Rashad Weaver Decommits

Submitted by Brian on January 25th, 2016 at 9:46 PM

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FL DE Rashad Weaver has decommitted. He's upset after Harbaugh told him there was only a 50/50 shot they'd have a slot for him on Signing Day and will take one of the other D-I offers he received. Weaver visited Temple recently and will be at USF and Illinois in the near future.

Weaver was one of the players we were assuming would not be in the class. Setting a visit to a non power-5 school is almost always a sign that a player committed to Michigan isn't going to get to Signing Day as a commit, and Weaver set that visit way back in November. He clearly had an idea of his status and moved to do something about it.

Still, you'd hope the past couple weeks inform the staff that in the twitter era you'd better do something a little more explicit than not calling for months if you don't want unpleasant public relations flare-ups on the regular.

Comments

Mr. Yost

January 25th, 2016 at 11:14 PM ^

Hey if enough people say it...there's certainly a chance that it's true.

I'm willing to admit it that we have recruiting tactics that I disagree with. Does it mean Harbaugh sucks as a coach? No. Does it even mean I'd prefer someone different at Michigan if someone asked? No.

But I don't have to blindly follow a man just because leads the football team I love like family.

I'm a grown man and I can think independently.

Those who want to blindly follow Harbaugh are no better than those PSU fans that blindly followed their former coaching staff. What happened it 110% different and should not be compared...but the blind faith in a football coach like you cannot question anything he does is exactly the same.

And don't give me the "do you want to compete with OSU and Alabama bullshit - because I believe we can compete at an elite level without doing things like this.

It's simple, if you don't want the kid...pull the scholarship rather than dragging kids on with the silent treatment.

What these coaches don't understand is that's not good enough for these lower level recruits. If you've offered me a scholarship to Michigan and my next best offer is something like Temple? OF COURSE I'm coming to Michigan, you don't have to say another word to me. Off education alone I'm going to Michigan. I have no other choice at that level.

If "like" schools are offering these kids, then the silent treatment stuff works. Because the kid just goes elsewhere where he's wanted. That's not the case for Swenson or Weaver, they don't have other offers like Michigan. So just go look them in the eye and tell them "sorry, but we have to move on."

There's two sides to every story, but WE (MGoBlog) have been reporting the silent treatment stuff for multiple recruits for awhile now...and Brian says it again in this OP. So obviously it's true. And I'm sorry, but that's a bitch move if you ask me...good thing no one would ever ask me.

Mr. Yost

January 25th, 2016 at 11:28 PM ^

I'm more concerned about the kid...even more than the optics.

The name University of Michigan and the name Jim Harbaugh are still going to get a TON of kids.

But I'm more worried about the kids involved. Sure they can still get full rides to play elsewhere, but that's not the point.

...however, you're right, the optics do look bad and we're not in a position (yet) where we can give other coaches more ammo the way Saban can. IMO, this is the stuff you can get away with from an optics standpoint when you have the rings to back it up. We don't.

I do wonder what the response on the board would be if Rashan Gary said "I was coming to Michigan and I was a silent commit, but I'ved decided to go elsewhere based on (this stuff)."

Actually I don't wonder that at all because I want Gary to come to Michigan.

But my point is, would people still blindly defend Harbaugh or would that be enough to make people say "okay, I'm not going to go overboard and say "FIRE HARBAUGH" which we all know is bullshit...but I am comfortable saying he's wrong on this and it's hurting the program."

Who am I kidding, as long as he's here...there's always going to be people that hang on his every move.

Again, I LOVE the guy, but I love my parents and my family too...but that doesn't mean I agree with everything they do. In this case, I think it's a joke the way Harbaugh has handled this - especially this late in the recruiting cycle. If you're going to play games AT least do it earlier like you did with Harding and Reese. 

Reader71

January 25th, 2016 at 11:36 PM ^

Like you, I care less about the optics and negative recruiting than I do about the player. But I'll go a step further: I care a lot less about the player than I do Michigan.

I don't care what the press thinks about us, I don't care about what our opponents say about us, and I really don't care about what opposing fans say about us. What is important is what Michigan fans feel about their program -- and right now, a lot of us are disappointed.

