen, whatever your next screen name will be: What do you do for a living? How do you find the time to comment, negatively, on every single post? I share everyone's annoyance with you, but damn buddy, I admire your persistence.

Everyone else, who were you happiest about in the spring game and who are your favorite sleepers to come out and have a good year, a la Uche last year?

massblue

April 16th, 2019 at 1:36 PM ^

Well, it seems we have to win some shoot outs this year.  May be that is the reason JH brought Gattis.  He knew the defense was not going to win too many games for him this year.

Rabbit21

April 16th, 2019 at 4:28 PM ^

Defense should be fine, just not lights out.  There's still plenty of time for guys to develop and catch up to whats being expected of them in the system.  I'm not saying it won't be bad, just that for the most part this staff and this team have earned the benefit of the doubt.

DrMantisToboggan

April 16th, 2019 at 1:38 PM ^

Don Brown take the wheeeeeeeeeelllll

Going to have to get creative with what seems like an abundance of talent at DE and limited options at DT. When we have time to change personnel, we should be fine, but I worry about getting caught when teams go tempo.

Hope Hinton can push people when he gets here.

Watching From Afar

April 16th, 2019 at 1:54 PM ^

On passing downs specifically they can do what they did last year, drop Paye down to 3T, Dwumfor to NT, and bring in a 3rd DE like Uche or Vilain.

Against the run... well I hope between Kemp/Jeter/Smith/Hinton they can find 2 DTs that can hold up against the best on the schedule. They'll be good against everyone with the exception of Wisconsin, ND, and OSU. PSU's OL isn't scary and MSU's has been bad for a couple of years. Iowa might pose a couple of problems but they play in a closet so jamming up the lanes should be easier.

DrMantisToboggan

April 16th, 2019 at 2:03 PM ^

I don't think holding up against the run will be a problem when we have the run-stop personnel out there. A line of Paye, Jeter, Kemp, Hutchinson should be excellent against the run.

What is going to be tough for this DL is getting the right pieces on the field at the right times. If you go with a lighter DL to get after the QB, teams like OSU will go tempo and lock them on the field and run the ball. If you go heavy with Jeter and Kemp, they'll do the same and pass and it will be the same as last year's game.

I think the DL's issues won't be that guys aren't good at all, but that our interior guys are one-dimensional. We don't have a DT that's equally good against the run and the pass. I think Hinton can be that, I hope Jeter can be that, but that, to me, seems like it will be the issue this year.

Notre Dame, Penn State, and Ohio State will pose issues with their tempo.