I expect more from Michigan and Harbaugh. That is the long and short of it. We should be way better than this.

Mr. Yost

January 25th, 2016 at 11:44 PM ^

Nailed it. Great points.

That said, I'm glad Weaver seems to be handling it well and even defended Harbaugh. He understands the game and took the high road. I wish him all the best and I'm ready to close this recruiting cycle with a BANG of top notch recruits.

I just hope Harbaugh and his staff have learned from this. IMO, it's something Hackett needs to address with him now. Because it does look poorly on the athletics department.

Nothing that won't go away or can be recovered from, but I'll be damned if anyone is going to do something to make my department look like shit and me at least not address it. I don't care what Gordon Gee says.

Jon06

January 26th, 2016 at 3:57 AM ^

You're a former player, right? I'm glad a former player is saying it. I hope you say it directly to Harbaugh.

This is what Bacon's sense of "This is Michigan" is all about. And pulling scholarships after you offer kids and they commit to you is not good enough for Michigan. 

Stevedez

January 26th, 2016 at 7:20 AM ^

I can't blame the school on their recruiting tactics when it is well within the rules of the NCAA to be able to offer basically everyone without any penalty. Until the NCAA changes the rules and overall system, this will continue to happen.

MilkSteak

January 26th, 2016 at 10:13 AM ^

You can absolutely blame the school for their recruiting tactics. I really don't care about things like satellite camps or Harbaugh climbing a tree to get a recruit - it skirts the line between legal and illegal (also the line between creepy and hilarious). However, when it comes to treating recruits with respect it's a moral thing and we can definitely look down on these practices.

This isn't about offering everyone, this is about waiting until a few weeks before the deadline before telling a guy who has been committed for a while that his spot is taken. It may be within the NCAA's rules to do this, but it's not something Michigan should do. Michigan holds itself to a higher standard.

schreibee

January 26th, 2016 at 12:25 PM ^

Man, that was a fairly scathing indictment... I'm not sure JH would count him among known friends at this moment. But it was a great sentiment to have expressed in this forum!

Now - I have another question ;

There are still 400 more comments left in this thread - is anyone gonna say anything better than 71 did, or even anything different than the 400 comment Swenson post last week?

I'm not reading another comment on this topic until someone tells me there's something new, original or insightful in there somewhere.

For the next 8 days I'm going to focus on who IS going to Michigan, then look into recriminations and suggestions for future recruiting.

One thing we can all agree on now - the swarm camps may end up being a "thing" going forward, but let's hold off on offering players based on how they camp at them. Stay in touch & monitor their progress...

jmdblue

January 26th, 2016 at 2:04 PM ^

suffice it to say there are 3 camps here.

Those like me who want to play by both the letter and intent of the rules and expect to be able to win also.  Those who want to do whatever we can within the rules to win.  And a few who just want to win; period.  I'm pretty sure no one is gonna get their minds changed and I'm just as sure most of us can make all three arguments for ourselves. 

Therefore, I'm with you... 8 days left.  Let's go.

trock444

January 26th, 2016 at 6:15 AM ^

If Pat Fitzgerald signs all of the 120 that he offered, he would be fired. It is supply and demand. There are a certain number of spots available and more than that want those spots.Has rash an told Jim he is silent? How about Lavert Hill? Maybe someone we don't know? You don't know shit. They are telling the kid that there may not be a spot...take care of yourself. If it comes down to Rashan and this kid, are you going to take him because he said it publicly?

jmdblue

January 26th, 2016 at 12:09 PM ^

The kids know there is a "first come - first served" aspect to offers, which is where the whole "non-committable"  offer thing comes from.  This is not the case with either Weaver or Swenson.  They apparently had committable offers that they accepted.  Should be 99% a done deal barring bad grades or misbehavior.

It seems both Weaver and Swenson had lots of forewarning that M had some seriously waning interest.  OK fine, if I'm the recruit, I don't want to go where I'm no longer wanted, but I'm still a little pissed that I'm not wanted.  

Bottom line(s) for me.... 1)Michigan/Harbaugh did not handle this well, 2) If Weaver and/or Swenson still wanted to accept scholarships in spite of being told that the staff didn't think they were good enough to play, those offers should have been honored and the kids should have been welcomed onto the team with as much (coaching staff) enthusiasm as any other recruit.

schreibee

January 26th, 2016 at 12:38 PM ^

We know almost nothing more about Weaver than we did when he committed as a virtual unknown last summer. He didn't move up any sites' boards, he didn't impress at any camps (if indeed he attended any beyond Harbaugh's swarm). It's fair to say it was a scholarship offered in haste, but rescinded painfully slowly. This is a bad look.

Swenson otoh we have multiple sources now saying dogged it his senior year, avoided contact with both the coaches and other players in the class, and thought he could play a game of chicken with Harbaugh using negative PR as his leverage. Everything about that is a "Bad Look!"

If I'm Weaver I don't want to be lumped in with players like that, so let's stop talking about them as if the two situations are identical.

I just said about 2-3 comments above (WHERE I SWORE I WAS GETTING OFF THIS THREAD AND NOT READING ANYMORE ABOUT IT!), let's hope we don't continue making swarm camp offers to kids with no other similar offers already in hand. Make a connection and stay in touch, but no offer forthcoming until Senior performance is evaluated.

If indeed these swarm camps continue at all... the PR value may have been trumped by then leaving so many of those who committed at them dangling!

 

 

jcgold

January 26th, 2016 at 12:57 PM ^

Agree that this could be handed better, but allow me to present a parallel:

Getting admitted to college occurs before senior year final grades are in. Colleges can (and will) recind offers of admission if grades are not kept up. Rescissions often occur after a student has turned down all other offers of admission.

My point is, the staff should evaluate recruits on their entire body of work, and continue to evaluate them until NSD. If they do not like what they see, and give advance warning that their offer is in jeopardy (like what seems to be done in this case but could have been done better), then I have no problem offering scholarships and rescinding them on a limited basis. 

jmblue

January 26th, 2016 at 9:17 AM ^

Haven't we been saying that about Alabama, LSU and the rest of the oversigning crowd for years  now - "Eventually it will catch up to them"?  It has not.

I don't want there to be communication issues between the staff and recruits; I'd like them to be more clear about what their status is.  So I am a little disappointed here.  But it's doubtful it will have any serious impact.  Weaver himself made a follow-up tweet in which he defended Harbaugh from criticism.

 

jmblue

January 26th, 2016 at 12:27 PM ^

Michigan's recruiting classes historically tend to be ranked pretty close to Alabama's and LSU's.  We even periodically win recruiting battles against them.  Read into that what you will, but the notion that one kid's story makes that big of a difference to Michigan's recruiting is probably farfetched.

 

 

schreibee

January 26th, 2016 at 12:52 PM ^

OK, this is unfortunate but DP-J may just turn out to be a Bosa - a kid who for whatever reason just loves the buckeye style and doesn't dig Michigan's.

This has nothing to do with Harbaugh, letting players like Weaver dangle, educational opportunities, or anything sensible we as adults can debate. Joey Bosa supposedly sat by himself when he came for our Spring game or other such activity, tweeting out pro-osu stuff from the stands of Michigan Stadium!!!

What can be done with a kid like that? His immature mind is made up, Hoke, Harbaugh, GMatt - they're not changing it.

I have never looked at any of DP-J's social media presence, but those who have say it is full of buckeye love, with virtually nothing pro-M. Which - his coach played for M, his parents I believe went to M, his school has long sent multiple players to M - he may just have his own trail to blaze. Unfortunate as I said, but so be it.

But don't people here get confused that he's suddenly making his college choice based on what did or didn't happen to some kid he's never met!

If he loved Michigan and was genuinely concerned about this, he would arrange a meeting with JH immediately, to air his concerns and get some answers. He's certainly not worried it's going to happen to him - he's a 5* from a M pipeline school... sorry to say, but this is trolling, and there's not a Damn thing anyone can do about it. Except not give him anything to troll about as NSD '17 approaches.

King Douche Ornery

January 26th, 2016 at 8:48 AM ^

Also replaces a Swenson with a five star recruit. He also has four and five stars lined up three deep. We replace Rashad Weaver with...Michael Dwumfour???

Michigan doesn't need to be "better than this" and anyone who thinks like that is an idiot. BUT--tell the kids early, pull their scholarship offer, or offer walk on, and move on.

Now if Harbaugh did that and we just don't know--no harm no foul. But it does not appear to be the case.

TNWolverine

January 25th, 2016 at 11:36 PM ^

Or they could just be honest from the beginning and let the prospect know that they are interested in them, but have some other guys in front of them. If you miss out on those other guys then offer the prospect a commitable offer.

Oscar

January 26th, 2016 at 2:25 AM ^

How do we know that is not the case? Weren't there a number of recruits that were supposed to greyshirt if there was not a scholarship available? Couldn't Weaver have been one of them?

I personally don't like the way this looks, but as we have seen before, we don't have all the facts.

Seth

January 25th, 2016 at 11:42 PM ^

Get what you're saying but no need to bring the PSU thing into it even as an example. The worst moral quandary you can get dragged into by following Harbaugh is supporting the "I'm just not going to call for a few months and she'll get the hint" method of breaking up. Not the classiest thing, but also not ruining lives. The 409'ers are literally arguing that Paterno should not have told any more people than he had to legally while lives were getting ruined on his campus by his former coach who was using his facilities.

It's the college football equivalent of Godwinning.

What you mean to say is that blindly following Harbaugh and not calling him out for even less-than-Saban tactics is a lot like the Bama or Tennessee fans who blindly accept oversigning, and that Michigan can and should be above it. The value today of an honest reputation in recruiting is higher than any value you might get from stringing along a kid on the off chance you'll want him later.

Mr. Yost

January 25th, 2016 at 11:49 PM ^

I guess my underlying point is...this is how it starts. Not from a Paterno/Harbaugh standpoing...but from a fan culture that worships a coach so much that he can do no wrong.

That's where I was going. It wasn't about Harbaugh or Paterno...it was about the fanbase blindly following a man they've likely never met a day in their lives just because he's good and leads the team they love dearly.

I do not want a culture like PSU had where literally hundreds of thousands of people surrounded that program and thought that man could do no wrong.

I could've used Tressel in the same context. Those fans make me sick for the exact same reason.

So please don't look into the PSU scandal as much as my point about our fanbase not turning into one that can't think for itself and have an idependent opinion. One who can't see right from wrong.

mexwolv

January 26th, 2016 at 7:27 AM ^

But Iwhat about the rest of the coaching staff and the recruiting coordinador?  Are they ok with these tactics or maybe even proposing them?  I know Harbaugh has the final word but I also know he relies heavily on  his staff.  These people have been recruiting for ages, they are experts at this, I can't believe they don't know a better way to handle this kind of situations.

Wolverine In Iowa 68

January 26th, 2016 at 9:19 AM ^

While some fans may worship Harbaugh, some of us are simply looking at the situation and saying "we don't know the whole story".  We don't know what the kids were told about their offers.  The school/staff can't talk about it until Signing Day.  Period.

The kids have made statements that the media are spinning in one direction with nothing from the other side, because it can't be discussed per NCAA rules.

If I'm wrong for giving the staff the benefit of the doubt, then fine, I'm wrong, and if something IS discovered later, I'll own up that I was wrong.  But I don't think it's bad to review and try to keep a positive impression about my school (class of '91 with Desmond Howard) and hope this is being blown out of proportion by people with an agenda (meaning the media, not so much the students, though I admit they also have a reason to be public to increase their attention levels and stock with other schools).

Not worship, common sense and a hope that things aren't as "bleak" as some outlets might want it to be.

JeemtotheH

January 26th, 2016 at 10:17 AM ^

I am thinking for myself.  And this entire overreaction by Michigan fans is a non-story.  If anything the group think is going on by those who consider this a big deal and are comparing it to SMU, bagmen, and raping children then covering it up.

BluCoast

January 27th, 2016 at 10:48 AM ^

You have invoked Paterno and the horrible events that took place at PSU 2X now. There is no equivalence or comparison of ANY SORT to be made here and your statements are offensive and disturbing. This is a recruiting incident for which neither you nor anyone else on this board has a stitch of factual information to base your opinionated ramblings upon.

And in your case, you don't even make a coherent point, bouncing back and forth from 'this is what I mean' to 'no that is what I mean' to 'that's the point I was trying to make. Were you stoned when you wrote this drivel? Anyhow, maybe just shut the hell up until after signing day and we know what there is to be known.

Still can't believe you mention the Paterno/PSU situation here...Absolutely INAPPROPRIATE on EVERY level!

Gameboy

January 26th, 2016 at 12:02 AM ^

I think his point is perfectly valid. People around here are driking the Kool-Aid a little too hard. Harbaugh is a charismatic figure and has turned around our program. That does not mean that we should be defending everything that he does or keep saying things like "In Harbaugh We Trust". Following somebody blindly no matter what is not healthy and we should be ever vigilent about taking cult of personality too far. Harbaugh is in the wrong here. The crap that he pulled in Stanford that he got away with because lack of attention is not going to pass here. Everytime he pulls shit like this, it is going to leave a bruise to the program in the national stage. He is embarassing us and we should be calling him on it.

Seth

January 26th, 2016 at 12:11 AM ^

We're getting into philosophy now: blind faith is not evil in itself, but it invites evil by making someone else the judge of your moral compass. Amoral, not immoral.

N-E-Way

Mostly I just wanted to point out that using PSU is distracting. There are better examples that don't ignite an immediate "whoa whoa whoa that's not the same!" reaction.

yossarians tree

January 26th, 2016 at 9:53 AM ^

It can look bad, yes, and perhaps it is bad. But we do not know the whole story until after the signing day and even then we may never know it. And if the only prism we can see it through is the various media, we have to take it all with a heavy amount of skepticism all around. As a whole the media are a short-sighted, voracious, amoral, venomous, vengeful, what-have-you-done-for-me lately bunch that gives a whole lot less of a shit than the Michigan staff or anyone else here. The media is a fat slob farting in the dark with spaghetti sauce on his shirt. Even if he's right once in a while.

MGoblu8

January 26th, 2016 at 12:31 AM ^

Great post. I want Michigan to win, but I agree that we can compete without this stuff. We're also going to have to remember all of this when we talk about other coaches' shady recruiting. Maybe it's not the same to some, but others will disagree.

WolvinLA2

January 26th, 2016 at 6:12 AM ^

That's not what he's saying. He's saying that we don't know what the terms of the offer were in the first place. There have been rumblings for months that some of these lower-rated guys didn't have a guaranteed spot, which is likely why Weaver went on an official to Temple a while ago. He knew his spot wasn't secure, and now that's is close to signing day and that's still the case, he's upset about it (which I understand). He thought he had a chance, and now it's clear he does not.

IF that's the case, are we still mad about it? It's unorthodox, but if Harbaugh was upfront about it, and we at least have evidence that he was, does that make it bad?

Former_DC_Buck

January 26th, 2016 at 9:00 AM ^

Or Urban Meyer or (insert your favorite coach to dislike), would you find it objectionable? 

Maybe it is because I come from the Dark Side, but if he was upfront with them, I don't have much of a problem with it.  Especially if it might be a one season thing.  He grabbed a lot of these kids before the season started or got going.  As the season started to exceed expectations he got better plays to show interest.  The probelm is how much did he tell them and when. 

Having been on the revieving end of this with a few girls back in the day, it sucks and I feel for the young men.  But again, how much did they know and when did they know and that is something that can't really be answered at this time.   

WolvinLA2

January 26th, 2016 at 11:07 AM ^

I think when most Michigan fans get upset with things Urban and Saban do, it's because they don't know the whole story. I tend to give all coaches the benefit of the doubt, rival or otherwise, because there's always way more to the story that we never hear. If Urban did exactly this and I knew the whole story, I'm sure I wouldn't find that objectionable.

Even Brian tends to reserve his anger for things like this that happen post-NSD. When these things happen before national signing day, and there's plenty evidence that the kid knew this was coming, I'm not going to get worked up about it. Do I love it? No. Is it good PR? No. However, it doesn't seem to be affecting the numerous other kids interested in signing with us and as well all know, going forward, winning cures all.